HF Habs: 2020 Montreal Canadiens Off-Season Thread

[waffledave]

No to Hall. Talented guy but he has never been able to consistently put it all together.

 

[Fazkovsky]

No to Hall. Talented guy but he has never been able to consistently put it all together.

i guess his hart trophy doesn’t agree with you

 

[Benstheman]

You're overrating Brodin who's played most of his career behind one of the league's best, Ryan Suter. Brodin is strong defensively, on a second pairing.

Also, he hasn't been much productive until last season. You count it as a new norm, when it could simply be a blip on the radar, a career year never to be matched again.

Brodin plays the same minutes as Suter, except for the PP. Don't know the exact advanced stats but i'm pretty confident Brodin and Suter split 5 on 5 time against top opposition, depending on the kind of opposite team.

Also, Brodin just entered his prime years and had that kind of production 2 years ago also.

Anyway, not trying to sell him as a high end offensive dman. But he is far from a black hole offensively and he would be a big upgrade on Chiarot.

 

[le_sean]

On a very weak team

Mete and Brodin at the same age had the exact same output. Brodin has size over Mete, but Mete is a notch higher in transition play.

Please stop talking about dmen. You're absolutely clueless.

It's as simple as Mete and his size not being able to handle big minutes against top opponents for a full season. He's not able to win board battles, he's not able to win net front battles or box players out.

I get people want to love Mete because of his skating, but a 5'9 defensive defenceman is always going to be limited. He can't be on a top pairing, it's just never going to work. Brodin can.

 

[MSLs absurd thighs]

Agree with you here...I personally don't think the Habs are going to be able to acquire that all-purpose LHD.

They're not getting Provorov or Heiskanen, etc.

OEL is rumored to be on the block every year. If he moves the price will be astronomical and I think his arrow is pointing down.

He's the Olli Jokinen/Patrick Marleau of 2020. I remember those two were ALWAYS rumoured to be on the move between the years 2005 and 2010. Of course, at the time, Habs fans were laughing at the idea of trading Higgins for one of them.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

It's as simple as Mete and his size not being able to handle big minutes against top opponents for a full season. He's not able to win board battles, he's not able to win net front battles or box players out.

I get people want to love Mete because of his skating, but a 5'9 defensive defenceman is always going to be limited. He can't be on a top pairing, it's just never going to work. Brodin can.

That wasn't the point.

Brodin can work with Weber on a top pairing, but a Brodin-Petry would get demolished in a full season. Brodin's been playing behind Suter. Two points I wanted to make, people thinking Brodin is a top pairing D are wrong, he is in an ideal situation, like many others like Mete. Second point is, absolutisms like you used (will never work) is highly pretentious, it's overused by many posters and just shows you can't look pass your preconceptions.

Two different issues being interwined because people don't follow up on posts.

1-Brodin is not a sureshot on the 1st pairing. Brodin will not fix our biggest weakness on defense.

2- Mete is underrated, isn't finished progressing and everything he's done so far has him in line with many dman who became valuable.

I'm not saying I'd use Mete on the first pairing. If you actually read the posts before, I'm simply giving caution OVER BRODIN. If you want to respond to that instead of a strawman, fine, but if not, refrain from replying to me.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

Brodin plays the same minutes as Suter, except for the PP. Don't know the exact advanced stats but i'm pretty confident Brodin and Suter split 5 on 5 time against top opposition, depending on the kind of opposite team.

Also, Brodin just entered his prime years and had that kind of production 2 years ago also.

Anyway, not trying to sell him as a high end offensive dman. But he is far from a black hole offensively and he would be a big upgrade on Chiarot.

Sure he'd be an upgrade on Chiarot.

And no, Suter gets the brunt of the top opposition. Always has and still does. They play the same minutes, but Suter gets the tougher matchups.

Luckily we have Weber, but for how long? Once Weber's not as effective, Brodin won't be enough. And a top pairing of Brodin Petry is just laughable.

