Prospect Info: 2020-2021 Prospects Thread

[McFlyingV]

I'm not saying that Nurse's shot was elite, I'm saying that he had a big shot. It stood out when watching his highlight packages, he could wire it but as you said, he was inconsistent with the accuracy.

Anyway, we agree on Broberg. That's what I see as his likely role in his prime, a swift skating 2nd pairing defenseman or perhaps if he reaches full potential, a #2 alongside an elite Dman like JBo was in St. Louis.

That was kind of my point though is it only showed up in the highlight packages. In the actual games I watched of him at the time he wouldn't just struggle with accuracy, he would struggle with actually getting all of the puck, and it's something he struggled with early on in the NHL as well. He'd shoot a lot of muffins because he simply just missed the puck cleanly. That part of his game grew enormously and thats part of the reason why I don't like putting major limitations on young prospects because some of them turn obvious weaknesses into strengths.

I do like the JBo comparison a lot tbh, and I think that role would fit very well in the current NHL. Having speed and size on the back end to retrieve pucks before a forecheck can be established and get them moving out of the zone is probably one of the most important aspects I look for in a 2-way D right now. That type of D has given the Oilers fits for a while now and completely kills our offensive guys when they can't establish O-zone possession. It leads to McDavid trying to go 1 on 4 over and over and over again and spending 80% of the game in our own zone. Imo thats a massive need for the Oilers on the back end, and it's why a guy like Hampus Lindholm (and the Ducks D in general) gave us so many issues over the years when Anaheim wasn't shit.

 

[belair]

#1D? Klefbom hasn't been the Oilers #1D for a while now, even before he got injured.

Anyway, if the Oilers had Zegras, perhaps they wouldn't be forced to sign RNH because they have nobody in the system ready to jump into the top 6 next season.
Then again, maybe they don't take Holloway in this draft and take Guhle instead if Zegras was already in the fold so who knows.

Kris Letang, Roman Josi, Drew Doughty, Thomas Chabot.

Those are the only players who played more per game than Oscar Klefbom last season. Primary EV, PK and PP roles. He's a #1 defenseman.

Furthermore, on what planet is Zegras supplanting RNH for his role? He's not even an NHL regular in Anaheim. Zegras would be added depth, but he'd be in the same position Dylan Holloway is today.

 

[McDNicks17]

This is obviously an over-exaggeration. He has hockey skills and can play hockey, he just doesn't have a refined skillset and doesn't have one clear end of the ice that he's clearly elite in. For Nurse that was the defensive end in junior and his one-on-one defending.

Broberg at this point is likely to be a 2-way guy who isn't really elite, but good in both zones if he fine tunes a few things. There's always the potential that his hands and O-zone processor catch up with his feet and he takes off offensively, but it's far from a given. What I do see him likely doing very well at the NHL level is his defending off the rush and ability to skate pucks out of trouble in terms of controlled zone exits. A good puck retrieval Dman who can handle a fast forecheck.

If anything I see him becoming a lot like Klefbom in that he's a 2-way guy who is a top 3D and isn't elite on defence or offence, but is a quality dman. Albeit his skillset is a bit different from Klefbom.

Yeah, it's hyperbole, but those types of players have to improve in so many aspects just to be an NHL player that that's what it feels like.

Nurse was an absolute monster defensively by the end of his second post-draft season. One of the best to play in the CHL in quite a while. Broberg is still kind of just a hunk of clay that hasn't really taken the shape of anything yet.

Broberg still not really even being competent at either end worries me. You can make an NHL career off being good in the neutral zone with exits and entries, but those guys usually run out of chances and flame out more often than not.

With what's happened to Klefbom, that pick is looking a lot better today. I can't understand why people would still be crying for Zegras knowing that our #1D could potentially be done playing professional hockey.

If they made the pick based on need, it makes it even worse in my eyes.

 

[North]

If they made the pick based on need, it makes it even worse in my eyes.

Didn’t the Klefbom issue happen after the pick was made?

 

[CupofOil]

Kris Letang, Roman Josi, Drew Doughty, Thomas Chabot.

Those are the only players who played more per game than Oscar Klefbom last season. Primary EV, PK and PP roles. He's a #1 defenseman.

Furthermore, on what planet is Zegras supplanting RNH for his role? He's not even an NHL regular in Anaheim. Zegras would be added depth, but he'd be in the same position Dylan Holloway is today.

Klefbom didn't take the primary EV strength minutes last season as the season wore on. His minutes were heavily inflated by the ridiculous amount of PP minutes that he and the top unit logged.
Nurse is playing the same amount of minutes without #1 PP unit minutes and Klefbom will never play those minutes again, at least here, so it's irrelevant going forward.

As far as Zegras is concerned, if they had him knocking on the door, there would likely be less urgency to sign RNH. He's further along than Holloway, plays a different role, and will almost certainly start next season with the Ducks.
Anyway, it is what it is. No use crying over spilled milk anymore.

 

[alphahelix]

Didn’t the Klefbom issue happen after the pick was made?

It depends how you define “issue” in this case. His shoulder had issues in his draft year and it just degraded from there.

