Proposal: 2013-2014 Trade Deadline Talk - Part Deux - Kane, Wheeler & Patches

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Captain Hook

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Jul 12, 2007
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That's why you draft players like Tatar and Silfverberg and have a well rounded prospects group.

Despres was considered the BPA over both of those guys in 2009.

I get the point though. There's probably been a few opportunities to nab a scoring forward in the draft. I like Pouliot as a prospect and he may turn out great but there were scoring forwards worthy of the #8 overall pick.
 

Ragamuffin Gunner

Lost in the Flood
Aug 15, 2008
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KIRK reminded me in the PGT that the Hossa trade happened because management pushed Shero to make the move, so you can't use him as "proof" Shero has made wingers a priority.
 

TheBeardofJustice

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May 8, 2013
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I think a big problem of this team is overcompensation. We score a lot of goals but give up a lot of goals? Let's draft nothing but ****ing defensemen! We aren't hitting enough and need more grit? Put 4-5 gritty guys in the line-up and play two of them with Sidney Crosby a good amount of the time! What the ****. The logic on this team is awful, there is absolutely no balance whatsoever.
 

KIRK

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Aug 2, 2005
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KIRK reminded me in the PGT that the Hossa trade happened because management pushed Shero to make the move, so you can't use him as "proof" Shero has made wingers a priority.

The book about the Pens by, I think it was Andrew Conte, had 2 interesting stories:

1. The Hossa trade. Ray was afraid to pull the trigger. Mario's attitude was anything can happen in the playoffs, and a guy like Hossa gives you a better chance to win. Mario basically had to tell him not to be afraid to do it.

2. The Therrien firing. Earlier January 2009, there's an organizational meeting in NY before a game against the Rangers. Ownership pressed Shero on what plans he had to snap the team out of it. His basic answer was 'haven't even thought about a coaching change, always looking for a trade but can't find one'.

Let's get it straight. Ray Shero is risk averse. You can credit him for the Whitney deal. Maybe even the Hossa deal. But, what else since the Pens won the cup?

Gogo for Nisky and Neal? Big ******* deal. Your #5 for a #5 and a goal scoring winger. Some 'risk' there.

Trading Staal. Nope. He had no choice there.

Let Cooke and Talbot walk. Nope. They priced themselves out. Traded TK. Arbitration would've priced him out anyway.

Traded futures. Wow, I'm so impressed by the daring.

Look, in the Hossa deal, Sid's BFF was traded in what legitimately could be considered a deal that risked chemistry. In the Kunitz deal, your #3 defenseman was dealt because you risked trusting a young Letang and others to pick up the minutes.

Ray Shero was a really good GM before the Pens won the cup, not just with those two deals but with a lot of little moves that ALL served the purpose of making the Pens a ***** to play against. His undoing as a GM was the Pens winning the cup.
 

Ragamuffin Gunner

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Shero was schooled by an Org that has had one coach and one GM in their history. A team that has relied heavily on defense and two way forwards. A team that has never made it past the 2nd round of the POs in their existence.

Is that really the team we should be striving to be?
 

KIRK

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BTW, right now, if I'm Ray Shero, my no trade list starts with Sid and, at best (or because of the NTC) ends with Geno.

I'm not going to trade Letang or Neal for the sake of making a deal. But, if someone comes calling with a big offer (say STL, which is so deep that they could legitimately give you two gritty top six wingers for Neal, a sniping type they need, who also is among the poster children for the 'we are family' club here), I don't think you hang up the phone automatically.
 

Jag68Sid87

Sullivan gots to go!
Oct 1, 2003
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BTW, right now, if I'm Ray Shero, my no trade list starts with Sid and, at best (or because of the NTC) ends with Geno.

I'm not going to trade Letang or Neal for the sake of making a deal. But, if someone comes calling with a big offer (say STL, which is so deep that they could legitimately give you two gritty top six wingers for Neal, a sniping type they need, who also is among the poster children for the 'we are family' club here), I don't think you hang up the phone automatically.

Yup. We need to trade actual roster players right now, and we need to fix the offense. AND, we need to start using our defensive depth in better ways. AND, we need to become a LOT tougher to play against, tougher to game-plan against and tougher mentally.

Have I forgotten something?
 

IcedCapp

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Aug 7, 2009
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Yup. We need to trade actual roster players right now, and we need to fix the offense. AND, we need to start using our defensive depth in better ways. AND, we need to become a LOT tougher to play against, tougher to game-plan against and tougher mentally.

Have I forgotten something?

you didn't fire the coach
 

SprootsMasterFlex

Sprootsing 4 Life
Apr 20, 2004
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I've noticed that the Pens have scouted the Avalanche quite a bit this season. I see them as an excellent trade partner. Perhaps Shero is waiting for Scuderi's return but a trade like Niskanen + Jeffrey for Jamie McGinn can be quite realistic.
 

Dipsy Doodle

Rent A Barn
May 28, 2006
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KIRK reminded me in the PGT that the Hossa trade happened because management pushed Shero to make the move, so you can't use him as "proof" Shero has made wingers a priority.

I've never seen evidence to suggest that. Is this what you're referring to?:

With Malkin rolling toward contention for a scoring title and MVP and the Penguins following his lead, ownership and management gathered in Atlanta before the NHL All-Star Game where Hossa, a star right winger for the Thrashers, was the big draw.

