‘18-19 State of the Ducks Part II - Failed

[KaseMeOutside]

Bob can't say he's tanking

He can say the long term health of the team is of utmost importance

 

[snarktacular]

There was also no rule about signing a 27 year old to a 17 year contract, didn't stop the league from doing something about it.

Bob's said they're doing that, he just hasn't used that exact term, I don't think. He goes much further than that and the league is probably taking notice, especially if he's on the same page as the one you seem to be on.

A 17 year contract with no money at the end is a clear attempt at circumventing the cap.

Pure out tanking is an attempt at violating what? Find me one instance where the NHL has punished any teams for tanking or stating its intentions as such. Or even said so much as a peep about "don't do that." The worst they've done is because of Edmonton's ineptitude (they weren't even tanking), they adjusted the lottery in the future.

When has Bob has said anything of the sort. The best I can recall is something to the effect of "I think we can compete for the playoffs, but maybe we aren't a legit Cup contender at the moment." Then there's things like "guys need to be more accountable" "stand and be counted" etc. "The coach is doing fine." Acquiring vets like Grant, Del Zotto. Bringing back people like Perry, Kesler, etc. What part of this signals rebuild to the paying customers?

Even if there were some kind of rule (which there isn't), there's also a spectrum between "All aboard the tank-train! Dive, dive dive!" and "This team can't make the playoffs, we're going to focus on developing our young players for next year."

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

A 17 year contract with no money at the end is a clear attempt at circumventing the cap.

Pure out tanking is an attempt at violating what? Find me one instance where the NHL has punished any teams for tanking or stating its intentions as such. Or even said so much as a peep about "don't do that." The worst they've done is because of Edmonton's ineptitude (they weren't even tanking), they adjusted the lottery in the future.

When has Bob has said anything of the sort. The best I can recall is something to the effect of "I think we can compete for the playoffs, but maybe we aren't a legit Cup contender at the moment." Then there's things like "guys need to be more accountable" "stand and be counted" etc. "The coach is doing fine." Acquiring vets like Grant, Del Zotto. Bringing back people like Perry, Kesler, etc. What part of this signals rebuild to the paying customers?

Even if there were some kind of rule (which there isn't), there's also a spectrum between "All aboard the tank-train! Dive, dive dive!" and "This team can't make the playoffs, we're going to focus on developing our young players for next year."

Which still had no rule against it. It's also no different than the many other teams who signed long term deals and could still be punished for it despite not violating a rule.

The league has never punished anyone for it because since the Penguins in 1984 no one's really done it in a blatant way. They absolutely would go after someone for blatantly being non-competitive, especially since revenue sharing now exists.

None of your quotes are remotely close to real, BTW. He did talk in The Athletic about how he doesn't think this transition won't have to be a total tear it down and rebuild for years kind of thing, he thinks it'll be quick, but he absolutely didn't say any of the made up shit you seem to think he did.

 

[snarktacular]

Which still had no rule against it. It's also no different than the many other teams who signed long term deals and could still be punished for it despite not violating a rule.

The league has never punished anyone for it because since the Penguins in 1984 no one's really done it in a blatant way. They absolutely would go after someone for blatantly being non-competitive, especially since revenue sharing now exists.

None of your quotes are remotely close to real, BTW. He did talk in The Athletic about how he doesn't think this transition won't have to be a total tear it down and rebuild for years kind of thing, he thinks it'll be quick, but he absolutely didn't say any of the made up **** you seem to think he did.

No there is explicitly a rule about circumventing the cap.

Excerpt from 26.3:
No Club or Club Actor, directly or indirectly, may: (i) enter into any agreements, promises, undertakings, representations, commitments, inducements, assurances of intent, or understandings of any kind, whether express, implied, oral or written, including without limitation, any SPC, Qualifying Offer, Offer Sheet or other transaction, or (ii) take or fail to take any action whatsoever, if either (i) or (ii) is intended to or has the effect of defeating or Circumventing the provisions of this Agreement or the intention of the parties as reflected by the provisions of this Agreement

All of those quotes are actually paraphrasings, and he's said all of them. I don't really care enough if you believe me to try to look them up. Most of them were around the time they asked about firing Carlyle during the 12 game losing streak, or just before Cogs was dealt.

I don't read anything from the Athletic, so if he did say something about "this transition" then that is something. He should tell these to the customers more directly though. He can't rely on pay sites to reach them.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

Can't he just take notes from Dean Lombardi about what happened to Mike Richards? And it should be much easier for Kesler considering he lives in Detroit in the offseason.

No, because the Mike Richards joke is getting old and isn't serious. Robidas Island merely circumvents league rules and the league doesn't seem to interested in stopping it. It worked nicely for the Leafs.

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

No there is explicitly a rule about circumventing the cap.

Excerpt from 26.3:
No Club or Club Actor, directly or indirectly, may: (i) enter into any agreements, promises, undertakings, representations, commitments, inducements, assurances of intent, or understandings of any kind, whether express, implied, oral or written, including without limitation, any SPC, Qualifying Offer, Offer Sheet or other transaction, or (ii) take or fail to take any action whatsoever, if either (i) or (ii) is intended to or has the effect of defeating or Circumventing the provisions of this Agreement or the intention of the parties as reflected by the provisions of this Agreement

All of those quotes are actually paraphrasings, and he's said all of them. I don't really care enough if you believe me to try to look them up. Most of them were around the time they asked about firing Carlyle during the 12 game losing streak, or just before Cogs was dealt.

