Speculation: 2021 Offseason Trade/Free Agency Thread

[nbducksfan19]

If it is my opinion then I should have some conviction about it. Again, no one has convinced me that the current roster has any real upside even with Eichel. Maybe I'm wrong but when you finish with the same number of regulation wins as Buffalo it really is hard to argue that the team has talent. In fact, that seems like a ridiculous position to take. It's only been a month or so since these same fans were groaning through the final games of the season lamenting how bad the team was (yes, the GDT are very illuminating in that regard).

conviction sure, certainty no. If multiple people are calling you out on your arrogance, maybe try looking in the mirror.

as to your second point, I’m not sure I understand what your arguing. Most everyone agrees we lack talent, that is exactly why we are excited about the prospect of adding a superstar… We certainly have much more upside with a 24 year old superstar than with what we have now..

 

[Deuce22]

Fair enough. But wouldn't you want to know if he needs surgery first? And, if so, what the recovery time is? And what the chances are that he can EVER return to his former level of play? Wouldn't those things be worth knowing before giving up 3OA, Comtois, Dostal, Perreault or whatever else is required. How would you feel if the Ducks made that trade and he never played another NHL game? Isn't this the time to show some prudence and caution?

When did I say trade for him without doing our due diligence as far as his health is concerned? Of course if Duck medical people say he's damaged permanently it would be a non-starter.

 

[tomd]

conviction sure, certainty no. If multiple people are calling you out on your arrogance, maybe try looking in the mirror.

as to your second point, I’m not sure I understand what your arguing. Most everyone agrees we lack talent, that is exactly why we are excited about the prospect of adding a superstar… We certainly have much more upside with a 24 year old superstar than with what we have now..

Your opinion is pretty much set in stone so no point discussing further.

 

[tomd]

When did I say trade for him without doing our due diligence as far as his health is concerned? Of course if Duck medical people say he's damaged permanently it would be a non-starter.

Great...then we agree. Damaged goods...no trade.

 

[nbducksfan19]

Fair enough. But wouldn't you want to know if he needs surgery first? And, if so, what the recovery time is? And what the chances are that he can EVER return to his former level of play? Wouldn't those things be worth knowing before giving up 3OA, Comtois, Dostal, Perreault or whatever else is required. How would you feel if the Ducks made that trade and he never played another NHL game? Isn't this the time to show some prudence and caution?

What? Of course the ducks doctors would have these answers before making a trade. If you are advocating we don’t trade eichel without doing our due diligence, then duh (I’m sure everyone agrees with that). That scenario would never happen.

 

[Deuce22]

Great...then we agree. Damaged goods...no trade.

Of course not, unless surgery is thought to be a long term solution. But the price would go down if he's going to miss this coming season.

 

[tomd]

What? Of course the ducks doctors would have these answers before making a trade. If you are advocating we don’t trade eichel without doing our due diligence, then duh (I’m sure everyone agrees with that). That scenario would never happen.

Great...we agree. Damaged goods...no trade.

 

[duxfan1101]

At the end of the day, if we make the trade, it means our team doctors are pretty certain he will make a full recovery. If they are skeptical, then we won't end up making the deal. None of us have any real information, and nobody should be pretending like they do know.

 

[tomd]

Of course not, unless surgery is thought to be a long term solution. But the price would go down if he's going to miss this coming season.

LOL...so you're not willing to pay 3OA, Comtois, etc, etc if he is going to miss all or most of the upcoming season then? Great...we agree.

 

[Duck Off]

Ffs…

alright. Who was the Buffalo media outlet guy mentioning Gibson? Legit? Did he elaborate more on just that Gibby might be involved?

 

[tomd]

Ffs…

alright. Who was the Buffalo media outlet guy mentioning Gibson? Legit? Did he elaborate more on just that Gibby might be involved?

A hack according to a couple of Buffalo posters.

 

[Deuce22]

LOL...so you're not willing to pay 3OA, Comtois, etc, etc if he is going to miss all or most of the upcoming season then? Great...we agree.

I would still be willing to make a trade if the surgery would cause him to miss the season. But would not give up as much to get him.

 

[tomd]

I would still be willing to make a trade if the surgery would cause him to miss the season. But would not give up as much to get him.

Great...we agree. I'd not give up the 3OA or Comtois if he opted for surgery.

 

[bsu]

Great...we agree. I'd not give up the 3OA or Comtois if he opted for surgery.

We know.

 

[Trojans86]

Great...we agree. I'd not give up the 3OA or Comtois if he opted for surgery.

Bud, you have got to learn how to let things go and communicate with respect. It is okay for someone to have a different oppinion.

 

[nbducksfan19]

Great...we agree. Damaged goods...no trade.

Did you honestly think people were advocating for trading for eichel when we either a) know he is damaged goods or b) have no idea what is injury status is?

No one was arguing that. People were arguing your delusions that you were certain getting eichel was a “movie you had seen before” and we were doomed to being the kings (or worse).

 

[tomd]

Bud, you have got to learn how to let things go and communicate with respect. It is okay for someone to have a different oppinion.

