Speculation: 2013-14 Free Agent, Trades, and Proposals - Part 9

[pspot]

Krejci is 52 to 55% on FOs
Kadri is 44%

he cannot be a top 6 C unless he improves his faceoffs....no matter how talented he is

so he either improves, goes to the wing or is traded

 

[thewave]

He is freaking 23 he should never be a top 6 on a good team until he is 26 anyways. We should be developing ffs

 

[Faltorvo]

-I'm not disputing Kadri's production; I don't think anyone is. The thing is, he's still not a player coaches and management can trust on the ice and you really never know what you'll get from him.

-Where did I mention ROR?

-I'm simply saying, if you're offered a deal that improves your club through the addition of another young player, you do it.

"a deal that you hope improves your club"

I fixed that for you.

 

[jmart21]

He is freaking 23 he should never be a top 6 on a good team until he is 26 anyways. We should be developing ffs

This is such garbage.

So you're saying that players should be in "development" until they're about the age of:

Crosby
Giroux
Backstrom
Kessel
Kopitar
Hanzal
Neal
Ryan
C.Stewart

 

[pspot]

He is freaking 23 he should never be a top 6 on a good team until he is 26 anyways. We should be developing ffs

What's his value now with those shortcomings vs his value at 26 with the same shortcomings?

what you're saying is right but Nonis and RC have to make decisions on players and maybe they don't feel confident in him improving in the areas they want him too. Maybe they do and this is just a discussion board and just because we talk about it here doesn't mean its actually going to happen.

 

[thewave]

This is such garbage.

So you're saying that players should be in "development" until they're about the age of:

Crosby
Giroux
Backstrom
Kessel
Kopitar
Hanzal
Neal
Ryan
C.Stewart

Lol those are a different category eh, just a tad different than Kadri.

 

[thewave]

What's his value now with those shortcomings vs his value at 26 with the same shortcomings?

what you're saying is right but Nonis and RC have to make decisions on players and maybe they don't feel confident in him improving in the areas they want him too. Maybe they do and this is just a discussion board and just because we talk about it here doesn't mean its actually going to happen.

What was Steens value to us? What is it now? Tell me.

 

[FlareKnight]

I just don't care for moving guys like Kadri or Gardiner at this point. Not like player development is always a steady improvement. Rather not go with the common plan of giving up on someone when his value is lower, getting nothing of importance back, and watch him do well somewhere else where that team had the patience to let him develop.

 

[jmart21]

What was Steens value to us? What is it now? Tell me.

His value to us? Nothing.

He wasn't working here and was moved.

11-years after being drafted and 6yrs in a different organization, he explodes over a 30game streak.

 

[pspot]

What was Steens value to us? What is it now? Tell me.

lower , higher

 

[Cor]

Steen's value with us? Nothing
Steen's value to us now? Nothing

 

[thewave]

His value to us? Nothing.

He wasn't working here and was moved.

11-years after being drafted and 6yrs in a different organization, he explodes over a 30game streak.

Right and that's the time to shop him at this age. Kadri is better than him and if played right can net more return than now. This is how stupid this organization is.

We sell low but high all the time.

 

[Warden of the North]

Link or actual results?

Could you supply some linkage por favor? Would be interesting to see.

Sorry, I cant find it. But I assure you it was posted. There were 6-8 moves that Dreger threw out as possibilities that came to fruition. Not always immediately, but they happened. All in 2013.

But off the top of my head, Dreger called Colborne to Calgary and Gleason for Liles this season already.

Im not sure why everyone bashes him. Hes quite obviously connected.

 

[Cor]

You don't even know if we are selling low, you have no idea on what the return will be.

Really? We always by high? Phil Kessel, Joffery Lupul, Jake Gardiner, Jon Bernier, JVR, Bolland to an extent, Picked up Raymond on the low. Gleason, Franson.

All those players could fetch more now, then what we paid to get for them. The lone one being Gleason, as it's barely been a month, but we still bought low on him

Edit: Also, what players have we sold low on? Alex Steen? Who we didn't even sell low on. Please, tell me

 

[jmart21]

Right and that's the time to shop him at this age. Kadri is better than him and if played right can net more return than now. This is how stupid this organization is.

We sell low but high all the time.

You can't honestly expect every organization to just hang on to every single player they draft in hope that they somehow put it together a decade after being drafted.

