2014-15 Training Camp

[pucka lucka]

I didn't like at least one of the decisions - I would have liked them to give Morrissey more of a chance and keep him up. Maybe Petan, too. What specifically are you annoyed about in this regard?

As I've mentioned in other posts, I think this decision was Maurice's, as much or more than anyone else's. If he had wanted to keep Petan or Morrissey, I'm pretty sure "management" would not have objected. He has control over those roster decisions at this point.



I thought they were fibbing at the time, but I thought then and still think now it was because they wanted to get the time to sit down with them and discuss their plans, rationale and how they saw each players' development process. That's a better way of communicating it via the media. I say no harm, no foul on this.

There is an alternative, we haven't made the final decisions on our roster. Nope, not cut, next day, cut. It's juvenile.

 

[Jetabre]

All but Lowry sent back for the prospects huh..Well we'll see even more of them banging on the door next year I guess. Was really rooting for Petan to stick, shame.

 

[pucka lucka]

I didn't like at least one of the decisions - I would have liked them to give Morrissey more of a chance and keep him up. Maybe Petan, too. What specifically are you annoyed about in this regard?

As I've mentioned in other posts, I think this decision was Maurice's, as much or more than anyone else's. If he had wanted to keep Petan or Morrissey, I'm pretty sure "management" would not have objected. He has control over those roster decisions at this point.



I thought they were fibbing at the time, but I thought then and still think now it was because they wanted to get the time to sit down with them and discuss their plans, rationale and how they saw each players' development process. That's a better way of communicating it via the media. I say no harm, no foul on this.

It's an accumulation of odd and suboptimal decisions and lack of direction. Tangradi, Petan, goaltending, Halishuck, Seto, Burmistrov Thorburn, Stuart.

 

[Whileee]

It's an accumulation of odd and suboptimal decisions and lack of direction. Tangradi, Petan, goaltending, Halishuck, Seto, Burmistrov Thorburn, Stuart.

Do you consider Maurice to be part of "management"?

 

[Joe Hallenback]

Not really sure where Ehlers,Petan and Lowry were going to play. That would mean 2 of them would be playing on the 4th line or would be in the press box.

 

[StronGeer]

Not really sure where Ehlers,Petan and Lowry were going to play. That would mean 2 of them would be playing on the 4th line or would be in the press box.

I expected them to be sent down eventually, but I was just hoping that they'd get some regular season games in.

 

[pucka lucka]

Do you consider Maurice to be part of "management"?

Not sure. They are somewhat frontline management. So far I am not a fan of Maurice. I wasn't when he was hired either. I don't get bedazzled by good wordsmithy.

 

[Whileee]

Not really sure where Ehlers,Petan and Lowry were going to play. That would mean 2 of them would be playing on the 4th line or would be in the press box.

It's a good point. I think that Lowry won the 3rd line spot over Petan in the coach's eyes. I don't fully agree, but I haven't been at all disappointed in Lowry's play. He's much quicker and even more of a physical presence than I expected him to be. I think that he'll get stronger throughout the year. He's following a nice trajectory. Still, I could have seen the Jets play Petan on the 3rd line and Lowry on the 4th line to begin the season. Lowry could slide up to the 3rd line for "heavy" games, and Petan could play other types of opposition.

Next year the Jets are going to have some more difficult decisions if they don't make a trade or two. Ehlers might well be ready, and Petan too. Burmistrov will be free to come back to the NHL by then, too. But where is the room in the top 9? I could see them trading Burmi, but there is going to have to be some movement within the next year or so to make room.

My sense from what Maurice was saying is that he is very reluctant to bring in young guys quickly. He mentioned that the usual path was a couple of years in Junior (after draft), and then a year or two in the AHL to get groomed. Maybe that's what they foresee for a guy like Petan and some of the other prospects.

 

[Guardian17]

How so? Why wasn't Petan ready? Specifics please.

No prob.

I think Petan is very skilled and will be a very good player for us in the future.

To play in the NHL he needs to not only excel in the offensive zone, but also in the defensive zone.

Petan spent most of his shift along the wall in the offensive zone.

When he did attempt to go to the "hard area" in front of the goal he was easily moved due to his lack of weight and physical strength.

Same thing in the defensive zone.

Much like Scheifele in his first training camp, Petan needs to go back to junior and work on his game and grow physically.

 

[pucka lucka]

It's a good point. I think that Lowry won the 3rd line spot over Petan in the coach's eyes. I don't fully agree, but I haven't been at all disappointed in Lowry's play. He's much quicker and even more of a physical presence than I expected him to be. I think that he'll get stronger throughout the year. He's following a nice trajectory. Still, I could have seen the Jets play Petan on the 3rd line and Lowry on the 4th line to begin the season. Lowry could slide up to the 3rd line for "heavy" games, and Petan could play other types of opposition.