 

[North]

It depends how you define “issue” in this case. His shoulder had issues in his draft year and it just degraded from there.

From what I recall yes Klefbom had issues but the severity of it was realized around the playins which was after Broberg was drafted.

 

[OiledUp]

It depends how you define “issue” in this case. His shoulder had issues in his draft year and it just degraded from there.

He injured his shoulder crashing into an open dasher board door in his D+1 year and it's been an issue since, getting aggrevated over the years.

 

[Aerchon]

Klefbom didn't take the primary EV strength minutes last season as the season wore on. His minutes were heavily inflated by the ridiculous amount of PP minutes that he and the top unit logged.
Nurse is playing the same amount of minutes without #1 PP unit minutes and Klefbom will never play those minutes again, at least here, so it's irrelevant going forward.

As far as Zegras is concerned, if they had him knocking on the door, there would likely be less urgency to sign RNH. He's further along than Holloway, plays a different role, and will almost certainly start next season with the Ducks.
Anyway, it is what it is. No use crying over spilled milk anymore.

It's a hockey board, without spilled milk crying half the posts on here would be gone.

I agree with the is what it is philosophy and that nothing obviously can be done but...

Zegras was the clear cut best pick by a long shot. If he was not on the board Holland wouldn't have looked like he was reaching for a player he really liked personally.

Even with Zegras off the board Broberg was a reach imo, but with him there... it "looks" pretty f***ing stupid to me.

Hopefully Holland is right, that's why he gets paid the big bucks. It was a poor pick for many different reasons IMO and Broberg currently is not tracking great but there is still lots of runway before we know what seemed obvious to all us arm chair GMs.

 

[Oilhawks]

From what I recall yes Klefbom had issues but the severity of it was realized around the playins which was after Broberg was drafted.

I imagine the org was much more aware of the extent of Klefbom’s issue than we as fans were at the time of Broberg’s selection. I see the Broberg pick as wanting to have a replacement for Klefbom in a few years if his shoulder got worse. It was expedited after the play in’s though, a few years earlier than they were planning for.

 

[Canovin]

I imagine the org was much more aware of the extent of Klefbom’s issue than we as fans were at the time of Broberg’s selection. I see the Broberg pick as wanting to have a replacement for Klefbom in a few years if his shoulder got worse. It was expedited after the play in’s though, a few years earlier than they were planning for.

Surprised the org didn't see the RNH replacement in Zegras

 

[Oilhawks]

Surprised the org didn't see the RNH replacement in Zegras

I don’t see it either, and I like Zegras and think RNH is overrated.

Edit 1: If I’m drafting to replace a top 4D (who was a top pairing D at his peak), or drafting to replace a top 6 LW or 2C, I’m going for replacing the D

Edit 2: I still doubt Zegras wouldn’t have tried the college loophole here, or at least gone the Trouba route. But that’s just the vibes I get from him

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Wait until Broberg comes overseas before writing his career obituary. There is lots to like with the player and IMO he'll be a very good defenseman for us for many years to come. We just need to make sure that he isn't Klefbom'd, IMO he should've been shut down for awhile after the WJC's.

 

[voxel]

At the draft I wanted Zegras too but now that I've seen a bunch of 2019 draftees in the AHL I want Boldy. He's what Holloway should be (if a winger) and is somebody who can play at all situations without you worrying about him. Zegras is very much like Johnny Gaudreau IMO. The offense is elite but if he doesn't get a lot stronger he's mostly a PP specialist who can be shutdown at ES.

 

[Oilhawks]

Wait until Broberg comes overseas before writing his career obituary. There is lots to like with the player and IMO he'll be a very good defenseman for us for many years to come. We just need to make sure that he isn't Klefbom'd, IMO he should've been shut down for awhile after the WJC's.

Agreed. I don’t remember there being as much hand wringing over Klefbom but I guess not many fans expected much of anything.

 

[Canovin]

At the draft I wanted Zegras too but now that I've seen a bunch of 2019 draftees in the AHL I want Boldy. He's what Holloway should be (if a winger) and is somebody who can play at all situations without you worrying about him. Zegras is very much like Johnny Gaudreau IMO. The offense is elite but if he doesn't get a lot stronger he's mostly a PP specialist who can be shutdown at ES.

The Oilers drafted Broberg and he seems to be a good kid so I've been supporting him and hoping he will eventually figure it out but let's not kid ourselves. The Oilers could use a Johnny Gaudreau who is 4" taller and plays C. For as much flake as Gaudreau gets for being a Flames, he's more than a PP specialist. He has 314 ES points in 511 games while carrying Horcoff 2.0

 

[voxel]

The Oilers drafted Broberg and he seems to be a good kid so I've been supporting him and hoping he will eventually figure it out but let's not kid ourselves. The Oilers could use a Johnny Gaudreau who is 4" taller and plays C. For as much flake as Gaudreau gets for being a Flames, he's more than a PP specialist. He has 314 ES points in 511 games while carrying Horcoff 2.0

Zegras is just learning to play C in the AHL. He played wing in college and the AHL/NHL until maybe the last half-dozen games.

