Will the Flames upgrade the bottom defense pairing for next year

[SmellOfVictory]

I'd be okay with;

Gio - Green
Brodie - Engelland
Wideman - Russell

Three solid pairings that can play multiple situations. However, I don't think Green will sign here.

Brodie prefers the right side, and Engelland shouldn't be anywhere near the 2nd pairing. I'd break up Russell/Wideman a billion times before breaking up Brodano.

 

[Calculon]

No reason for Giordano to carry Brodie for a full season.

Seriously?

 

[Lunatik]

Seriously?

If Engelland can bring down Brodie's play, why can't Brodie bring down Giordano's play?

Giordano is a superior defenseman to Brodie, just like Brodie is superior to Engelland. When Brodie was no longer playing with Giordano his play dropped. Everyone likes to attribute it to Engelland but it also coincided with Giordano getting hurt.

For the record, I am just pointing out how flawed and ridiculous your statement is.

edit:

for Flames Maniac

 

[Bouma Fett*]

You forgot to drop the mic there Third Graders

 

[Lunatik]

You forgot to drop the mic there Third Graders

better?

 

[Lunatik]

I would also like to point out with Brodie playing with a sprained ankle I would suggest that is the most probable reason for any decline in his play.

 

[Bouma Fett*]

better?

Much.

 

[Calculon]

If Engelland can bring down Brodie's play, why can't Brodie bring down Giordano's play?

Giordano is a superior defenseman to Brodie, just like Brodie is superior to Engelland. When Brodie was no longer playing with Giordano his play dropped. Everyone likes to attribute it to Engelland but it also coincided with Giordano getting hurt.

For the record, I am just pointing out how flawed and ridiculous your statement is.
[/IMG]

Not nearly as ridiculous as your emotional argument. Because the underlying stats going back to last year show that Giordano was worse playing with anyone else, just like Brodie was. Together, both were better than on separate pairings.

Amazing how quickly a little bit of criticism can make a player so overrated by knee jerk defenders.

Actual stats from last year:

This has been asked quite frequently by a number of outside fans.
Is Brodie being carried by Gio's outstanding play? Is Brodie the key in Gio's turnaround year?

Some simple numbers to answer:

Brodie w/o Gio: Goals-for %: 40.4%. Possession (corsi) %: 47.4%
Gio w/o Brodie: Goals-for %: 44.4%. Possession %: 47.7%

Together: GF%: 56.9% Possession %: 57.6%

Match made in heaven.​

 

[Lunatik]

Not nearly as ridiculous as your emotional argument. Because the underlying stats going back to last year show that Giordano was worse playing with anyone else, just like Brodie was. Together, both were better than on separate pairings.

Amazing how quickly a little bit of criticism can make a player so overrated.

Overrated? I have never suggest Engelland is more than a 3rd pairing defensemen. I just think that it's ridiculous to blame Engelland for Brodie's "decline" which as I have stated was more likely caused by his sprained ankle.


to your edit, advanced stats to me mean very little. They are the 21st centuries +/-

 

[Pirate King Luffy]

Overrated? I have never suggest Engelland is more than a 3rd pairing defensemen. I just think that it's ridiculous to blame Engelland for Brodie's "decline" which as I have stated was more likely caused by his sprained ankle.


to your edit, advanced stats to me mean very little. They are the 21st centuries +/-

A bit of a stretch. They are definitely more telling than +/-.

 

[Lunatik]

A bit of a stretch. They are definitely more telling than +/-.

not without any context and/or watching the games.

 

[Calculon]

Overrated? I have never suggest Engelland is more than a 3rd pairing defensemen. I just think that it's ridiculous to blame Engelland for Brodie's "decline" which as I have stated was more likely caused by his sprained ankle.

Not what was said. Fact is, Brodie and Giordano are indeed better together as both complement each other. A top pairing defensemen in Brodie paired with a number one in Giordano is naturally going to be better than a top pairing defensemen and a bottom pairing defensemen. That's it.

to your edit, advanced stats to me mean very little. They are the 21st centuries +/-

Stats are stats. In the right context, they're plenty useful. Dismissing them out of hand is frankly ridiculous.

 

[Pirate King Luffy]

not without any context and/or watching the games.

