Why retooling is the best option for the Habs

[Saxon]

Umm yea? I clearly said that was completely hypothetical. My main point is addressing the centre position will turn this team around. A tank doesnt guarantee anything either. So if we want to talk about getting elite players from a tank, then ill use getting elite guys like Tavares and Dahlin to make my point. The thing about Tavares is hes an already proven player where as anyone we draft could be Yakupov, Stefan, Daigle.

Nothing is guaranteed... Period. But a tank and rebuild gives us the best chance. That's a plan that can work...... Not just a fantasy....

 

[mariolemieux66]

Umm yea? I clearly said that was completely hypothetical. My main point is addressing the centre position will turn this team around. A tank doesnt guarantee anything either. So if we want to talk about getting elite players from a tank, then ill use getting elite guys like Tavares and Dahlin to make my point. The thing about Tavares is hes an already proven player where as anyone we draft could be Yakupov, Stefan, Daigle.

Other teams with much better management, core players, prospects and style of play can be a better destination for Tavares, Vegas, St Louis, San Jose and even the Islanders if they traded for a Holtby or Price.

 

[NobleSix]

Youre looking at it wrong. You included Benn. I didnt. You have Juulsen on the left. Hes a right and will be bottom pair. Petry is the number 2 right D. He can skate, pass, shoot and defend.

Yep, forgot petry, derp.

Still, doesn't look good, and by no means set.

 

[mariolemieux66]

I thought he looked good in his first half season. Im sure he could benefit from time in Laval, but he really impressed me from what i saw this season.

Youre right Weber might not be the same, but has the same % chance of coming back just as good as he was. I dont think Price wants to get out. He loves Montreal. He wants to win here. According to him anyway. Of course he has to say it, but I dont think he would have signed the extension as early as he did if he never.

I think Bergevin has set himself up nicely this offseason. He has loaded up on picks, he has 4 second rounders. He could potentially get another first depending on what way he goes with trading Pacioretty. I feel he should use him to get a centre though.

He has the tools to turn the team around. If he fails to do so, then he should be fired. But Molson has said he trusts him, and they have a plan.

Those 2nd round picks will not be ready for another 3 to 4 years unless we luck out on a Debrincat. And Bergevin sets himself up to get fired, should have been fired already.

 

[Phozzwald]

Let’s say they draft Tkachuk, get ROR, and sign Stastny, this team still has a very hard time competing against TB, Boston, and Toronto, and other top teams.

I still don’t know who they give up for ROR, Pacioretty definitely won’t land him, it would have to Galchenyuk + or a 1st round pick.

I’m also scared of the deal and term Bergevin will give to Stastny to get him to sign.

If the Habs address the centre position they can easily compete with a team like Toronto. Toronto is actually a good example, as they have a absolute brutal defence, but finished 3rd in the atlantic. Montreal's D that I have listed is superior to Toronto's. Addressing the centres with this wing group including Drouin,would compete with Toronto's forwards. Habs win the goalie duel.

I hear ya on the Stastny contract. Im weary on that as well because im afraid of term. If its a short term deal then im not concerned.

 

[Phozzwald]

Yep, forgot petry, derp.

Still, doesn't look good, and by no means set.

Ill never call it elite. But it is serviceable. Much better than the 3rd place Maple Leafs defence thats for sure.

 

[Captain Mountain]

If you think Montreal's D is close to being good then I have a bridge to sell you.

I did watch, and I am watching. The Habs could not score. But compare the line up in last years playoffs to what we would have now. Add Tavares. The D is younger and faster. Add a top 5 pick from this years draft. All of which are NHL ready.
Hypothetical roster: Lets say habs and sabres make a deal involving Pacioretty and Oreilly and they win the lottery.
( Again, hypothetical)

Drouin-Tavares-Gallagher
Galchenyuk- O'Reilly-Scherbak
Lehkonen-Danault-Hudon
Byron-De La Rose-Shaw
Deslauriers

Dahlin-Weber
Mete-Petry
Alzner-Juulsen
Reilly

Price
Lindgren

Is that not a line up that could compete each and every night? I cant see how tanking for 3 years gets you anything guaranteed like this.

If that's close to realistic, then so is Montreal winning the next 3 lottery's and uncovering gems with later picks.

And Dahlin is the only D in the draft that's NHL ready.

 

[Phozzwald]

Those 2nd round picks will not be ready for another 3 to 4 years unless we luck out on a Debrincat. And Bergevin sets himself up to get fired, should have been fired already.

