GDT: WWE Survivor Series (Nov. 20, 2016) -- lolol 6 hours in Toronto

[GKJ]

So much Vince Russo logic in this thread. It's nice that the crowd ate it up, but getting a one-off pop from a crowd at one show is not worth murdering your strongest wrestler.

They could have used the streak rub to help cement a current wrestler but instead it goes to Goldberg. And they had an advertised main event match go for 60 seconds.

It was a farce and it will make a mess of the booking long term. Is that worth one pop?

Lesnar rub we all know is going to Roman Reigns anyways. It's not like they were going to do much with it.

 

[SeidoN]

 

[Kimi]

He doesn't have any right now

He has missed so much money over the years because of that. Which kinda sucks 'cos I'd also have bunch more shirts.

 

[Kimi]

10/10.

 

[GarbageGoal]

Vince Russo booking would dictate James Ellsworth pinning Lesnar or Goldberg tonight.

 

[Le Tricolore]

The RAW vs SD men's match was great.

The main event was way better than I thought it'd be. I was actually entertained when I thought it'd be unwatchable.

The rest of the show was nothing special.

 

[TNT87]

My sentiments exactly.

 

[SeidoN]

one thing I will say.... were there any expectations going into this PPV that werent completely juked

Miz retained
CW didnt move brands
SD Men went over
Reigns didnt 1v5 for the win
Shane was entertaining
Score wasnt 1-1 heading into the mens match
Ambrose as the full on heel
Ellsworth got involved without being annoying
Goldberg beat Lesnar

I dont agree with it all but man what twists and turns. definitely felt like a big ppv

 

[M.C.G. 31]

Lesnar's the one who actually wanted to prolong the Goldberg rivalry and didn't want it to be a one-off. The finish wasn't made to protect Goldberg after his injuries, but to keep him over and book a WCW-style match.

 

[SeidoN]

so Randy Orton is like all time SS MVP now yeah

 

[Kimi]

one thing I will say.... were there any expectations going into this PPV that werent completely juked

Miz retained
CW didnt move brands
SD Men went over
Reigns didnt 1v5 for the win
Shane was entertaining
Score wasnt 1-1 heading into the mens match
Ambrose as the full on heel
Ellsworth got involved without being annoying
Goldberg beat Lesnar

I dont agree with it all but man what twists and turns. definitely felt like a big ppv

I think it was a really good show overall. Far better than I expected (and I always expect a 'good' show at a minimum from PPVs). For nothing matches, they made them very entertaining, which is great.

As for the Lesnar and Goldberg stuff, I'm actually fine with it. Goldberg at the top of the legend tier list, so the result was fine for me. Especially as he's sticking about for a longer program, so this was the right way of doing it.

 

[KesselBuiltMyHotrod]

It was a good show, just like I told you.

 

[Fro]

can't believe I made it through the entire Lesner/Goldberg match again...

 

[Virtanen18]

It was a good show, just like I told you.

How many PPVs in a row is that now where HF ***** all over it before it starts before it ends up being good-to-great shows?

 

[Kimi]

How many PPVs in a row is that now where HF ***** all over it before it starts before it ends up being good-to-great shows?

All of them.

 

[UnrealMachine]

My overall impression withstanding, I strongly disliked the ending to women's match. If that non sequitur ending wasn't bad enough, it was followed by WWE opting for the insta-Bayley feud with Charlotte going forward. And that doesn't even touch on the horrendous misuse of Sasha. She could have at least been eliminated in a more respectable fashion? It really sucks because there were so many good things about that match before it all fell apart, in my opinion.

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

How many PPVs in a row is that now where HF ***** all over it before it starts before it ends up being good-to-great shows?

A couple. They still aren't consistently good though, not from what I have seen anyway. At least HF does seem to admit when a show is good even if they expect it to be crap, so our evaluations don't seem too biased.

 

[GKJ]

My overall impression withstanding, I strongly disliked the ending to women's match. If that non sequitur ending wasn't bad enough, it was followed by WWE opting for the insta-Bayley feud with Charlotte going forward. And that doesn't even touch on the horrendous misuse of Sasha. She could have at least been eliminated in a more respectable fashion? It really sucks because there were so many good things about that match before it all fell apart, in my opinion.

Distracted rollup isn't an awful way to lose. It was better than how they had some other people they were pushing leave. She should have been beaten by Becky, though. It's not good that the feud with Charlotte is going to end without her being the champion too.

