TSN: 2016/17 Projected lineup

[Doc300c]

Nah .. Lupul will be Robidas'd

After the season starts so we cant spend his money unless we sign someone after the beginning of the season

 

[Faltorvo]

Nah .. Lupul will be Robidas'd

you make it sound like Robidas is not a legit LTIR

you can't "just" LTIR someone.

it's a fun and cute little meme that has been running around

but it's not a real thing.

 

[Faltorvo]

After the season starts so we cant spend his money unless we sign someone after the beginning of the season

I encourage folks to read this and learn more about

the "LTIR" so called cap advantages

http://www.broadstreethockey.com/2014/7/3/5865615/flyers-salary-cap-pronger-ltir



this is the main reason why I keep suggesting a Lupul buy out

and not this new robidas meme

adding a 3rd guy like that to LTIR does nothing to help any cap issues next year.


as best as I understand the rules.

 

[thewave]

I encourage folks to read this and learn more about

the "LTIR" so called cap advantages

http://www.broadstreethockey.com/2014/7/3/5865615/flyers-salary-cap-pronger-ltir



this is the main reason why I keep suggesting a Lupul buy out

and not this new robidas meme

adding a 3rd guy like that to LTIR does nothing to help any cap issues next year.


as best as I understand the rules.

It's pretty easy if they want to make changes.

Lupul = 3.75m buyout FOR 1.5, 3, 1.5, 1.5
Cowen = 3.75 FOR 750k in 2017
Michalek = 2.66m FOR 1.3, 1.3

Total = 10.1m Savings

That's what I would do if they want Stamkos. No Brainer.

 

[seanlinden]

I encourage folks to read this and learn more about

the "LTIR" so called cap advantages

http://www.broadstreethockey.com/2014/7/3/5865615/flyers-salary-cap-pronger-ltir



this is the main reason why I keep suggesting a Lupul buy out

and not this new robidas meme

adding a 3rd guy like that to LTIR does nothing to help any cap issues next year.


as best as I understand the rules.

Signing up to pay Joffrey Lupul at least $1.5m for the next 4 years makes absolutely no sense.

Play him next year, retain 50% on the last year of the deal where his salary is well below his cap hit, and get out of it in 2.

 

[Ovate]

It's pretty easy if they want to make changes.

Lupul = 3.75m buyout FOR 1.5, 3, 1.5, 1.5
Cowen = 3.75 FOR 750k in 2017
Michalek = 2.66m FOR 1.3, 1.3

Total = 10.1m Savings

That's what I would do if they want Stamkos. No Brainer.

They can afford Stammer without buying anyone out Michalek or Lupul. It's not either or. Better not to have Lupul's 1.5 on the books when Nylander and Marner are looking for raises.

 

[thewave]

They can afford Stammer without buying anyone out Michalek or Lupul. It's not either or. Better not to have Lupul's 1.5 on the books when Nylander and Marner are looking for raises.

To be honest if I had players I wanted to try out over Lupul. I would buy him out. Cowen is gone regardless. Michalek, well, I guess he may attract some interest down the line.

Alternatively. Perhaps there is a trade for a 4D and it would require making some room. In that case it may make sense as well.

 

[Faltorvo]

I'm not getting into this debate again with you seanlinden, it just goes in circles

someone asked how we could make stammers cap hit fit next year and I answered the question.

 

[gamer1035]

you make it sound like Robidas is not a legit LTIR

you can't "just" LTIR someone.

it's a fun and cute little meme that has been running around

but it's not a real thing.

I'm pretty sure Robidas isn't a legit LTIR. He seemed fine in training camp. Then after he was clearly outplayed and lost his spot on the roster, he disappeared.

 

[Faltorvo]

They can afford Stammer without buying anyone out Michalek or Lupul. It's not either or. Better not to have Lupul's 1.5 on the books when Nylander and Marner are looking for raises.

well your going to have to explain that

because the numbers just don't add up

or will you just be another one "of those" that throw out statements with no back up.?

 

[Faltorvo]

I'm pretty sure Robidas isn't a legit LTIR. He seemed fine in training camp. Then after he was clearly outplayed and lost his spot on the roster, he disappeared.

You do realise to LTIR someone doctors and agents and the league get involved, right?

 

[thewave]

well your going to have to explain that

because the numbers just don't add up

or will you just be another one "of those" that throw out statements with no back up.?

They work if you buyout those guys. You could do Laich and Greening as well if you really want to get cooking.

I suspect they'll want to keep the hardest working vets around though.

 

[Faltorvo]

They can afford Stammer without buying anyone out Michalek or Lupul. It's not either or. Better not to have Lupul's 1.5 on the books when Nylander and Marner are looking for raises.

ya thats what I though

just another R2D2

 

[Zonk]

I believe that Brendan Shanahan is emulating what his former team mate, Steve Yzerman, did in Tampa.

