2015-2016 General Wild Discussion I

[Tony253]

Add me to the list being OK with trading Spurgeon...Not that he's a bad player by any means but you have to give something to get something back. They do need a lot more higher end prospects in the system to maintain salary cap flexibility year over year. There should be an expectation of at least ONE prospect make the jump to NHL every year. Now that Granlund, Coyle, Scandella, Brodin, Dumba, Zucker have all graduated, the cupboard is very bare and needs restocking...As another poster mentioned, his value will never be higher (and don't forget his concussion issues...). Folin is close to being able to step into a right-shot position with Olofsson not far behind (on the left) both being of greater size D (which the NHL is trending to).

 

[NotYou]

I would love Yakupov. I don't think he deserves his bad rap. It'd have to be for Brodin. I think that deal would probably look good for us in a few years, but there's a decent chance Yak never becomes the star he can become. Brodin isn't going to be worse than a good defensive minded 2D. I wouldn't pull the trigger, but I would be excited if it happened.

Edit: I see no reason to trade Spurgeon. We aren't going to get anything we need back for him, or a package around him.

 

[tomgilbertfan]

I would love Yakupov. I don't think he deserves his bad rap. It'd have to be for Brodin. I think that deal would probably look good for us in a few years, but there's a decent chance Yak never becomes the star he can become. Brodin isn't going to be worse than a good defensive minded 2D. I wouldn't pull the trigger, but I would be excited if it happened.

Edit: I see no reason to trade Spurgeon. We aren't going to get anything we need back for him, or a package around him.

If for some reason we trade Brodin, it had better be for a #1 center, not a RW.

 

[NotYou]

I actually agree with that. A brodin+koivu or brodin+granlund would likely be most workable.

 

[Bruce Granville]

A Koivu trade is not workable.

 

[57special]

I would love Yakupov. I don't think he deserves his bad rap. It'd have to be for Brodin. I think that deal would probably look good for us in a few years, but there's a decent chance Yak never becomes the star he can become. Brodin isn't going to be worse than a good defensive minded 2D. I wouldn't pull the trigger, but I would be excited if it happened.

Edit: I see no reason to trade Spurgeon. We aren't going to get anything we need back for him, or a package around him.

Yak for Brodin is insanity.

 

[Avder]

Trading Brodin would be like taking a shotgun to our future defensive corps. When Suter goes deep enough into decline, that's when Brodin takes his place. We're going to need him as part of our top pairing for the next 15 or so years. What is he, like 20? Can't even buy beer in this country and he's playing on the top pairing. Why the hell would you want to trade him when his presence means our top pairing is going to be securely anchored for years and years?

 

[FVM]

Fletcher has done a very good job but he really needs to stop giving out NTCs like candy. How many guys already have that protection? At least Koivu, Vanek, Pominville... who else? Those three didn't perform at all against the Hawks. These unmovable vets with big contracts make improving the team so ******* difficult. I really, really don't want to see him trade any young players or prospects or even high picks for another vet on the downhill of his career. Same applies to big money free agents.

So, I don't know how to proceed. Status quo doesn't cut it, you need to do something, but what? Overreacting would be equally as bad, this team has many good parts and back-to-back playoff round wins is nothing to sneeze at. But how to take that next step to a true contender? So many teams fail to ever take it.

At this moment in time I'd still look for trading one of those vets who are not pulling their weight come playoffs. They don't all have full NMCs, do they? With 10 teams off the list of destinations or some such scenario there still are plays to be made in the trade market. We need room for our young core too, both roster- and salarywise.

 

[tomgilbertfan]

I'd like to point out that the quote that the title of the thread is a riff on "now is the [offseason] of our discontent" is actually remarking how the time of unhappiness is gone

"Now is the winter of our discontent
Made glorious by the summer by this sun of York,
And all the clouds that lour'd upon our house
In the deep bosom of the ocean buried.
Now are our brows bound with victorious wreaths;
Our bruised arms hung up for monuments;
Our stern alarums changed to merry meetings,
Our dreadful marches to delightful measures.
...
"

 

[Minnesota]

I'd like to point out that the quote that the title of the thread is a riff on "now is the [offseason] of our discontent" is actually remarking how the time of unhappiness is gone

"Now is the winter of our discontent
Made glorious by the summer by this sun of York,
And all the clouds that lour'd upon our house
In the deep bosom of the ocean buried.
Now are our brows bound with victorious wreaths;
Our bruised arms hung up for monuments;
Our stern alarums changed to merry meetings,
Our dreadful marches to delightful measures.
...
"

Blame Avder - he re-named the thread.

 

[123TripleDoge]

Speaking of how we have so many guys disappear in the playoffs.... the one guy who is supposed to be the playoff performer is benched lol (bergenheim)

 

[Bruce Granville]

Speaking of how we have so many guys disappear in the playoffs.... the one guy who is supposed to be the playoff performer is benched lol (bergenheim)

And this other guy the Hawks really were afraid of is benchend the first 3 games.
In game 4 he scores a goal.