Having so many could allow you to move up in the draft, or trade for better pieces. It gives you a lot of options. Even if you do draft them, having 4 gives you a good shot at finding a gem.

 

[Price is Wright]

Retooling is a great option for increasing the length of the inevitable long-term rebuild, missing out on superstars like Hughes and Lafreniere, and anchoring this club with several damaged goods players who could have been traded when they had something in the tank but the club instead grinded them to dust in seasons where there was no chance to compete for a Cup. By 2019-2020 you'll have an organization with absolutely no chance of going anywhere and players who don't want to play there anymore, and will now embark on a long term rebuild which will take the majority of the 2020 decade instead of being able to move players now close to their prime, stockpile assets, get great players for the next three drafts, and be ready to build a contender in 2020-2021.

I honestly don't believe anyone suggesting a retool actually believes the Canadiens can win a Cup with a retool. They just hate the idea of a rebuild.

 

[Phozzwald]

If you think Montreal's D is close to being good then I have a bridge to sell you.



If that's close to realistic, then so is Montreal winning the next 3 lottery's and uncovering gems with later picks.

And Dahlin is the only D in the draft that's NHL ready.

A lot of people saying Boqvist is as well. Dahlin is on a completely different level though.

 

[habsfan909]

If the Habs address the centre position they can easily compete with a team like Toronto. Toronto is actually a good example, as they have a absolute brutal defence, but finished 3rd in the atlantic. Montreal's D that I have listed is superior to Toronto's. Addressing the centres with this wing group including Drouin,would compete with Toronto's forwards. Habs win the goalie duel.

I hear ya on the Stastny contract. Im weary on that as well because im afraid of term. If its a short term deal then im not concerned.

IF the Habs address the centre position? You mean the one they haven't addressed in over 20 years and you think suddenly that will happen. Ok sure.
IF Drouin becomes a good winger. Even on Tampa playing the wing on a top line he was ineffective. Almost all his production came as a power play specialist.
Toronto will have the best player on the ice against us for the next decade. I don't think you are seeing the reality of the Habs franchise right now. We are not on the upswing. We are downtrending and BADLY. The clear sign of a team's future is often in the farm system and ours has zip. When you look at teams at the bottom of the league the ones with a lot of youth coming up to the league have a chance. The rest do not.
That is why we have a chance to be good in 5 years.
Also accept reality that big name free agents DO NOT want to play here. Tavares isn't coming.
All we can do is pray for Dahlin (less than 10% chance) and also hope Marc is fired at some point.

 

[habsfan909]

Retooling is a great option for increasing the length of the inevitable long-term rebuild, missing out on superstars like Hughes and Lafreniere, and anchoring this club with several damaged goods players who could have been traded when they had something in the tank but the club instead grinded them to dust in seasons where there was no chance to compete for a Cup. By 2019-2020 you'll have an organization with absolutely no chance of going anywhere and players who don't want to play there anymore, and will now embark on a long term rebuild which will take the majority of the 2020 decade instead of being able to move players now close to their prime, stockpile assets, get great players for the next three drafts, and be ready to build a contender in 2020-2021.

I honestly don't believe anyone suggesting a retool actually believes the Canadiens can win a Cup with a retool. They just hate the idea of a rebuild.

DING DING DING... the longer we retool, the longer we don't take the steps to being a contender. Heck, we've been doing it for 20+ years.

 

[Runner77]

Habs are retooling. Replacing Daigneault by Lefebvre is exactly that. Replacing a tool by another.

Under-the-radar post deserves better. Nicely done.

 

[Captain Mountain]

A lot of people saying Boqvist is as well. Dahlin is on a completely different level though.

Boqvist may make it, but its very unlikely he has much of an impact.

 

[Runner77]

Called the D serviceable. Never said they were elite. Named a franchise changing Defenceman, because its very possible it happens. This does not say that they are not set at defence. All it says is that its highly possible they get Dahlin.

Come on, they don't own the best odds to get Dahlin. The fantasies that are being farted out in this thread. Puh-lease, give it up.

It's not highly possible, it's just possible. Highly possible are Buffalo's chances.

 

[Phozzwald]

Retooling is a great option for increasing the length of the inevitable long-term rebuild, missing out on superstars like Hughes and Lafreniere, and anchoring this club with several damaged goods players who could have been traded when they had something in the tank but the club instead grinded them to dust in seasons where there was no chance to compete for a Cup. By 2019-2020 you'll have an organization with absolutely no chance of going anywhere and players who don't want to play there anymore, and will now embark on a long term rebuild which will take the majority of the 2020 decade instead of being able to move players now close to their prime, stockpile assets, get great players for the next three drafts, and be ready to build a contender in 2020-2021.