Next year the Jets are going to have some more difficult decisions if they don't make a trade or two. Ehlers might well be ready, and Petan too. Burmistrov will be free to come back to the NHL by then, too. But where is the room in the top 9? I could see them trading Burmi, but there is going to have to be some movement within the next year or so to make room.

My sense from what Maurice was saying is that he is very reluctant to bring in young guys quickly. He mentioned that the usual path was a couple of years in Junior (after draft), and then a year or two in the AHL to get groomed. Maybe that's what they foresee for a guy like Petan and some of the other prospects.

Where were they going to play? Galliardi, Halischuk, Buff, Thorburn, Slater, Peluso. I think we probably manage to find a spot with all those players in our forward group. Call me crazy i guess, thinking any of those are expendable.

 

[Whileee]

Not sure. They are somewhat frontline management. So far I am not a fan of Maurice. I wasn't when he was hired either. I don't get bedazzled by good wordsmithy.

I like some aspects of Maurice (maybe because of the positive contrast vis-a-vis Noel). I do have some concerns about what he might value in a player (speed and size over skill and hockey sense), and I also have some concern that he is going to really slow down the Jets pipeline by bringing in young players very slowly. So far I have a sense that he doesn't like to rely on young players, but I could be wrong. I'd like to hear how he explains the decision to send the young guys back, and as always, will try to read between the lines.

 

[pucka lucka]

No prob.

I think Petan is very skilled and will be a very good player for us in the future.

To play in the NHL he needs to not only excel in the offensive zone, but also in the defensive zone.

Petan spent most of his shift along the wall in the offensive zone.

When he did attempt to go to the "hard area" in front of the goal he was easily moved due to his lack of weight and physical strength.

Same thing in the defensive zone.

Much like Scheifele in his first training camp, Petan needs to go back to junior and work on his game and grow physically.

Do you have some video i could watch? I didn't SEE much of that at all. Petan is only slightly lighter than LIttle and Halischuk.

 

[pucka lucka]

I like some aspects of Maurice (maybe because of the positive contrast vis-a-vis Noel). I do have some concerns about what he might value in a player (speed and size over skill and hockey sense), and I also have some concern that he is going to really slow down the Jets pipeline by bringing in young players very slowly. So far I have a sense that he doesn't like to rely on young players, but I could be wrong. I'd like to hear how he explains the decision to send the young guys back, and as always, will try to read between the lines.

Here is the thing about coaches, they keep their jobs via current performance, not future performance. It's counter productive to developing prospects, especially without a strong GM.

 

[Whileee]

Where were they going to play? Galliardi, Halischuk, Buff, Thorburn, Slater, Peluso. I think we probably manage to find a spot with all those players in our forward group. Call me crazy i guess, thinking any of those are expendable.

One of these is not like the others...

The others are all 4th liners. Perhaps Maurice felt that Petan and Ehlers would be better in Junior than playing on the 4th line. On any given night, two of those 5 bottom-liners will be in the press-box.

I'm not saying I think that was the best decision, but I can understand if the Jets didn't want Petan to start with 4th line duty. The Jets top 9 is actually very tough to crack. Lowry looks to be the young gun that was seen as the best choice for a top-9 position.

 

[Whileee]

Here is the thing about coaches, they keep their jobs via current performance, not future performance. It's counter productive to developing prospects, especially without a strong GM.

I agree with that, but I don't think Maurice is "coaching scared". He has a shiny new 4-year contract and by all accounts gets along famously with the owner.

My take is that this is part of Maurice's philosophy. It is only in exceptional cases that a rookie breaks into the NHL with Junior eligibility left and without a year or two seasoning in the minors. I don't think that's an organizational philosophy, as evidenced by the Jets resolute decision to bring Trouba one year post draft.

 

[pucka lucka]

One of these is not like the others...

The others are all 4th liners. Perhaps Maurice felt that Petan and Ehlers would be better in Junior than playing on the 4th line. On any given night, two of those 5 bottom-liners will be in the press-box.

I'm not saying I think that was the best decision, but I can understand if the Jets didn't want Petan to start with 4th line duty. The Jets top 9 is actually very tough to crack. Lowry looks to be the young gun that was seen as the best choice for a top-9 position.

Buff is a d-man. We have a place for him.

 

[pucka lucka]

I agree with that, but I don't think Maurice is "coaching scared". He has a shiny new 4-year contract and by all accounts gets along famously with the owner.

My take is that this is part of Maurice's philosophy. It is only in exceptional cases that a rookie breaks into the NHL with Junior eligibility left and without a year or two seasoning in the minors. I don't think that's an organizational philosophy, as evidenced by the Jets resolute decision to bring Trouba one year post draft.

I don't think he is scared, it's just the nature of the job. short term success is in their best interests.

 

[veganhunter]

No prob.

I think Petan is very skilled and will be a very good player for us in the future.

To play in the NHL he needs to not only excel in the offensive zone, but also in the defensive zone.