Co-owners Mario Lemieux and Ron Burkle had a message for Shero.

“Ron and Mario told him to go after the best player available, don't worry about the money,†Penguins CEO David Morehouse said. “Ray took them at their word and went after Marian Hossa,â€

http://triblive.com/sports/penguins/3508756-74/penguins-hossa-shero#ixzz2kvMjZWK8

Because that's the ownership of a team in an unstable financial situation giving management the green light to acquire a star player with a hefty price tag.

If you or KIRK have something else, I'd like to see it.
 

mpp9

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Dec 5, 2010
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I've noticed that the Pens have scouted the Avalanche quite a bit this season. I see them as an excellent trade partner. Perhaps Shero is waiting for Scuderi's return but a trade like Niskanen + Jeffrey for Jamie McGinn can be quite realistic.

I'm keeping my eyes on Kulemin and McGinn for sure. Hell, add them both if you can. This team needs more of what they bring than skill at the moment IMO.
 

SprootsMasterFlex

Sprootsing 4 Life
Apr 20, 2004
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absolutely.

I see Kulemin signing as a UFA this summer however I don't see the Leafs trading him to a team in the East, especially not the Penguins since it could wake-up Malkin.

McGinn seems much more realistic given that both teams are in different conferences.

On a side note, I'm happy to see Jeffrey getting an opportunity elsewhere. I hope this opens up a spot for another forward. I see Kobasew as a replacement for Jeffrey anyway.
 

mpp9

Registered User
Dec 5, 2010
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absolutely.

We have the Malkin trump card when it comes to free agency with Kule. And McGinn is on a cheap deal and RFA this summer.

This is where it'd be wise for Shero to overpay. 1st round pick. D prospect. Roster D. Get it done O lord of the trades.
 

Jacob

as seen on TV
Feb 27, 2002
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I'm intrigued by the fact that Chris Stewart seems to be struggling in St. Louis. However, they seem all stocked up on D and that's all we really have to trade.
 

SprootsMasterFlex

Sprootsing 4 Life
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We have the Malkin trump card when it comes to free agency with Kule. And McGinn is on a cheap deal and RFA this summer.

This is where it'd be wise for Shero to overpay. 1st round pick. D prospect. Roster D. Get it done O lord of the trades.

Apparently, McGinn has been having an underwhelming season. Perhaps things may change now that Duchene just got hurt and Tanguay's injury may be a little more serious that they first thought but Niskanen with a small sweetner (eg. D'Agostini on a very cheap contract) should be sufficient... and its a deal that would most likely help both teams.
 

SprootsMasterFlex

Sprootsing 4 Life
Apr 20, 2004
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I'm intrigued by the fact that Chris Stewart seems to be struggling in St. Louis. However, they seem all stocked up on D and that's all we really have to trade.

I agree but if Stewart continues to struggle, I can always see considering a deal involving a versatile forward like Jokinen and a promising big-bodied Dman like Despres... Jokinen being the sweetener of course.

Our issue would obviously be cap issues. I guess if the deal would be restructured around Orpik and a young D instead, it would solve that issue. We would then be stuck with too many forwards...
 

mpp9

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Dec 5, 2010
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I'm intrigued by the fact that Chris Stewart seems to be struggling in St. Louis. However, they seem all stocked up on D and that's all we really have to trade.

Yep. Unfortunately I doubt anything would happen this season. But I could see a Perron style trade in the summer to make room for their raises to the core and possibly an upgrade at center. Maybe add a guy like Despres who can replace the likes of Leopold and Jackman in their top 4.
 

mpp9

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Dec 5, 2010
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Apparently, McGinn has been having an underwhelming season. Perhaps things may change now that Duchene just got hurt and Tanguay's injury may be a little more serious that they first thought but Niskanen with a small sweetner (eg. D'Agostini on a very cheap contract) should be sufficient... and its a deal that would most likely help both teams.

I think their fans are starting to realize they need more than one upgrade. They can hold out for that stud top pairing guy for peanuts, but if they want to make the playoffs, they'll likely need to make a move in the next month or so.

With Duchene out now, they'll definitely need to shore things up defensively.
 

Shrimper

Trick or ruddy treat
Feb 20, 2010
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KIRK reminded me in the PGT that the Hossa trade happened because management pushed Shero to make the move, so you can't use him as "proof" Shero has made wingers a priority.

You kind've hope someone will make a similar trade right now. What was that trade in full?

Esposito and ??? For Hossa
 

Shrimper

Trick or ruddy treat
Feb 20, 2010
104,198
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Dupuis just appears everywhere!

Who could we target in a similar deal at the deadline if the management wanted to push for it? I'd be guessing someone from Edmonton, Winnipeg or Toronto? (Eberle, Ladd/Wheeler or Kulemin?)
 

Ogrezilla

Nerf Herder
Jul 5, 2009
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Dupuis just appears everywhere!

Who could we target in a similar deal at the deadline if the management wanted to push for it? I'd be guessing someone from Edmonton, Winnipeg or Toronto? (Eberle, Ladd/Wheeler or Kulemin?)

I have absolutely no idea what other teams actually need so I am terrible at making up trade proposals :laugh:

I would rather go after guys like Kulemin and McGinn than a guy like Eberle though. If we want a high paid wing, he should be someone who gets into a goalies kitchen. That is our biggest need up front. I wouldn't say no to an Eberle deal, it just wouldn't be my top choice.
 
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