2019-2020 Laval Rocket & ECHL Thread II
- Thread starter Adam Michaels
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ahmedou
DOU
- Oct 7, 2017
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#14/02/20(Game52:Rocket1-3WolfPack)
Hudon(-1)/Kotkaniemi(-1)/Lynch
Peca/Poehling(-2)/Barber(1G-2)
Varone(1A-1)/Vejdemo/Alain
Veilleux/Dauphin(-1)/Waked
Alzner/Fleury(-1)
Leskinen(-1)/Brook(-1)
Olofsson(1A)/Lamarche
Primeau(23/25)
#16/02/20(Game53:Rocket0-3Bruins)
Dauphin(-1)/Kotkaniemi(-1)/Lynch
Hudon/Poehling(-1)/Alain(-1)
Veilleux(-1)/Vejdemo(-1)/Waked
Pezzetta/Peca
Alzner/Fleury(-1)
Leskinen/Brook
Olofsson(-1)/Lamarche(-1)
McEneny(-1)
Primeau(27/30)
Hudon(-1)/Kotkaniemi(-1)/Lynch
Peca/Poehling(-2)/Barber(1G-2)
Varone(1A-1)/Vejdemo/Alain
Veilleux/Dauphin(-1)/Waked
Alzner/Fleury(-1)
Leskinen(-1)/Brook(-1)
Olofsson(1A)/Lamarche
Primeau(23/25)
#16/02/20(Game53:Rocket0-3Bruins)
Dauphin(-1)/Kotkaniemi(-1)/Lynch
Hudon/Poehling(-1)/Alain(-1)
Veilleux(-1)/Vejdemo(-1)/Waked
Pezzetta/Peca
Alzner/Fleury(-1)
Leskinen/Brook
Olofsson(-1)/Lamarche(-1)
McEneny(-1)
Primeau(27/30)
DAChampion
Registered User
- May 28, 2011
- 29,796
- 20,951
The past few games have been really disappointing. Brook is mostly invisible, Fleury is a one-way dman, Poehling is invisible, etc.
Kotkaniemi looks like he's one step top weak. He can skate with the puck but not claim the zone, and his passes don't turn into chances unless he passes to Hudon.
On the power play, they can pass along the external perimeter, but they cannot break through the inner diamond of opposing dmen and create a presence near the net.
But the whole team seems to come alive in the last five minutes of games.
I trust (hope) that this is a slump, and that things will improve.
ETA: I expect Evans and Folin to help, but they shouldn't be necessary.
Kotkaniemi looks like he's one step top weak. He can skate with the puck but not claim the zone, and his passes don't turn into chances unless he passes to Hudon.
On the power play, they can pass along the external perimeter, but they cannot break through the inner diamond of opposing dmen and create a presence near the net.
But the whole team seems to come alive in the last five minutes of games.
I trust (hope) that this is a slump, and that things will improve.
ETA: I expect Evans and Folin to help, but they shouldn't be necessary.
Andrei79
Registered User
- Jan 25, 2013
- 15,242
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I hope they put Evans back with KK and Hudon. That was a dominant line.
montreal
Go Habs Go
I turned off Sunday's game as the feed was pissing me off and I was taking a bit of a break from hockey as I'm getting a bit of baseball fever now that spring training has started.
I really hope that this was just a slump but Bouchard just threw down and I don't know if that is going to work or make things worse as those vets all know they likely aren't going to be back next year with this organization. That said they are playing for contracts and hopefully get the message.
Laval returns home for the next 3 games, wed-fri-sat vs the moose for 2 and then a huge must win game vs the Marlies. They must start winning some games and get this shit turned around now before it's too late. As their next 3 after that they go on the road for a really tough trio in the Sens, Rochester and Utica. The Sens just own us and Primeau especially but at some point we got to beat those f***ers.
Poehling has been invisible once again since being sent down, I pointed it out in the Timmins thread how I hate how management has handled him and how he's looked invisible after each time he's been sent down. The f***ing MB special once again, call up a 20 year old prospect too soon, put them on the 4th line, they end up in the press box, then they end up back in the AHL where they struggle. How many times do I have to see that movie? These f***ers never learn to just leave the kids alone until they are ready.