 

[scrubadam]

So has the whole wrestling world worked themselves into a shoot here?

I think it was awesome that they had Goldberg win with 3 moves and in 90 seconds. Its like a Tyson fight with a 1st rd knockout. You don't see that in wrestling anymore every match needs to be a 5 star 20 minute classic that "wows" the fans so they chant fight forever or this is awesome.

And now their is intrigue in a rematch. and TBH a 15 minute match between the 2 would of been brutal. When I see a Lesnar match I want a spectacle something I won't see with the regular roster. Maybe thats a match like with Cena that felt "real" or ending of the streak with taker, or suplex city, or knocking out a wrestler and having them bleed all over the ring. Lesnar brings that big fight feel and his matches usually give you something you don't see every day. While thats what I got with the Goldberg match.

And everyone talking about how all the people that jobbed to Lesnar are wasted now, you think the WWE knew that Goldberg was coming back 3 years ago or even 3 months ago? Its not like when Lesnar ended the streak Vince forsaw in 3 years Goldberg would come back and his plan was all along to make everyone look weak for Goldberg.

 

[scrubadam]

Well, I couldn't tell you the last time I actually tuned into Raw (granted, I did tune in for the closing segment last week), but I'm going to be watching tomorrow. However, I couldn't care less about anyone who wasn't in the last two matches of SS.

I have no doubt that they'll see a big spike in the ratings, but what matters more is their long-term plan. Every night can't be like the last hour of SS, so how do you plan on keeping the casual/disillusioned fans interested?

WWE is event driven, its their business model. 4 times a year they put on an event weekend of Wrestling with Takeover/4 hour PPV/RAW/Smackdown. Ratings are ratings which are down for almost everyone. Whats more important is network subscriptions and social media. WWE is a publically traded company and those two components are easy sells to investors.

Lets be honest you think Kevin Owens pinning Lesnar will turn him into the next Austin and cause an explosion in the business? For wrestling to be really mainstream it just needs to be the right time and right place and you need the right personalities. Today's wrestlers are more athletic then ever, but as far as charisma and personality they can't hold a candle to guys from the past. So WWE needs to focus on their events. Lesnar/Goldberg helped sell SS and if the rematch is at the RR it will help sell that.

 

[scrubadam]

Reigns would get **** on which is exactly the problem with WWE right now. Their only big stars are nostalgia acts. If that match had any full timer it would have been booed because the fans would feel ripped off. Because of nostalgia, Goldberg gets a good reaction for a terrible match because he was cool 18 years ago.

Nostalgia is all well and good, but it is the main draw in WWE right now and that doesn't work. WWE has great talents like Owens and Styles but they have a leash put on them. They are always going to be a step below the part timers. Owens and Styles were pushed into the backround so they could build the show around a squash between 2 part timers. It's insanity.

What happens with these nostalgia acts? They get interest from former fans who feel nostalgic. What happens to the former fans who tuned in to see Goldberg? They don't stay when Goldberg is gone. And WWE wonders why it's entire audience is slowly eroding away.

I love Owens and AJ but these guys couldn't hold Goldbergs jock when it comes to charisma/personality/mainstream appeal. They are way more athletic, know how to wrestle better, but they don't have the same package and appeal as a guy like Goldberg. And that goes for most wrestlers today. They don't have the ability to get over and connect with a mainstream/casual audience that stars of the past did.

Maybe thats because the curtain is pulled to far back I don't know but where are the guys like Warrior/Macho/Hogan/Goldberg? Guys who weren't just wrestlers, they were larger than life characters that you really felt could kick your ass. I look at KO (who I really like) and I don't see some guy who I think could kick my ass and is a super hero/villian I see a guy who works the home depot night shift.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

what the **** was that main event?

2+ years undefeated and brock loses in 2 minutes? LOOOOOOOOOL.

 

[Virtanen18]

A couple. They still aren't consistently good though, not from what I have seen anyway. At least HF does seem to admit when a show is good even if they expect it to be crap, so our evaluations don't seem too biased.

I think they've been pretty consistently good for a little while now. There was so much fear the brand split was gonna **** everything up, but it hasn't. In fact, it probably helped Survivor Series.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

Obviously lesnar and goldberg will have another match there's no way you do that unless you are.

 

[dubey]

Still can't get over how loud the Goldberg chants were last night

What a moment