 

[waffledave]

i guess his hart trophy doesn’t agree with you

Jose Theodore has one of those too.

 

[le_sean]

That wasn't the point.

Brodin can work with Weber on a top pairing, but a Brodin-Petry would get demolished in a full season. Brodin's been playing behind Suter. Two points I wanted to make, people thinking Brodin is a top pairing D are wrong, he is in an ideal situation, like many others like Mete. Second point is, absolutisms like you used (will never work) is highly pretentious, it's overused by many posters and just shows you can't look pass your preconceptions.

Two different issues being interwined because people don't follow up on posts.

1-Brodin is not a sureshot on the 1st pairing. Brodin will not fix our biggest weakness on defense.

2- Mete is underrated, isn't finished progressing and everything he's done so far has him in line with many dman who became valuable.

I'm not saying I'd use Mete on the first pairing. If you actually read the posts before, I'm simply giving caution OVER BRODIN. If you want to respond to that instead of a strawman, fine, but if not, refrain from replying to me.

I replied to a post where you compared Brodin and Mete, with the suggestion that Mete could become like Brodin because they had the same output at the same age. That Mete's transition play is better. I'm giving you a reason why Brodin is much more effective than Mete and always will be. If you can find me 5 examples of 5'9 defenders that provide no offence being consistent Top 4 defenders, I'd be glad to see it.

You also claim that Brodin-Petry would get destroyed. Based on what exactly? Petry helps makes Kulak look good. Brodin is twice the player he is. Brodin looks good with Dumba who is just a worse Petry.

And in that same post you insulted a guy because you disagreed with him, so take your own advice.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

Yes it is. Weber and Chiarot played too much and it shows in the season. They looked better in the playoffs because of a long break. But that situation won't happen again. At least i hope not.

The D was abysmal already at mid-season. I'm sorry but if we are to not rebuild and try to be competitive with Weber and Price, we better get them help right now.

What? Chariot and Weber (after a slow start), looked great all year.

 

[Vachon23]

Except Brodin is one of the good PMD in the league and his 5 on 5 pts production was on par with Weber's and Petry's last year. Now if you want a PP quaterback on top of having all the quality of Brodin, well, good luck. There are none disponible, except Pietrangelo. But we all know we stand no chance of signing him.

I think alote here never saw Brodin play... He's a stud on the transition

 

[Archijerej]

The D was abysmal already at mid-season. I'm sorry but if we are to not rebuild and try to be competitive with Weber and Price, we better get them help right now.

I would add that Brodin, on top of being an immediate help, still qualifies as a rebuilding move as he would still be effective when Suzuki/Kotkaniemi enter their prime.

But of course Minnesota is not going to trade him for Max frigging Domi.

 

[FrankMTL]

That wasn't the point.

Brodin can work with Weber on a top pairing, but a Brodin-Petry would get demolished in a full season. Brodin's been playing behind Suter. Two points I wanted to make, people thinking Brodin is a top pairing D are wrong, he is in an ideal situation, like many others like Mete. Second point is, absolutisms like you used (will never work) is highly pretentious, it's overused by many posters and just shows you can't look pass your preconceptions.

Two different issues being interwined because people don't follow up on posts.

1-Brodin is not a sureshot on the 1st pairing. Brodin will not fix our biggest weakness on defense.

2- Mete is underrated, isn't finished progressing and everything he's done so far has him in line with many dman who became valuable.

I'm not saying I'd use Mete on the first pairing. If you actually read the posts before, I'm simply giving caution OVER BRODIN. If you want to respond to that instead of a strawman, fine, but if not, refrain from replying to me.

I agree with the bolded. I think Mete still has some untapped offensive potential. I don't know if he'll ever get 40 points a year, but I think 30 points is definitely possible. Jared Spurgeon is a good comparable minus the shot but I think that Mete may eventually be able to score 8-10 goals a year just on plays around the net when he joins the rush. He's only 22 and still has time figure it out.