Fleury has been terrible in his own end since coming down, what they hell did they have him working on in the NHL as his decisions have been very poor at times. I do like his play on the PP but hasn't yielded much yet.
Brook for the most part has looked much better then the first month or so of the season but that shows why I had to drop him so much in my rankings as his play and decision making in his own end was a nightmare and now while better he's just not doing anywhere near enough that a player of his skill level should be doing.
Getting Vejdemo back helps, hopefully he's 100% but getting your leading scorer should be a nice boost and Folin was playing pretty solid hockey before he got called up last time. But now we have a veteran rule problem again. Will be very interesting to see who sits, Veilleux again I'm guessing.
I really hope that this was just a slump but Bouchard just threw down and I don't know if that is going to work or make things worse as those vets all know they likely aren't going to be back next year with this organization. That said they are playing for contracts and hopefully get the message.
Laval returns home for the next 3 games, wed-fri-sat vs the moose for 2 and then a huge must win game vs the Marlies. They must start winning some games and get this shit turned around now before it's too late. As their next 3 after that they go on the road for a really tough trio in the Sens, Rochester and Utica. The Sens just own us and Primeau especially but at some point we got to beat those f***ers.
Poehling has been invisible once again since being sent down, I pointed it out in the Timmins thread how I hate how management has handled him and how he's looked invisible after each time he's been sent down. The f***ing MB special once again, call up a 20 year old prospect too soon, put them on the 4th line, they end up in the press box, then they end up back in the AHL where they struggle. How many times do I have to see that movie? These f***ers never learn to just leave the kids alone until they are ready.
Fleury has been terrible in his own end since coming down, what they hell did they have him working on in the NHL as his decisions have been very poor at times. I do like his play on the PP but hasn't yielded much yet.
Brook for the most part has looked much better then the first month or so of the season but that shows why I had to drop him so much in my rankings as his play and decision making in his own end was a nightmare and now while better he's just not doing anywhere near enough that a player of his skill level should be doing.
Getting Vejdemo back helps, hopefully he's 100% but getting your leading scorer should be a nice boost and Folin was playing pretty solid hockey before he got called up last time. But now we have a veteran rule problem again. Will be very interesting to see who sits, Veilleux again I'm guessing.
Adam Michaels
Registered User
Agalloch
EliteProspects
We don't manage our top prospects the good way. I hope these prospects aren't screwed.
Milhouse40
Registered User
- Aug 19, 2010
- 22,113
- 24,690
Hmmmm.
Laval losing the last 5 games in a playoff run with many players many saw as NHLer in the last 2 years and some our supposed future "core players" is really something that should raise some questions.
Bouchard now has Kotkaniemi, Poehling, Fleury, Evans, Brook, Primeau plus some players that played for the Habs, borderline NHLer like Hudon, Peca, Alzner, Folin and Kinkaid. Either our prospects are not that good or Bouchard is not that great after all....either way, something is definitely not working down there.
Laval losing the last 5 games in a playoff run with many players many saw as NHLer in the last 2 years and some our supposed future "core players" is really something that should raise some questions.
Bouchard now has Kotkaniemi, Poehling, Fleury, Evans, Brook, Primeau plus some players that played for the Habs, borderline NHLer like Hudon, Peca, Alzner, Folin and Kinkaid. Either our prospects are not that good or Bouchard is not that great after all....either way, something is definitely not working down there.
Adam Michaels
Registered User
angusyoung
Back in the day, I was always horny!
angusyoung
Back in the day, I was always horny!
Showcasing maybe? waivers,cost issue? Ouellet has more O than Folin,and on D a coin toss tire fire,so......
Adam Michaels
Registered User
Leskinen did not practice today. Chances are he has a concussion.
Neither Varone not Barber were made available to the press after practice. They will speak with media after tomorrow's game.
When asked about it, Peca said he's never seen two vets be healthy scratches for the same game before so he couldn't compare it to any past experiences.
Adam Michaels
Registered User
angusyoung
Back in the day, I was always horny!
Adam Michaels
Registered User
Bouchard confirms that Kinkaid will start tomorrow against Manitoba. He said that Kinkaid has done everything they've asked of him this last little while. He's been at the rink at 8 in the morning and worked with goalie coach Marciano every day. He said they wanted to give him some time to rest and reflect.