 

[Spurgeon]

And this other guy the Hawks really were afraid of is benchend the first 3 games.
In game 4 he scores a goal.

Haula played games 2 and 4.

 

[Bruce Granville]

Haula played games 2 and 4.

What are you talking about?
Game 2 never happened...at least no one showed up to play hockey.

 

[Avder]

I'd like to point out that the quote that the title of the thread is a riff on "now is the [offseason] of our discontent" is actually remarking how the time of unhappiness is gone

"Now is the winter of our discontent
Made glorious by the summer by this sun of York,
And all the clouds that lour'd upon our house
In the deep bosom of the ocean buried.
Now are our brows bound with victorious wreaths;
Our bruised arms hung up for monuments;
Our stern alarums changed to merry meetings,
Our dreadful marches to delightful measures.
...
"

And your point?

I'm full of discontent. I've also got somewhat witty one-liners. I mixed them together and hey here's your thread title.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Biggs111]

I wonder if our management watches the other teams in the playoffs still - and think: "wait a minute, why isn't there anyone else like vanek or heatley on the ice?"

Yet if we were in the playoff picture tomorrow - you know Yo Yo & Co would be playing vanek on top PP and consuming precious minutes... For that reason alone - and Heatley last year - until this team is willing to put their best team on the ice to actually win each and every game - they don't deserve me to care too much about them... Another average team - that will stay average...

 

[Wild11MN]

I wonder if our management watches the other teams in the playoffs still - and think: "wait a minute, why isn't there anyone else like vanek or heatley on the ice?"

Yet if we were in the playoff picture tomorrow - you know Yo Yo & Co would be playing vanek on top PP and consuming precious minutes... For that reason alone - and Heatley last year - until this team is willing to put their best team on the ice to actually win each and every game - they don't deserve me to care too much about them... Another average team - that will stay average...

How dare they try putting a traditionally great PP guy on the top PP. Our whole entire PP sucks. Vanek could and should be doing more, but he's probably not being used correctly because the rest of the PP sucks so bad.

Who would you have signed last summer then that we had a shot at? 50-60 point wingers don't grow on trees.

 

[Nharris31]

The way to score more goals give niederreiter and Zucker more ice time and on the powerplay. But Dumba on the powerplay. Play Schroeder and Haula more than Cooke and Brodziak.

Also the wild and Blackhawks had the same amount of 5 on 5 goals in the regular season.

The team is going be lost without Spurgeon if he gets traded.

 

[BigT2002]

The team is going be lost without Spurgeon if he gets traded.

They will not be lost without Spurgeon. He is injury prone averaging less than 70 games a season right now in his career. He had 9 goals, 16 assists in 66 games. He has 4 goals and 6 assists in 28 playoff games.

Dumba had 8 goals and 8 assists in 58 games and had 2 goals and 2 assists in 10 playoff games. And that is coming from a whole lot of bottom pairing minutes at the start of the season as well.

You can easily place Dumba with Scandella and have Leopold and someone else, maybe Folin finally, play the 5/6 now problem. I like Spurgeon but it is not logical to think this team would take a hit in the Top 4 by losing him. Yes, he provides great shot blocking and his overall play has considerably gotten better in the last couple of years, but losing him would not mean the blue line is lost.

Suter-Brodin
Dumba-Scandella
Leopold-Folin
Prosser/Oloffson

 

[Nharris31]

They will not be lost without Spurgeon. He is injury prone averaging less than 70 games a season right now in his career. He had 9 goals, 16 assists in 66 games. He has 4 goals and 6 assists in 28 playoff games.

Dumba had 8 goals and 8 assists in 58 games and had 2 goals and 2 assists in 10 playoff games. And that is coming from a whole lot of bottom pairing minutes at the start of the season as well.

You can easily place Dumba with Scandella and have Leopold and someone else, maybe Folin finally, play the 5/6 now problem. I like Spurgeon but it is not logical to think this team would take a hit in the Top 4 by losing him. Yes, he provides great shot blocking and his overall play has considerably gotten better in the last couple of years, but losing him would not mean the blue line is lost.

Suter-Brodin
Dumba-Scandella
Leopold-Folin
Prosser/Oloffson

Yes they will he has been the wild best possesion driver dmen for three years now. Dumba is not as good defensively as Spurgeon. Prosser yuck.
Well it won't be as good.

 

[Sharppi]

They will not be lost without Spurgeon. He is injury prone averaging less than 70 games a season right now in his career. He had 9 goals, 16 assists in 66 games. He has 4 goals and 6 assists in 28 playoff games.

Dumba had 8 goals and 8 assists in 58 games and had 2 goals and 2 assists in 10 playoff games. And that is coming from a whole lot of bottom pairing minutes at the start of the season as well.