I thought that I heard on one of the hockey games earlier in the season that Yzerman replaced over a two-year period all but two players on the TBL roster. (Stamkos and Hedman were retained.) Most of the replacement players came from their AHL farm team, but they also made trades and signed some free agents.

IMO Shanahan was so royally p***ed watching the Leafs last spring that he decided to do the same thing. I expect that he will retain Rielly, but would not bet on the security of anyone else on that team.

 

[Faltorvo]

Well waive

I keep picking Lupul for lots of reason that do add up

I don't think they want him anywhere near these kids or AHL

Unlike some I'm not getting caught up in this new robidas meme , there is no such thing as "just robidas em" and the LTIR loses all effectiveness when there is too much on it

and I really doubt tin man interests anyone in the league, even at 50% retained.

3.75m(lupul) is Lous biggest bang for the buck along with Cowen.

and if folks don't think Lou is not trying to open up cap space for this summer, well look no farther then how anxious they are to buy out cowen.

Lou is going big game hunting this summer, there should be absolutely no doubt about that.

 

[showtime8]

Well waive

I keep picking Lupul for lots of reason that do add up

I don't think they want him anywhere near these kids or AHL

Unlike some I'm not getting caught up in this new robidas meme , there is no such thing as "just robidas em" and the LTIR loses all effectiveness when there is too much on it

and I really doubt tin man interests anyone in the league, even at 50% retained.

3.75m(lupul) is Lous biggest bang for the buck along with Cowen.

and if folks don't think Lou is not trying to open up cap space for this summer, well look no farther then how anxious they are to buy out cowen.

Lou is going big game hunting this summer, there should be absolutely no doubt about that.

I think that Lou can get creative with the deals that he makes.

You could look at a team like Arizona who has boatloads of capspace next year. You add in prospects that are on the fringes of being in your organization (ie. guys that require waivers that just don't fit or are falling down the depth chart like Percy) and even some NHL ready bodies like Marincin, Holland or Corrado that can be easily replaced. You add in conditional picks based on how many games Lupul plays. Lou has gone on record saying that he feels comfortable with 8-9 picks, but any more is overwhelming.

So you do something like:

Lupul
Marincin
Conditional 4th based on games... if more than 3/4 or 1/2 games in a season it becomes a 3rd.

for

Brendan Shinimin

You either qualify Shinimin and he plays on the Marlies. Or you don't and he becomes a free agent and you've essentially paid the Coyotes a 4th round pick to take his contract.

 

[Faltorvo]

Well 8

here is my take on the trade premise

is it impossible? nope not with Lou and co here

do I think they want this cap space for july 1, yup

do I think Lou has been trying to trade Lupul away for a year now with no luck, yup

Lou only has 14 locations to trade Lupul to as per the limited NTC

do I think part of the reason they are making sure Lupul is no longer playing and getting this hernia worked on, is to

A) get him away from this team and

B) a buy out can't get scuttled by a self proclaimed LTIR issue on Lupuls behalf. And he will lose close to 3 million in real dollars.

This really really feels like a Kessel thing ,to me at least

they want this guy gone, like yesterday.

 

[thewave]

Well 8

here is my take on the trade premise

is it impossible? nope not with Lou and co here

do I think they want this cap space for july 1, yup

do I think Lou has been trying to trade Lupul away for a year now with no luck, yup

Lou only has 14 locations to trade Lupul to as per the limited NTC

do I think part of the reason they are making sure Lupul is no longer playing and getting this hernia worked on, is to

A) get him away from this team and

B) a buy out can't get scuttled by a self proclaimed LTIR issue on Lupuls behalf. And he will lose close to 3 million in real dollars.

This really really feels like a Kessel thing ,to me at least

they want this guy gone, like yesterday.

I agree and said the same a little back as well. Why carry and pay Lupul an extra 3m? He doesn't offer anything. Same with Cowen. Heck you could argue Michalek and Laich should be bought out as well if you think they won't return anything for you come TDL.

Combined they have a cap hit of 17+m and buying the lot out saves 1/3 of the salary owed + around 13-14m cap space?

If you can get good players why not do that?

 

[showtime8]

Well 8

here is my take on the trade premise

is it impossible? nope not with Lou and co here

do I think they want this cap space for july 1, yup

do I think Lou has been trying to trade Lupul away for a year now with no luck, yup

Lou only has 14 locations to trade Lupul to as per the limited NTC

do I think part of the reason they are making sure Lupul is no longer playing and getting this hernia worked on, is to

A) get him away from this team and

B) a buy out can't get scuttled by a self proclaimed LTIR issue on Lupuls behalf. And he will lose close to 3 million in real dollars.

This really really feels like a Kessel thing ,to me at least

they want this guy gone, like yesterday.

I don't think that they will do the buy out option with Lupul.

And here's why:

1. You're still paying Gleason 1.833 for the next 3 years (including this one) to not play on your team.

2. You're paying Grabovski for the next 5 years to not play on your team. Even though it's not on the cap of the team, the owners still have to pay.

