Speculation: 2018 Off-Season: We fell short again... now what do we do?

[Stammertime91]

Yeah, his post season play was a bit up and down. I appreciate his energy level, willingness to take the body on the forecheck. He's certainly willing to engage in those glue guy, leadership things. On paper, everything looks to be in order too, but just concerned from a play by play basis that his ability to control the puck and dictate the play is a little lacking... the play never goes through him, he's not in control of it in big moments, which limits his effectiveness.

I agree with the first half. The last part I dont. I'd rather Kucherov have the puck and Stamkos get as few touches as possible, so when he does, he feels inclined to shoot. He's not a great puck handler and he's not great 1v1. He's probably one of the worst guys that have been "elite" 1v1 actually. He can't beat many defenseman to the outside anymore or by faking them out of their skates. His playmaking has gotten better, but that's not his style. He needs to go back to shooting on the rush and getting open. The play used to drive through Marty. It drives primarily through Kucherov now. He's not the end to end puck handling kind of center. The more he does it, the worse it is for us and him. He needs to return to his roots of being a pure goal scorer and the only way of doing that is to shoot the puck and not overpass himself into submission.

 

[Todd1a]

 

[Todd1a]

Kucherov your next ?

 

[Todd1a]

I'm a huge Kucherov supporter, but one thing that would make me turn on him is if it turns out there's any truth to this idea that he's upset we traded Vladdy. He's a professional, Vlad's a professional, and trades happen.

We all new yzerman had to do something at the deadline unless we wanted to be knocked out in round one our team was not clicking after January! We were basically playing 500 hockey after January. Getting mcdonagh was a huge need.

 

[TampaJay]

Agent: Kucherov happy to stay with Lightning

This is a competent agent. He threatens arbitration while saying his client wants to stay. Leverage. Arb will give him 9-10 mil for two years which I think brings him to UFA. Last time he had no arb rights and no leverage except KHL. Yzerman screwed the pooch with that bridge deal. Now he either pays him 10 x 8 or trades him. I say give it to him, but I understand the other side.

 

[DFC]

We all new yzerman had to do something at the deadline unless we wanted to be knocked out in round one our team was not clicking after January! We were basically playing 500 hockey after January. Getting mcdonagh was a huge need.

We'll see next season if there was any truth to the injury rumor, if he does better with a full training camp (everyone will start over with a new D coach), OR if some Rangers fans were correct and he's just been overrated for a while.

We have the season to evaluate our D and see who comes back, and whose money gets shifted to Kuch, Point, and Gourde.

 

[Todd1a]

When is the Nhl going to announce what the official salary cap number will be next season? Heck the draft is on Friday!

 

[Stephen]

I agree with the first half. The last part I dont. I'd rather Kucherov have the puck and Stamkos get as few touches as possible, so when he does, he feels inclined to shoot. He's not a great puck handler and he's not great 1v1. He's probably one of the worst guys that have been "elite" 1v1 actually. He can't beat many defenseman to the outside anymore or by faking them out of their skates. His playmaking has gotten better, but that's not his style. He needs to go back to shooting on the rush and getting open. The play used to drive through Marty. It drives primarily through Kucherov now. He's not the end to end puck handling kind of center. The more he does it, the worse it is for us and him. He needs to return to his roots of being a pure goal scorer and the only way of doing that is to shoot the puck and not overpass himself into submission.

I agree with your assessment, just mean that this "pure sniper" skillset ultimately limits his effectiveness in big game situations that call for a center who can do more.

 

[Stammertime91]

I agree with your assessment, just mean that this "pure sniper" skillset ultimately limits his effectiveness in big game situations that call for a center who can do more.

Well, yes. That's always been a "problem," but we've always had St Louis, Kucherov and now depth with Point to rely on. He's only hinted at being that dominant of a player like before the leg break and before the knee injury last year but he's never shown it consistently for a long period of time. That's who he is and there will probably never be any changing that. The only change we can hope for is he regains his quickness and explosiveness to get into shooting positions like he used to. He still can, he just tries to play a completely different style and it backfires.

I think a lot of us - to some extent - would prefer seeing the shot on a player like Point, or a Bergeron type center, etc being here at times but that's who we drafted and currently pay 8.5M. I think it's ultimately an albatross when his production goes from what it is now - appeasing - to a lower level of production - disappointment. If he played the rest of his contract out with years like this I wouldn't say it was an albatross or a gross disappointment, I'd just be saddened we built around a pure goal scorer who couldn't secure a cup. I think that's what his "legacy" and fame really hangs on right now.

 

[Hockey4Life91]

Everything you said is spot on! I have said this numerous times. Sadly, I am not sure if things will ever change. I do not understand why we never see any signs that this logic is on his mind. It is inexcusable. And it so obvious that the disconnect gives me huge concerns. It is the predominant reason why I have questioned his hockey IQ.

Now I am not saying that Stamkos is worthless. He is an amazing player. The point is, despite his inability to control the game with the puck on his stick (he is horrendous at this, which is quite astonishing for a "top" player in the league), he is still capable of being exponentially more lethal if he adopted a shoot first mentality. It is the difference between being scoring 50 and 30 goals. I truly believe that if Stamkos tweaked his game in this way, he still could pot 45 goals, and, perhaps, in a good year, he could get 50 goals again.