You can easily place Dumba with Scandella and have Leopold and someone else, maybe Folin finally, play the 5/6 now problem. I like Spurgeon but it is not logical to think this team would take a hit in the Top 4 by losing him. Yes, he provides great shot blocking and his overall play has considerably gotten better in the last couple of years, but losing him would not mean the blue line is lost.

Suter-Brodin
Dumba-Scandella
Leopold-Folin
Prosser/Oloffson

Spurgeon is top-5 in every advanced stat category except two in the whole damn team, best D-man in all categories but two. Drives possession and can reliably play 20+ minutes every game. Why in the flying duck should we trade that man?

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

We'll be lost if Dumba stagnates, which I don't think he will, but I agree with the other poster in whatever thread it was that a year of Spurgeon and a 2016 1st rounder is worth a lot more than a 2015 1st rounder and no Spurgeon.

 

[MN_Gopher]

I wonder if our management watches the other teams in the playoffs still - and think: "wait a minute, why isn't there anyone else like vanek or heatley on the ice?"

Yet if we were in the playoff picture tomorrow - you know Yo Yo & Co would be playing vanek on top PP and consuming precious minutes... For that reason alone - and Heatley last year - until this team is willing to put their best team on the ice to actually win each and every game - they don't deserve me to care too much about them... Another average team - that will stay average...

So when we were the best team in the NHL since roughly mid January and Vanek and the vets were on the PP we could have been even better? Maybe gone undefeated in that stretch? Almost did on the road for a while there. So how much better could have we been?

I still blame the coach for the terrible start. We were playing playoff hockey for several months. It weras on you. STL got worn out too under Hitch. CHI coasts in and turns it up a notch when it matters. Suter had nothing left in the tank vs CHI, 29 minutes a game will not sut it if we want anything out of him at the end.

For those coach doubters out there. Paul Molitor. Almost the same team as last year. Nothing from Ricky N, same Mauer, Plouffe, Dozier, Perkins etc... Season ends today twins in the playoffs.

 

[BigT2002]

Yes they will he has been the wild best possesion driver dmen for three years now. Dumba is not as good defensively as Spurgeon. Prosser yuck.
Well it won't be as good.

I agree Prosser is Yuck but if you put him in against Bottom 10 teams, I don't think this team is affected by it. He should not be the top "go-to" person when playing playoff caliber teams or into the last 25% of the season though, I agree. If you look at my past post history I don't want him on this team either, but as many have said before: he is dirt cheap to keep on your roster and doesn't complain about press box time. That is a rarity in itself.

Spurgeon is top-5 in every advanced stat category except two in the whole damn team, best D-man in all categories but two. Drives possession and can reliably play 20+ minutes every game. Why in the flying duck should we trade that man?

Because there is very little else out there that can be traded which will actually return something tangible to the team. Everyone can bark about ejecting Vanek, Poms, Cooke, Koivu or Backstrom...but good luck actually seeing them do any of it outside of Backstrom being bought out.

Right now there is better ability to move Zucker, Haula and Spurgeon to the East Coast to teams which are playoff contenders who would part ways with picks or prospects in order to get depth. You don't think Pittsburgh, a team which could be looking at cap issues, isn't looking at any of those 3 and wondering what it would take to get them to bolster their scoring and defensive depth?

And advanced stats are not the end all be all either. They provide a great picture of a player, but to say that you should predicate all roster decisions based on that would be foolish.

We'll be lost if Dumba stagnates, which I don't think he will, but I agree with the other poster in whatever thread it was that a year of Spurgeon and a 2016 1st rounder is worth a lot more than a 2015 1st rounder and no Spurgeon.

Time will tell and hindsight can work from both ways too. If you keep him and he hits 15G, 25A and plays 75 games it is a great year and you breathe out that you didn't trade him. But if he gets a concussion or breaks his foot and is out for 40 games and only pots 4G,10A respectively are you still happy you didn't make the trade when his stock was actually high?

You can't have the cake and eat it too. If fans, and management, want this team to actually get over this hump of the 2nd round (and Chicago) then tough choices have to be made with players they can actually move. No one in their right mind is taking a $6M caphit for a 3rd line player on their team just because of their last name. At some point, something has to give. Right now the team has 3 viable players on the blue line who can shoot the puck and have great movement. They have another two in Iowa who could be viable roster replacements if one of those 3 were moved. Your top 2 are your best defensive pairings for top lines so you're not moving either of them. Meanwhile your forward depth is atrocious in Iowa and they may or may not have Lucia and Tuch down there next year.

 

[DANOZ28]

while spur isnt a beast i do think hes a very smart player that doesnt turn the puck over very often. i would only trade him if we had a prospect ready to replace his production AND we were improving the team by upgrading to a 20G center or goal scoring winger like say yakupov. just my one cent.