Perhaps, but they give you a better idea than +/-. At least then with the GF% Possession %: we can see why there +/- could be that high or that low or why they have as many points as they do. Just examples. I agree advanced stats are meh, but they are certainly reliable in the right context. To lower them to just being the equivalent of +/- is a bit ridiculous.

 

[Lunatik]

Not what was said. Fact is, Brodie and Giordano are indeed better together as both complement each other. A top pairing defensemen in Brodie paired with a number one in Giordano is naturally going to be better than a top pairing defensemen and a bottom pairing defensemen. That's it.


Stats are stats. In the right context, they're plenty useful. Dismissing them out of hand is frankly ridiculous.

No you just said Brodie was "carrying" Engelland which completely dismisses Engelland stepping up his game.

And I never suggested Brodie and Giordano didn't compliment each other, I also never suggested splitting them up.

I just think your dismissal of Engelland's play down the stretch is ridiculous.

And I was diminishing those stats because corsi is probably more useless than +/-. If soemone wants to measure possession numbers, here is a novel idea. USE POSSESSION NUMBERS. Track possession time, it's a complicated way of saying absolutely jack squat and giving no context.

 

[Calculon]

Meh, interpret it how you want.

I highly doubt Engelland would have looked nearly as proficient if paired alongside Wideman.

 

[Lunatik]

Meh, interpret it how you want.

I highly doubt Engelland would have looked nearly as proficient if paired alongside Wideman.

That was my point, better defensemen make guys better. whether that be Gio or Brodie. It's still stupid to say they are carrying them.

 

[OvermanKingGainer]

I would also like to point out with Brodie playing with a sprained ankle I would suggest that is the most probable reason for any decline in his play.

Really?

Engelland, who was the team's worst possession player by a huge margin as a 3rd pairing defenseman against 4th lines, was less probable to why Brodie/Engelland pairing was probably the worst possession pairing in the NHL than Brodie being nicked up, even though Brodie had games where he looked like Playoff Mode Drew Doughty out there and his possession stats when paired with Schlemko or Diaz skyrocketted, in some cases to the point of a comeback in a 0-4 game triggered by the Brodie-Diaz pairing?

Also, I'm not sure why people are convinced Engelland "stepped up". He had one hell of a game against Dallas, one of the worst defensive teams in the NHL, and he had a fight against the Canucks. Beyond that, he was a total liability on Brodie's pairing, while neither Schlemko nor Diaz were.

 

[Pirate King Luffy]

That was my point, better defensemen make guys better. whether that be Gio or Brodie. It's still stupid to say they are carrying them.

He could have definitely stepped up while Brodie still carried him.

 

[Brue Frames]

Good to see our players trying to influence the FA market in favour of the flames! man, imagine if Brad is able to sign this this kid. i would be so happy

 

[Pirate King Luffy]

Good to see our players trying to influence the FA market in favour of the flames! man, imagine if Brad is able to sign this this kid. i would be so happy

I think Johnny and Arnold tried to convince Kevin Hayes as well. He ultimately chose the Rangers and it's working out for him.

 

[OvermanKingGainer]

I think Johnny and Arnold tried to convince Kevin Hayes as well. He ultimately chose the Rangers and it's working out for him.

Man, would that have been epic though to have all three of the BC Big 3

 

[CraigsList]

I think Johnny and Arnold tried to convince Kevin Hayes as well. He ultimately chose the Rangers and it's working out for him.

Reilly would easily be our best defenseman prospect if he signed with us. Hayes would have to battle for a forward spot here had he chosen Calgary.

The situation is different imo.

 

[AgeOfBennett]

I don't know much about Reilly, but didn't he get drafted by Columbus? I guess they didn't sign him to an ELC then right? What are the best aspects of his game, and aspects needing work?

 

[Lunatik]

I don't know much about Reilly, but didn't he get drafted by Columbus? I guess they didn't sign him to an ELC then right? What are the best aspects of his game, and aspects needing work?

if you ask CBJ fans he needs more integrity

 

[OvermanKingGainer]

I don't know much about Reilly, but didn't he get drafted by Columbus? I guess they didn't sign him to an ELC then right?

They tried, as far back as last year. He refused to sign.

What are the best aspects of his game, and aspects needing work?

Best aspects: Elite-tier Skating, quality puck-handling and offensive skill, decent size
Need Work: Defensive zone, physicality, decision-making

I've mentioned it before, but I don't think Rielly is really that much better a prospect than a Culkin.