 

[Ozmodiar]

Brodin-Petry would get demolished in a full season

I don’t think so.

petry is solid offensively.
Brodin is solid defensively.

both excellent skaters.

They could stay together on the PK, where Mete or Kulak would be bad.

 

[Ozmodiar]

I think alote here never saw Brodin play... He's a stud on the transition

I think you’re right.

Also good when the other team has the puck in transition.

 

[Kriss E]

If we're arguing that Hall and Tatar are equivalent let's not talk.

As for Domi, do you think he's staying? Him sucking in the playoffs and now changing agents. Sounds like he's gone.

A core of hall, weber, oel, price

Then big side pieces gallagher, petry

The big potentials kotka, suzuki

Above average danault, drouin

I think on paper its 100% a contender

I'm not saying Hall and Tatar are equivalent, obviously one has way more potential. I compared their production alone. Potential is useless if you don't actually reach it. So Taylor Hall can be an 80-90pt player, if all he does here is score 55-65pts like he's done for most of his career, then it doesn't really matter.
Hall scored 52pts this year, Tatar had 61. The previous year, Hall had 37. I look at those numbers.
If he comes here and puts up 90, awesome, if he scores 55pts, well that's not better than Tatar.

And again, you also lose Domi who still produces his fair share. So no, I don't think we necessarily get better.

As for us being contenders, again, I disagree. Boston for instance...Rask..Chara..Krug..McAvoy..Marchard...Pasta..Bergeron...
Tampa....Vasi..Stamkos..Point..Kuch..Hedman..Serg..Mcdo...I mean, they lose Stamkos and they're still considered contenders.
The Caps...Carlsson...Holtby..Ovi..Kuz...Backstrom..Orlov...


So like I said...I wouldn't even put us as contenders if we brought in those two guys, and we would likely struggle whenever Hall gets injured, and he will, the guy only played 82 games once.

 

[ahmedou]

TSN690 The Morning Show (20/09/01) - Dumont: Habs off season decisions (Audio)

From canadiens.com, Marc Dumont, on the Habs off season and what decisions await them (Domi, Ekman-Larsson, Gallagher, Laine, etc).

 

[Gravity]

You need a full roster to win. Toronto has 5 players. Montreal is deep.

How is it comparable? When Toronto has arguably no elite D and we would have Weber and OEl. And Petry as a number 3

It's comparable because we would be taking on more and more overpaid vets when we aren't even ready to compete yet.

 

[waffledave]

Jake Allen

 

[Kriss E]

I don't consider it worth the attention. Depth moves that don't cost the future bud. You tried to make this a big deal.

And then you claim that you won an argument? .

They're bad players. It's pretty freaking simple. (MOD) Anyone else can simply admit, ya...Bergey brought shitty players in too.
Nobody ever argued it cost us the future, that they were problems, etc. That's all in your head.

Don't remember... Did you compare Radulov to Semin back when we first signed him? Bet you did and you ignore that part and focus on Bergevin not extending him instead.

No I didn't. I was pleased with the signing of Radulov. Stick to the facts and stop inventing things.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I think alote here never saw Brodin play... He's a stud on the transition

Agreed. Part of our herd is overlooking Brodin. Not flashy in terms of offense but he's still only heading into his age 27 season and he actually took a step forward on offense this year. The things he does without the puck? Some don't understand that value

 

[The Great Weal]

Mete is similar to Brodin. Well except for the fact that Brodin is one of the best shutdown dmen in the entire league. Besides that they are identical.

 

[26Mats]

TSN690 The Morning Show (20/09/01) - Dumont: Habs off season decisions (Audio)

Thanks for posting

 

[26Mats]

Kovalchuk Kotkaniemi Suzuki
Drouin Domi(on a 1 year deal) ufaWinger
Tatar Danault Gallagher
Lehkonen Evans Armia

Byron moved for cap space.

 

[BLONG7]

Jake Allen

Thought we would have gone the ufa route..........MB helps St Louis keep Pieterangelo.....