I honestly don't believe anyone suggesting a retool actually believes the Canadiens can win a Cup with a retool. They just hate the idea of a rebuild.

Not the case. I very much believe that the Habs can win with a retool. Especially if they can sign Tavares and do win the lottery this season. Even if they get a guy like Zadina, Svechnikov or Tkachuk, it will open up another trade chip for the Habs. There is 31 teams in the league, soon to be 32. Obviously no matter what they do will guarantee a cup. But i feel with the right centres added to this group, they could. Take Vegas for example, who really thought that team could do what they did with that roster. Nobody. The Habs will actually have elite level players in their core to make a run at the cup IF they address the centre position

 

[Phozzwald]

Come on, they don't own the best odds to get Dahlin. The fantasies that are being farted out in this thread. Puh-lease, give it up.

It's not highly possible, it's just possible. Highly possible are Buffalo's chances.

We have the fourth best odds. Not that bad i dont think. Jersey got Hischier in the same position

 

[Runner77]

If the Habs address the centre position they can easily compete with a team like Toronto. Toronto is actually a good example, as they have a absolute brutal defence, but finished 3rd in the atlantic. Montreal's D that I have listed is superior to Toronto's. Addressing the centres with this wing group including Drouin,would compete with Toronto's forwards. Habs win the goalie duel.

Where is Montreal's version of Babcock? What about their management team? Pro and amateur scouting? AHL team and organizational depth? Development? We "easily" compete with Toronto?

If you don't throw out the country club, you're going to get nowhere near what Toronto has done. Bergevin may have fooled Molson, but that doesn't mean he's fooled us.

 

[Price is Wright]

Not the case. I very much believe that the Habs can win with a retool. Especially if they can sign Tavares and do win the lottery this season. Even if they get a guy like Zadina, Svechnikov or Tkachuk, it will open up another trade chip for the Habs. There is 31 teams in the league, soon to be 32. Obviously no matter what they do will guarantee a cup. But i feel with the right centres added to this group, they could. Take Vegas for example, who really thought that team could do what they did with that roster. Nobody. The Habs will actually have elite level players in their core to make a run at the cup IF they address the centre position

Even if they draft Dahlin, he isn't replacing Andrei Markov's minutes. Nobody is. So the defence is going to be inept still. How does this club get out of the Atlantic division? Look at the Leafs, who have superior defence to Montreal, struggle against Boston. How does this team beat Boston and Tampa and get to the ECF by just adding a centre? You're living in fiction.

 

[Runner77]

We have the fourth best odds. Not that bad i dont think. Jersey got Hischier in the same position

"Not that bad" is not the same as "highly possible". I'm sorry but your words are misleading.

Same caveat with John Tavares or with this team competing with Toronto. You can't orchestrate that type of turnaround in one summer when the organization has cratered on so many levels. And certainly not with this management contingent continuing unfettered.

 

[CHfan1]

We have the fourth best odds. Not that bad i dont think. Jersey got Hischier in the same position

They have a 9.5% chance of winning the lottery. I would not consider that highly possible.

 

[Johnny31]

If the Habs address the centre position they can easily compete with a team like Toronto. Toronto is actually a good example, as they have a absolute brutal defence, but finished 3rd in the atlantic. Montreal's D that I have listed is superior to Toronto's. Addressing the centres with this wing group including Drouin,would compete with Toronto's forwards. Habs win the goalie duel.

I hear ya on the Stastny contract. Im weary on that as well because im afraid of term. If its a short term deal then im not concerned.

Rieilly, Gardiner, Zaitsev.... The montreal's D is actually worst than them

 

[Runner77]

Last Word on Sports is absolute garbage

You're killing me.

 

[mariolemieux66]

Montreal Canadiens Re-tool Rather than Rebuild - Last Word on Hockey

Honestly, I feel they are set at every position other than centre. They could add another Dman to play with Weber, which hopefully is Dahlin. Anyone else feel this way? Or are most just wanting to tear it all down and rebuild?

I want to ask you, why aren't you for a rebuild?

 

[Runner77]

"why you shouldn't ever read last word on hockey"

I think I found the root of the problem. It says right there in their logo ...