Petan spent most of his shift along the wall in the offensive zone.

When he did attempt to go to the "hard area" in front of the goal he was easily moved due to his lack of weight and physical strength.

Same thing in the defensive zone.

Much like Scheifele in his first training camp, Petan needs to go back to junior and work on his game and grow physically.

Did not see that at all.

 

[pucka lucka]

I agree with that, but I don't think Maurice is "coaching scared". He has a shiny new 4-year contract and by all accounts gets along famously with the owner.

My take is that this is part of Maurice's philosophy. It is only in exceptional cases that a rookie breaks into the NHL with Junior eligibility left and without a year or two seasoning in the minors. I don't think that's an organizational philosophy, as evidenced by the Jets resolute decision to bring Trouba one year post draft.

I think that's a contributing factor to being a below .500 career coach. I think the idea that teenagers aren't good enough it antiquated from both the player development perspective and asset/salary cap management.

 

[Whileee]

Buff is a d-man. We have a place for him.

I don't think he is scared, it's just the nature of the job. short term success is in their best interests.

I think that's a contributing factor to being a below .500 career coach. I think the idea that teenagers aren't good enough it antiquated from both the player development perspective and asset/salary cap management.

What's emerging from the issues you've identified (with which I agree) is concerns over how Maurice views the development and use of a roster. I agree that management should be in the driver's seat, but I think it is uncommon for a GM to tell a newly hired coach who to keep and who to cut, or how to deploy his players.

I think that there is an interesting dynamic in play with the Jets - they might have a coach that prefers the "draft and develop" on a slow track, who was probably brought in to try to get more out of the current core than the future core. I'm keeping an eye on this....

 

[pucka lucka]

What's emerging from the issues you've identified (with which I agree) is concerns over how Maurice views the development and use of a roster. I agree that management should be in the driver's seat, but I think it is uncommon for a GM to tell a newly hired coach who to keep and who to cut, or how to deploy his players.

I think that there is an interesting dynamic in play with the Jets - they might have a coach that prefers the "draft and develop" on a slow track, who was probably brought in to try to get more out of the current core than the future core. I'm keeping an eye on this....

I think we have a coach who does a mean public speaking engagement and is an average coach. That's the only conclusion I can come to based on the evidence we have.

 

[Whileee]

I think we have a coach who does a mean public speaking engagement and is an average coach. That's the only conclusion I can come to based on the evidence we have.

Well, that and getting a decent performance out of the Jets for the latter 40% of last season, with lots of injuries. It might have been a "blip", but they were a better team for Maurice.

I also think it's clear that at least for now the players like his coaching style better than Noel's.

I'm not a huge advocate of looking at overall coaching records to assess a coach. It is very situational, in my view. Good coaches can't make up for crappy teams.

So, I am happy to give Maurice the benefit of the doubt for his coaching per se, and like what I have seen much more than I liked Noel's coaching style.

What remains to be seen for me is how he is able to bring in prospects and transition them into effective NHLers.

 

[Repoman]

I think Ehlers defiantly can use another year in Jr. Petan and Josh, not so sure. I think there wouldn't be as much fuss as we are seeing if we could send them the St. John's and have them available later in the year.

 

[surixon]

If the organization has determined that Morrissey, Ehlers and Petan aren't ready than I will take their word for it and trust their judgement. They have made the correct call with both Trouba and Scheifele. If they feel that Lowry is the more ready and better suited prospect for the current opening than I will defer to them. IMO they have earned the benefit of the doubt in this regard so far.

As for the individual prospects in question:

Morrissey had an average camp. While he was better than Ellerby and likely equal to Pardy, Postma's performance last night shut the door for him. The Jets at the moment have better players a head of him and Pardy is the perfect guy to sit in the pressbox. He's close but not quite close enough yet.

Ehlers: Tremendous skill, but he showed that his game still has some wrinkles in it that need to be ironed out. Those are best addressed playing 20 minutes a night in the CHL.

Petan- Had a strong camp and in past years likely would have made the team, but we have a far deeper top 9 this year and there was only on spot open in which management elected to go with another young player.

 

[pucka lucka]

Well, that and getting a decent performance out of the Jets for the latter 40% of last season, with lots of injuries. It might have been a "blip", but they were a better team for Maurice.

I also think it's clear that at least for now the players like his coaching style better than Noel's.

I'm not a huge advocate of looking at overall coaching records to assess a coach. It is very situational, in my view. Good coaches can't make up for crappy teams.

So, I am happy to give Maurice the benefit of the doubt for his coaching per se, and like what I have seen much more than I liked Noel's coaching style.

What remains to be seen for me is how he is able to bring in prospects and transition them into effective NHLers.

We have a massive sample with Maurice. He gets replaced. If you aren't going to integrate good prospects at least win a lot.

Also that decent performance is a little deceiving. They went on a 2013 Leaf like run then came crumbling down.