Most importantly, tweaking his game, I think, will be necessary to get us over the hump and reach the promised land. Stamkos needs to consistently be a difference maker in the playoffs. Against Chicago, Pit and Wash WE HAD THE LEAD IN EACH SERIES, and yet we ran out of steam and literally could not score goals (the two Boyle scored against Pit in garbage time in game 6 don't count in my book). If we ever are to be so fortunate to win a Cup with this group, Stamkos will have to be a special player. Just like Ovechkin could be counted on to have a huge impact night in and out. My hope is that Cooper points to Ovechkin's playoffs as an exemplar to craft the message to Stamkos in a way that won't offend him.

Finally, we need to split Stamkos and Kucherov up in the playoffs. And Kucherov needs to receive the same message.

 

[These Are The Days]

Split Kucherov from Stamkos and Stamkos will go AWOL. I have never seen a player who needs his hand held like that so often.

Edit: yes I have... Johnson with Palat

 

[Rschmitz]

We shouldn't be worried about Kucherov in the slightest, since he's a RFA after next year. Unless Yzerman wants to miss out on <5 million dollar Hart candidate production he'd be wise to turn down all non-loony offers.

 

[Rschmitz]

The Kucherov RFA status gives Yzerman a lot of interesting options going forward. He'd be showing his hand, but theoretically he could be in on Tavares. Could also sit on Kucherov past July 1st 2019 to see if he can wrangle in Karlsson before making a decision.

 

[LightningStrikes]

If he's in on Tavares it would be to replace Stamkos not Kucherov I'd guess. And Stamkos is more or less not movable (NMC). Dream dead.

 

[Hockey4Life91]

Split Kucherov from Stamkos and Stamkos will go AWOL. I have never seen a player who needs his hand held like that so often.

Edit: yes I have... Johnson with Palat

You’re missing the point. The hope is that if Stamkos just starts shooting from everywhere and realizes he’s not allowed to have the puck on his stick for more than 5 seconds in the offensive zone, then we will see a different player. Stamkos and Kucherov are both trigger men. Yes, Kucherov also is a world class playmaker. But we need them to feel like they can shoot whenever they want. And this requires their separation. I would put Cirelli and Gourde with Stammer. They relentlessly chase the puck on forechecks and can get it to Stammer for a quick shot. This happpems enough and his high shooting percentage will translate to more goals.

A few months ago, I posted the Stammer shots per season summary, and the correlation between his highest scoring seasons and highest shot seasons. What needs to happen cannot be clearer. In every industry, experts always say it is best to focus on improving your strengths rather than your weaknesses. And Stammer has spent far too much time on the latter to the detriment of the former. It is time this changes. Heads have to roll if there continues to be no sign that anyone is paying attention to this.

 

[Rschmitz]

Great, now someone just needs to get this information to Stamkos.

 

[DFC]

The really troubling news on Stamkos, IMO, is he scored just 12 goals at ES. To put that in context, Chris Kunitz also scored 12.

Think about that.

 

[Todd1a]

You think yzerman will sign Filppula this summer to a one year deal to replace Kunitz? He still would be a good 3rd line center

 

[DFC]

You think yzerman will sign Filppula this summer to a one year deal to replace Kunitz? He still would be a good 3rd line center

We have a lot of centers.

 

[CupsOverCash]

Split Kucherov from Stamkos and Stamkos will go AWOL. I have never seen a player who needs his hand held like that so often.

Edit: yes I have... Johnson with Palat

I think they need to split. It feels like they rely on each other too much and Kuch doesnt really need to do that. Its a waste of his talents. Same with Stamkos. Stamkos is better when he is the trigger man on his line, not force feeding to Kuch and then he does it back to Stamkos. They didnt have this problem early in the year. They were making the right pass and at the right times. Either they stopped what they were doing so well or teams adjusted. Im sure its a little more the latter, which means that its not going to work as well as it did the first dozen times. I was kind of shocked that we kept them together late in the playoffs when it was clear it wasnt working anymore. I want to see more Kuch and Point together this year. I always thought they worked well together. Those two dont seem to second guess they just go with whats given. Which was what Stamkos and Kuch did early in their time together. Miller was a nice add for them for a while and that got them some life again but then they just disappeared. Part of that is due to the fact that we were in the playoffs and top lines get shut down deep in the playoffs but you expect them to be more dangerous than they were. Another reason why I want them split. Take your two best goal scorers and make the other team have to split their best D too. We at least have the depth to surround guys with others who know how to play in top 6 roles.

 

[Rschmitz]

The really troubling news on Stamkos, IMO, is he scored just 12 goals at ES. To put that in context, Chris Kunitz also scored 12.

Think about that.

He has 41 ES assists though, best on the team by a lot.

 

[DFC]

He has 41 ES assists though, best on the team by a lot.

Yeah, but this is a guy who scored 60 goals.

 

[Todd1a]

We have a lot of centers.

What about a center that can actually win face offs more ?!

 

[LightningStrikes]

What about a center that can actually win face offs more ?!

Peca

 

[Todd1a]

Peca

If he stays