3. You're paying Phil Kessel 1.2 mill for the next 6 years to not play for your team.

4. You've announced that you're planning to buy out Cowen and will pay him for the following 2 years to not play for your team.

5. You've traded for Nathan Horton with the full intention that he's never going to play another NHL game again, just to get out of a contract. You'll be paying him 5.3 mill for the next 4 years.

Now, I know those were all moves that I would make again no questions asked. But ownership is going to look at the bottom line and have to be a bit rattled that all of those things continue to happen. I mean, just last year the Leafs finally got out of Darcy Tucker contract.

Buy outs have to be the last option.

I think that Arizona didn't make any trades because they were actually in a playoff spot and they were playing with house money in that situation. But it doesn't hurt to give them a call this summer when they only have 34 mill in money tied up in contracts.

 

[showtime8]

I agree and said the same a little back as well. Why carry and pay Lupul an extra 3m? He doesn't offer anything. Same with Cowen. Heck you could argue Michalek and Laich should be bought out as well if you think they won't return anything for you come TDL.

Combined they have a cap hit of 17+m and buying the lot out saves 1/3 of the salary owed + around 13-14m cap space?

If you can get good players why not do that?

Michalek and Laich only have a year remaining on their contracts.

It would be a huge failure to do that.

 

[Faltorvo]

Well wave

I'm still not 100% sure that there is NOT a limitation on how many buyouts you can do in a season or have in grand total(as in paying them all at the same time)


and something tells me

the conversation they had with michalek to waive his NTC had nothing to do with him losing 1/3 of his contract money


and I maybe wrong but I think babs actually likes having laich around and sees the need for a PK c.

 

[Faltorvo]

Well 8 buying out Lupul does save ownership 3 million dollars in real money

anddddd something tells me that Lou will go hunting for something that will bring those TV numbers up

and we won't be seeing empty seats'

but that's just a hunch.


if there is a trade out there, great, freaken, awesome , geeet er done

 

[TheKingSlayer]

I could easily see the Leafs and Yotes hooking up for a trade.

Something like Lupul, Michalek, Bernier, Percy, forward prospect for Mike Smith

Yotes pair up the Michaleks and add some depth with Lupul, and if he is injured all the time, all the better because the insurance pays him instead of them and he still counts against the cap. Bernier gets to become their next reclamation project and Percy + Forward Prospect adds to the rebuild. All that and they get out from the next three years of Smith.

Leafs essentially trade 4 contracts for 1 which is huge, and Smith could be decent in front of a solid two-way team (potentially).

 

[The Examiner]

I'm pretty sure Robidas isn't a legit LTIR. He seemed fine in training camp. Then after he was clearly outplayed and lost his spot on the roster, he disappeared.

He's not on the LTIR list. He is on the regular IR and his cap counts. The only player in the LTIR list is Nathan Horton.





DEFENSE (8 - $11,805,834) TERMS POS STATUS AGE 2015-16 2016-17 2017-18 2018-19 2019-20 2020-21 2021-22
Gardiner, Jake D NHL 25 $4,050,000 $4,050,000 $4,050,000 $4,050,000
UFA
Robidas, Stephane 35+M-NTC D IR 39 $3,000,000 $3,000,000
UFA
Hunwick, Matt "A" D NHL 30 $1,200,000 $1,200,000
UFA
Rielly, Morgan EL D NHL 22 $894,167
RFA
Marincin, Martin D NHL 24 $700,000
RFA
Loov, Viktor EL D Emerg. Loan 23 $692,500 $692,500
RFA
Carrick, Connor EL D NHL 21 $636,667
RFA
Corrado, Frank D NHL 22 $632,500
RFA
GOALTENDERS (2 - $4,820,000) TERMS POS STATUS AGE 2015-16 2016-17 2017-18 2018-19 2019-20 2020-21 2021-22
Bernier, Jonathan G NHL 27 $4,150,000 $4,150,000
UFA
Sparks, Garret EL G NHL 22 $670,000
RFA
LONG-TERM INJURED RESERVE (1) TERMS POS STATUS AGE 2015-16 2016-17 2017-18 2018-19 2019-20 2020-21 2021-22
Horton, Nathan NMC RW LTIR 30 $5,300,000 $5,300,000 $5,300,000 $5,300,000 $5,300,000
UFA
BURIED (4 - $4,000,000) TERMS POS STATUS AGE

 

[saltming]

I could easily see the Leafs and Yotes hooking up for a trade.

Something like Lupul, Michalek, Bernier, Percy, forward prospect for Mike Smith

Yotes pair up the Michaleks and add some depth with Lupul, and if he is injured all the time, all the better because the insurance pays him instead of them and he still counts against the cap. Bernier gets to become their next reclamation project and Percy + Forward Prospect adds to the rebuild. All that and they get out from the next three years of Smith.

Leafs essentially trade 4 contracts for 1 which is huge, and Smith could be decent in front of a solid two-way team (potentially).

Why would we want 3 years of mike smith?