How's Bouchard doing?
Laval doesn't seem to be running like a well oiled machine. Poehling has scored since he was sent down, just 5 on the year. KK is racking up the assists, mostly on the PP, but no goals either.
If they miss the POs this season, it will be quite the disappointment.
Adam Michaels
Registered User
The collective is under achieving for sure. The vets that they tried to bring as are not delivering the goods aside from Barber. Hudon is also tearing it up. But Peca and Varone in particular are not really pulling their weight. And losing Belzile early in the year for the rest of the season really hurts.
The part that I do appreciate about Bouchard is that at the very least, prospects do improve under him.
Fleury spent a full year under Bouchard last year and this year showed that he can be in the NHL, despite being sent back down. Obviously he needs some more time.
Evans was a small sample size in Montreal, but he looked good. He too spent a full year under Bouchard. Evans will unlikely become a Top-6 player in the NHL, but there has been progress.
Vejdemo is better this year than last year.
Brook still has a ways to go, but he has gotten better since the start of the year.
Poehling's production isn't there right now, but he was one of Laval's best players before Habs decided to call him up. But he is playing PP and PK. He's not being sheltered.
Kotkaniemi has gotten cold lately with production, but he is playing a lot. Like Poehling, he's not being sheltered.
So while the team isn't doing as well as was expected, there is at least something to go on with Laval, even if there is still work to be done on these prospects.
With Lefebvre, there was no winning and no developing. With Bouchard, there is a bit more winning (but not winning enough), but there is at least developing.
Bouchard is not perfect to be sure. But he is an improvement.
Archijerej
Registered User
He's been a disappointment so far. The list of under performing veterans grows larger and larger. He runs an offensive system that's well suited for guys like Vejdemo or Belzile, but not for skilled players. He hasn't been able to come up with consistently effective lines (with exceptions). They've completely lost their defensive stability and every goalie he's ever laid his hands on looks suspect.
It would obviously be silly to give up on a coach with his resume just two years into his career at professional level, but the alarm bells are ringing.
I think he might be the kind of coach who's good at implementing an effective structure with underdog teams full of hard workers with limited abilities, but lacks imagination or knowledge to coach actual talent.
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montreal
Go Habs Go
My concern is his benching of Varone and Barber will backfire as I'm not 100% behind that move as to me I would have sat Peca before Barber but of course I don't know what goes on at practice and in the locker room. Either way he needs to get this team into the playoffs, the injuries/call ups have really stung hard but not a good enough excuse, picking up just 5 out of 20 points in their last 10 games is f***ing terrible. Yes the goaltending has been inconsistent for some time, the defense has taken a hit as Fleury looks like shit at times, Brook is shaky, Leskinen turns over the puck too much, etc... But he has to find a way to get this team back on track.
The injuries do suck though, not one player on this team has played in all 53 games. Only 3 players have played over 50 games, Brook, Alain and Alzner. Only 5 more players have played over 42 games, Olofsson, Evans, Jevpalovs, Leskinen and Lynch.
What's the problem with that list, not one real goal scorer on there. Evans is 3rd on the team with 12 but he's always been more of a playmaker. Alain has a good shot but that means we are missing our best goal scorers and vets for close to 20% of the season for Hudon and almost 30% for Barber with Varone at 50%. That's brutal but still this team needs to find a way as they were much better when they were missing all these key players then they have been the past 10 games and that is a big concern as that clearly shouldn't happen.
So why is Hudon one of the top goal scorers in the AHL as he's clearly a skilled player. Belzile certainly has some skill as well. Barber's goals are down but he's on pace for a career high in points, 62 if he played all 76 games.
The biggest disappointment is Varone who's on pace for just 41 pts over 76, perhaps the injury has hampered him. Peca is the other disappointment although he was never the big scorer in the AHL like Varone, Barber but still he's on pace for just 32 pts over 76 when he should be over 40 for sure.
Although the really sad thing is Belzile played only 20 games and yet only 7 players currently have more points then him, ouch.
The injuries do suck though, not one player on this team has played in all 53 games. Only 3 players have played over 50 games, Brook, Alain and Alzner. Only 5 more players have played over 42 games, Olofsson, Evans, Jevpalovs, Leskinen and Lynch.