I don't read anything from the Athletic, so if he did say something about "this transition" then that is something. He should tell these to the customers more directly though. He can't rely on pay sites to reach them.

Lol no he did not, especially about the coach being fine, literally the only thing he said was that he wasn't considering a change. Never said anything about competing for the playoffs, either. He did go after the players but that's quite different and not at all in odds with any kind of rebuild.

I don't think it's just The Athletic, but either way this has been no secret. Between his moves(including picking up those vets so the kids didn't have to be here) and what he's said pretty much since last season ended, it's been pretty obvious. I don't think it's at all necessary to go full Rangers and put something on Facebook(not that an old school guy like Murray would ever do that).

 

[Bender66]

No, because the Mike Richards joke is getting old and isn't serious. Robidas Island merely circumvents league rules and the league doesn't seem to interested in stopping it. It worked nicely for the Leafs.

This.
Robidas island, Lupul atoll, Hossa archipelago.
Next stop on the cap relief cruise: Kesler keys.

 

[Anaheim4ever]

This.
Robidas island, Lupul atoll, Hossa archipelago.
Next stop on the cap relief cruise: Kesler keys.

Since he lives in Michigan in offseason & his last name is Germanic: Kesler Forrest, an American Black Forrest with castles, breweries, beerhalls serving authentic curry wurst & saurerbraten.

 

[MMC]

 

[Static]

Was kind of thinking about the Kesler thing. I think I'd be surprised if Kesler was this summer because of the CBA coming up soon. If there are compliance buyouts again it would be a huge bummer if Kesler's was still on the calendar because we didn't wait a few months.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

I thought there was some report a while back that Kesler’s contract was insured. If so, a medically initiated retirement would be very financially beneficial.

 

[AngelDuck]

I thought there was some report a while back that Kesler’s contract was insured. If so, a medically initiated retirement would be very financially beneficial.

the holdup there is that he has to agree to want to end his career. I'm not sure I see that happening before next season

 

[Sean Garrity]

Kesler isn't the problem, his implementation is.

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

the holdup there is that he has to agree to want to end his career. I'm not sure I see that happening before next season

Well, he might not really have a say in the matter. I wouldn't doubt if his hypothetical challenge would go as well as Lupul's last year.

I also could see it. Pride works both ways and I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't want to continue being a shell of himself. I remember when people used to rip Mark Messier for hanging on too long and he was still a pretty decent player, I don't think any athlete ever wants to be that guy.

 

[AngelDuck]

Well, he might not really have a say in the matter. I wouldn't doubt if his hypothetical challenge would go as well as Lupul's last year.

I also could see it. Pride works both ways and I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't want to continue being a shell of himself. I remember when people used to rip Mark Messier for hanging on too long and he was still a pretty decent player, I don't think any athlete ever wants to be that guy.

Of course he has a say in the matter. If he wants to continue playing, there is nothing the Ducks can do about that as long as he is still being medically cleared by the doctors.

They need to buy him out if that's the case

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

the holdup there is that he has to agree to want to end his career. I'm not sure I see that happening before next season

It certainly makes it easier if Kesler buys in. And I know nobody wants an internal fight, but this is where Bob needs to step up and diplomatically force the issue. Bob needs to do his job, that’s why he makes the big bucks. If Kesler really wants to earn his money, let him intern for a front office job so he can still be connected to the team. He and Randy can share an office.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

Kesler isn't the problem, his implementation is.

You're partially correct

He's over exposed but he's also no longer effective

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

Of course he has a say in the matter. If he wants to continue playing, there is nothing the Ducks can do about that as long as he is still being medically cleared by the doctors.

They need to buy him out if that's the case

That's pretty much what Robidas Island was. If they go that route, he might fight it, but I'm certainly not betting on the guy with an arthritic hip to win.

I'm not totally opposed to a buyout but I also don't like the idea of keeping his money on the books for six seasons instead of maybe dealing with him for two(which they're probably not gonna be competitive anyway). I'd rather just ride it out.

 

[Anaheim4ever]

I'd rather they keep playing Kesler this year to help the Tank. Keep giving him PP minutes.
Especially since the players got their wish & Carlyle is gone, can't let them screw up a chance at Hughes/Kakko/Cozens/Turcotte

 

[pbgoalie]

NMC
Doesn’t mean you have to play him the way Randy did
Heck, it doesn’t mean you have to play him at all

Sit his ass until he’s healthy or a decision is made

 

[MMC]

 

[Dryish]

No morning skates? It sounds like Bob is just telling the guys to go out there and do whatever they want to at this point.

 

[Static]

Yeah that's really interesting. Loosening up as much as possible? This is going to be a weird stretch.

 

[dracom]

maybe the team will actually have the energy to play a full 60 minutes?

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

I attended practice today. At the end they took about half the guys to one end of the rink and practiced breakaways on Miller. When a guy scored they went into celebration mode (some more funny than others) threw off their gloves and sticks and laid on the ice at the blue line while the guys who failed to score kept taking turns with the breakaways. The sideline guys would cheer on the other guys until they all scored. Miller even hammed it up after a great save. Don't know what Bob told them but he definitely wants to lighten things up a little.

Not sure why the other half of the guys had to practice tip drills and screening of the goalie at the other end of the ice.