If you can move a player like Kadri for a similar young player that better fits the makeup of your team why wouldn't you do it?

...let me guess, because Kadri has "Datsyuk light hands" and is going to be a sure fire PPG player for many years to come and no matter who we trade him for, they will not be as good?

You can't say trading Kadri is a mistake without knowing what the return is.

 

[pspot]

Right and that's the time to shop him at this age. Kadri is better than him and if played right can net more return than now. This is how stupid this organization is.

We sell low but high all the time.

your blood pressure before reading this thread? what is it now? tell me

 

[thewave]

You don't even know if we are selling low, you have no idea on what the return will be.

Really? We always by high? Phil Kessel, Joffery Lupul, Jake Gardiner, Jon Bernier, JVR, Bolland to an extent, Picked up Raymond on the low. Gleason, Franson.

All those players could fetch more now, then what we paid to get for them. The lone one being Gleason, as it's barely been a month, but we still bought low on him.

You watch if we trade it won't be a good one. Nonis stinks at big deals always has. He is only good at your Holland, Bolland type of thing. Ha he even ever made a reasonable hockey trade in his life without Burke?

 

[Warden of the North]

You watch if we trade it won't be a good one. Nonis stinks at big deals always has. He is only good at your Holland, Bolland type of thing. Ha he even ever made a reasonable hockey trade in his life without Burke?

Bernier?

 

[PugFugly]

What was Steens value to us? What is it now? Tell me.

Matt Stajan. Same questions.

The issue with the Steen deal had more to do with the return than the fact he has blossomed into a decent player. IMO Kadri might also benefit from moving to the wing like Steen has in St. Louis.

If we're going to deal him, it sounds like it'll be in a similar deal to the Johnson for Stewart and Shattenkirk and Neal for Goligoski ones. I'd personally be okay with a deal that has Kadri and Couturier as the principle pieces. It's just a matter of what else would be involved and if Nonis can pull it off.

 

[PugFugly]

You watch if we trade it won't be a good one. Nonis stinks at big deals always has. He is only good at your Holland, Bolland type of thing. Ha he even ever made a reasonable hockey trade in his life without Burke?

Luongo?

 

[PugFugly]

Educate yourself, look at the recent histor of the leafs performances with Nonis and go read back when Nonis was GM of Van. You will be learned then.

Nonis is the Bush, of NHL GMs, without the humour.

Several people already have looked at his track record. And it showed one of the biggest trades of the last 20 years. Being patient doesn't mean he won't pull the trigger if the price is right.

There are certainly player with more ability and higher value than Nazem Kadri in the NHL. It's Nonis' job to see if he can get one of them.

I have no idea what that second part means.

 

[BertCorbeau]

What do the Leafs need right now? A top 6 scoring centre (that's reliable in both end of the ice)

Trading Kadri has to net us at least that - however, it would also cost other significant assets (think Gardiner, our first rounder) .. Why are we spending all these assets after we've seen glimpses that Kadri can be that reliable top 6 centre in the future as he keeps developing??

Trading Kadri for prospects/picks doesn't really make sense either

And finally swapping him with another player with similar potential at centre doesn't really make much sense .. If we deal him for a top 4 RHD of similar age based on need, I think that's a huge mistake (akin to the Schenn-JVR deal) since Kadri has the potential to be a bigger impact player

My view: The Leafs are still a young developing team - might as well ride out the growing pains since they're not even into their cup window yet .. There shouldn't be an urgency to 'win now' .. Development and progress takes time

 

[I Believe]

Media makes it sound like "Leafs are desperate to trade Kadri and are willing to sell low", when it's most likely "If Leafs get a good offer that makes sense they might consider it".

I'm sure almost any player is available if the offer is too good to pass up. Wait and see i guess.

 

[hockeywiz542]

http://www.tsn.ca/videohub/?collection=72&show=274786

Talking Trades

The NHL on TSN panel breaks down the moves that the Oilers made Wednesday and discusses the trade rumours involving Nazem Kadri.

According to Darren Dreger:

- At least one NHL team called the Leafs and offered another forward (a winger) who is a decent player.

- The Toronto Maple Leafs must get a centre in return for Nazem Kadri.

- There is a strong chance that Nazem Kadri will be traded by the Toronto Maple Leafs at the NHL trade deadline.

 

[DrizzyTO]

For what though? Package him with Franson or something at the least to get something worthwhile in return.