What's the problem with that list, not one real goal scorer on there. Evans is 3rd on the team with 12 but he's always been more of a playmaker. Alain has a good shot but that means we are missing our best goal scorers and vets for close to 20% of the season for Hudon and almost 30% for Barber with Varone at 50%. That's brutal but still this team needs to find a way as they were much better when they were missing all these key players then they have been the past 10 games and that is a big concern as that clearly shouldn't happen.
So why is Hudon one of the top goal scorers in the AHL as he's clearly a skilled player. Belzile certainly has some skill as well. Barber's goals are down but he's on pace for a career high in points, 62 if he played all 76 games.
The biggest disappointment is Varone who's on pace for just 41 pts over 76, perhaps the injury has hampered him. Peca is the other disappointment although he was never the big scorer in the AHL like Varone, Barber but still he's on pace for just 32 pts over 76 when he should be over 40 for sure.
Although the really sad thing is Belzile played only 20 games and yet only 7 players currently have more points then him, ouch.
Being an improvement over someone who developed 0 prospect for the Habs except a struggling one in Beaulieu while missing the POs 6 years in a row, doesn't mean much of anything though.
I'm not particularly impressed by the kids who've come up to the NHL either. It's very easy to play a good few games when you're called up. It happens so often, then we see them regress. All in all, pretty unimpressed. Still early, I guess it will be more telling how those kids look next year.
But we need to stop this culture of mediocrity.
montreal
Go Habs Go
They shouldn't have been called up though, only a moron would call up a 20 year old center that just got benched in the AHL for almost costing his team the game. It boggles the mind how a GM could look at that player as he clearly was having his ups and downs, so why the f*** would you then make his life that much harder when he's already not getting it in the AHL.
That said I think Poehling will be a solid NHLer, I just don't think he will be as good as many thought based off that 1 game and his one great game in the WJC's vs Sweden. But this GM continues to make poor decisions in regards to the prospects. Calling up a 20 year old goalie is one thing but to do so after he just gave up 14 goals in 3 games and then have him face the best offense in the NHL at the time. To me that just sounds f***ing stupid, why would you do that.
I'm not saying it ruins these kids but it just seems like someone making really poor decisions, someone that just doesn't know what the f*** they are doing at their job.
Fleury should have been in Laval all year, his defensive game since coming down has been terrible, way too many poor decisions.
I only saw 1 full game and parts of another of Evans in the NHL but I thought he looked solid, the kid has shown a lot of improvement under Lefebvre and I say this as someone that watched a lot of him over his 4 years at Notre Dame as their games are on tv a good bit down here.
Brook has shown improvement for sure when you look at him from the first month to now but clearly still has a long ways to go.
Vejdemo has clearly shown good improvement since coming over, now I didn't see a ton of him in the SHL but the improvement he made just from last year to this year is impressive.
Even Alain has shown good improvement from last year to this year.
I follow our AHL very close each year since we were in Hamilton and so far I don't have any big problems with Bouchard at all, there are things I don't like but he is miles better then our last AHL coach.
I don't know if his style will work with vets though, as others have wondered since we hired him and this is his first year with having a full year of vets since MB traded or called up almost all the vets last year. It has not gone well for the most part so is that on Bouchard and his staff or our pro scouts. Varone was AHL player of the year 2 years ago before spending most of last year in the NHL, so why is he struggling so badly, is it because he missing months to injury and just hasn't been able to get on track, clearly Bouchard sees something he doesn't like but was it the right move to bench him? We'll see.
Archijerej
Registered User
Yes. With better man-management skills. Therrien always springs to my mind when I think of Bouchard.
Adam Michaels
Registered User
It has to mean something. Because you can't go from the outhouse to the penthouse overnight. At some point it needs to get better than it is now. But it had to start with improvement before it can get to something better.
Where those kids end up in the next year or after is where we can really assess if there is any real improvement in the development. No one's NHL ready yet. But looking at where they were when they started with Bouchard and where they are now (the ones I mentioned above), there is something to like about what is in currently in place.
As for getting out of mediocrity. I'm with you. But that should fall above Bouchard. He's only gotten started in Laval. The other guy above him have been here long enough to where we can safely say he hasn't done enough.
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