Ever feel that as the person voicing the unpopular opinion I feel like I've been attacked? Think about it.

 

[tomd]

Did you honestly think people were advocating for trading for eichel when we either a) know he is damaged goods or b) have no idea what is injury status is?

No one was arguing that. People were arguing your delusions that you were certain getting eichel was a “movie you had seen before” and we were doomed to being the kings (or worse).

And I stand by those statements. If you disagree, fine. I think you're dead wrong and you think the same about me. Agree to disagree.

 

[nbducksfan19]

Great...we agree. I'd not give up the 3OA or Comtois if he opted for surgery.

Thats a fair take, although one that I disagree with. If the doctors feel the surgery would almost certainly lead to full recovery then eichel>>> comtois or 3rd overall IMO.

 

[nbducksfan19]

And I stand by those statements. If you disagree, fine. I think you're dead wrong and you think the same about me. Agree to disagree.

That’s the difference between me and you and why people are having an issue with your posts.

I don’t think you are dead wrong; you may even be right. I think it’s worth the risk (depending on what our doctors determine and what we give up), but I have no idea how it plays out.

 

[tomd]

Thats a fair take, although one that I disagree with. If the doctors feel the surgery would almost certainly lead to full recovery then eichel>>> comtois or 3rd overall IMO.

Fair enough. I suspect that several (most?) teams might drop out of the bidding knowing he would miss a great deal of the season. Most teams probably aren't keen on spending $10 million this year for a player not playing. Insurance may not cover the salary either since it was a known condition.

I think if Eichel opts for surgery then Buffalo won't find any takers until the off-season but before his NMC kicks in. And that might be best for all parties. Time will tell. Really not worth discussing further until more medical facts are in.

 

[tomd]

That’s the difference between me and you and why people are having an issue with your posts.

I don’t think you are dead wrong; you may even be right. I think it’s worth the risk (depending on what our doctors determine and what we give up), but I have no idea how it plays out.

I've followed the Kings since the 70s and I've seen many many times their attempts at shortcutting the building process. It has left me jaded for sure. I just don't want the same thing to happen to the Ducks and I'm pretty passionate about that. For those who have never gone through a Rick Martin or Jerry Korab or Ron Grahame or Larry Murphy trade it may not resonate. What the Kings are going through right now is not pleasant either and they've put themselves in an interesting position with Doughty and Kopitar. Raised expectations and lack of patience can often lead to some very bad decisions.

We both want what's best for the team but we have very different ideas about how to get there. I've tried to give facts (I assume you saw my list of the roster and the ages) and I've been met with rhetoric in response. Lesson learned.

 

[nbducksfan19]

Your cherry picked “facts” to support a jaded opinion are no more valuable then the “rhetoric” you recieved.

You are no more qualified to project what will be best for the ducks then others on this board, Maybe that should be your lesson learned … (and no I couldn’t give a rip if you have watched the kings since the 70’s or the the 1700’s).

 

[Bergey37]

I have pretty much stayed out of this fracas because most of it seems little more than picking at each other and a good deal of mental masturbation. In my own mind I can simplify the situation to this:

1) The org and its doctors HAVE to be satisfied that the treatment Eichel wants will lead to a recovery in a reasonable time that will enable him to play hockey at a high level, even if it's not quite where he was before. Without that there's no deal. Of course it's not a certainty, that's why he's available; but you can't take on a $50M obligation on a hope and a prayer. I think we all recognize that the org knows this.

2) Assuming then that the test in #1 can be met, then what do you pay? For me at the end of the day, if I get Jack Eichel I want him and our other star center to have some competent people to play with. We currently have four (4) top-6 FWs: Raks, Comtois, Zegras and Rico. It is VERY possible that we lose Rico in the ED if not protected, leaving us with 3. Sent 1 or 2 to BUF for JE and what's left? That's why for me none of our top 4 forwards can be part of this deal. Is JE > MC? Of course. Is he > Raks? No question. JE > (insert Duck player name)? But if we lose a good FW to get Eichel, we compromise both him and Zegras. Don't want to do that.

3) So that means 3OA plus lesser players/prospects. If that can be done, great. But that tweet about Gibby in the conversation popped up to me as perhaps the least hurtful of options that can get the deal done. Don't know if Gibby is the source of the dissension in the room that's been alluded to, but if he is it's a reason for a ticket out of town. Then @Static made a good point about the variability of goaltender performance. Which Gibby do we have, the one who once stood on his head, or the one who too frequently doesn't have his head in the game? Maybe he can be replaced with a 1A -1B of Freddy and Stolarz for example.

At the end of the day, having a Jack Eichel who can play makes us better; but he makes us MUCH better if there are competent guys for him AND Zegras to play with. The Gibby option makes that possible, and it doesn't gut the rest of the team.

 

[tomd]

Your cherry picked “facts” to support a jaded opinion are no more valuable then the “rhetoric” you recieved.

You are no more qualified to project what will be best for the ducks then others on this board, Maybe that should be your lesson learned … (and no I couldn’t give a rip if you have watched the kings since the 70’s or the the 1700’s).

Be nice...you're getting a little overheated now and sounding a bit arrogant.