Sure I would like a JG but I would want a young Vorachek instead.

 

[McFlyingV]

At the draft I wanted Zegras too but now that I've seen a bunch of 2019 draftees in the AHL I want Boldy. He's what Holloway should be (if a winger) and is somebody who can play at all situations without you worrying about him. Zegras is very much like Johnny Gaudreau IMO. The offense is elite but if he doesn't get a lot stronger he's mostly a PP specialist who can be shutdown at ES.

I like Holloway over Boldy because of the significant gap in skating. I do agree with Zegras though he is highly skilled but he gets knocked off the puck at the first sign of a light breeze. There's far from a guarantee that he will overcome that to reach his offensive potential. I also don't really think Edmonton needs anymore pass first soft players. We could really use a competitive sniper in the top 6.

As for Broberg and many of the criticisms of him. The one issue I have is people saying he doesn't have an elite quality, all he can do is skate. Maybe it's just me, but skating in my mind has become arguably one of if not the most important attributes of a Dman in the current NHL, and to be able to skate like that at 6'3 is not something to scoff at.

 

[McFlyingV]

The Oilers drafted Broberg and he seems to be a good kid so I've been supporting him and hoping he will eventually figure it out but let's not kid ourselves. The Oilers could use a Johnny Gaudreau who is 4" taller and plays C. For as much flake as Gaudreau gets for being a Flames, he's more than a PP specialist. He has 314 ES points in 511 games while carrying Horcoff 2.0

Are you sure that's the type of player the Oilers need though? Yes I'd love to put more skill in the line up, but I want it to be skill that can actually produce come playoff time and play decent on both sides of the puck. I want it to be skill that can actually win puck battles and protect pucks. Right now Zegras only brings the skill aspect. He may grow his game and get bigger and stronger, but as of right now despite his obvious skill he doesn't exactly look like what the Oilers need. The Oilers need some more 2-way forwards who can put the puck in the net and win puck battles. They need a goalie for the future. And they need to continue to round out their defence.

Just my opinion, but when you already have arguably the 2 best offensive forwards in the league, you shouldn't be worrying about adding another soft offensive player.

 

[McJadeddog]

Agreed. I don’t remember there being as much hand wringing over Klefbom but I guess not many fans expected much of anything.

The big difference is draft position. Klefbom was a mid-1st rounder, and Broberg was inside the top-10. The optics of that are fairly different, rightly or wrongly.

 

[Oilhawks]

The big difference is draft position. Klefbom was a mid-1st rounder, and Broberg was inside the top-10. The optics of that are fairly different, rightly or wrongly.

This fan base should know better considering a 3rd overall has vastly outperformed 3 1st overalls on this team alone

 

[McDNicks17]

Wait until Broberg comes overseas before writing his career obituary. There is lots to like with the player and IMO he'll be a very good defenseman for us for many years to come. We just need to make sure that he isn't Klefbom'd, IMO he should've been shut down for awhile after the WJC's.

I'm not writing him off, but it's getting harder and harder to give him the benefit of the doubt as time goes on. He was drafted as a big guy who can skate and not much else and, two seasons later, he's a big guy who can skate and not much else.

He needs to find an identity ASAP and start excelling at it or he's never going to be more than a frustrating bottom pairing guy, IMO.

 

[Fourier]

I'm not writing him off, but it's getting harder and harder to give him the benefit of the doubt as time goes on. He was drafted as a big guy who can skate and not much else and, two seasons later, he's a big guy who can skate and not much else.

He needs to find an identity ASAP and start excelling at it or he's never going to be more than a frustrating bottom pairing guy, IMO.

I think he could still turn into a very good player. But he is an asset that I would be willing to move because I think his potential would carry significant value and I think the other left side pospects are good enough to take the risk.

 

[belair]

Surprised the org didn't see the RNH replacement in Zegras

I'm surprised that fans were apparently prepared to throw away RNH and waste a top ten pick on a player to be used to 'replace' a completely healthy player in his prime.

I look forward to having a 22 year old Broberg available to us for two seasons on an ELC when Darnell Nurse gets his raise.

 

[McFlyingV]

I'm not writing him off, but it's getting harder and harder to give him the benefit of the doubt as time goes on. He was drafted as a big guy who can skate and not much else and, two seasons later, he's a big guy who can skate and not much else.

He needs to find an identity ASAP and start excelling at it or he's never going to be more than a frustrating bottom pairing guy, IMO.

The problem with this analysis is that there isn't a single bottom pairing D in the league who skates like Broberg at that size. To completely diminish the importance of a skating/size combo for a Dman in the current NHL is a bit much. We're also acting as if the rest of his tools are all below average for a prospect. They aren't. Does he have an elite trait outside of his skating/size combo? No, but his other tools are all far better than he is given credit for. That doesn't mean they aren't without flaws or areas that he needs to improve on, but he's not even 20 years old. Again, my biggest issue with the criticisms of him are people stating he needs to show an elite quality, and then totally ignore his elite skating/size combo. If anyone can show me a bottom 6 NHLer who lacks elite traits in other areas, but who is 6'3+ and a top 3% skater in the league I will gladly listen.