What's going on with Dubinsky and Jenner

[CBJSlash]

Perfectly content letting him become decrepit on our fourth line. Great for the room. Dineen, Peca, Prospal.

 

[SuperGenius]

I get what you're saying, Lee, and I see it the same way. I think Dubinsky was and is one of the main conduits between Torts and the team - probably more in the beginning than now, but still an important role.

I think, as I usually do, that some of you are vastly underrating what a guy like Dubinsky brings to this team. Grit, face-offs, penalty killing, defensive responsibility are all not very sexy attributes, but they are key to CBJ success both now and in the playoffs. As well as the CBJ are doing, I have some concerns about their size and toughness when the playoffs roll around. We're so focused on the regular season around here (and why wouldn't we be since we rarely see anything else?).

I do agree that its unlikely that Dubinsky finishes his contract here, but I hope he does. I don't see an equivalent player in the org unless you move Jenner to C, but half of this board also wants to get rid of him too. If you did move Jenner to C to "replace" him I would want someone with similar willingness to bang on the wing to replace Jenner. What I don't want is a team of ballerinas that are fun to watch but unable to win when size and strength matters.

As an aside, I really don't get the eagerness to change this team so much and jettison the "core" simply because they're getting older or not performing at present. Successful teams have a core they keep together as they become veterans...yes, even after age 30. The Sharks and Kings come to mind, among others.

 

[Cyclones Rock]

Dubinsky, unless he rebounds, will require salary retention and/or taking a bad contract in return.

Total insider call on this. The coaches know whether he's lost it and not in a slump. If he has, it's time to bite the bullet and take the medicine ASAP. His "value" will erode quickly and he could become unmoveable.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Dubinsky is playing well, he's just not scoring. No reason to trade him and it doesn't even matter because he has a NMC with a young family so I doubt he would waive.

Leave it to CBJ HF to go on a 8 game win streak and talk about trading one of the top players

 

[major major]

Dubinsky, unless he rebounds, will require salary retention and/or taking a bad contract in return.

Total insider call on this. The coaches know whether he's lost it and not in a slump. If he has, it's time to bite the bullet and take the medicine ASAP. His "value" will erode quickly and he could become unmoveable.

Other teams have pro scouts.

 

[Cyclones Rock]

Other teams have pro scouts.

Thanks. I didn't know that.

There are certain signs of decline that would be much more obvious to those who see him daily versus a pro scout who might have seen him twice this season. His decline, at least my perception of one, is relatively recent so there still may be a window of opportunity to trade him before he becomes almost untradeable.

 

[Byrral]

Oh my. So we have a real chance to make the playoffs this season and some want/try to trade away one of the players who thrives in that type of environment (would include Hartnell in that group as well).

Strengths: Two way play, faceoffs, game intensity and leadership

Would love to see him get his game back to the 15g/40pt mark to help with the teams secondary scoring. But I serious doubt many/any team(s) would take on that contract term without a high level asset going the other way with him. Embrace the fact that Dubi is likely to be on this team for quite a while. Don't like the length of his contract but now is not the time to address this.

 

[Columbus Jack]

Yea anyone that understands that hockey isnt all points and fantasy land of bringing in potential young prospects knows that a guy like Dubi is incredibly valuable to this teams success.

 

[MoeBartoli]

I frankly don't know if Dubi is in a slump or in an aggressive decline.

I hope it's the former. As a fan, I like Dubi and what he's brought to the CBJ. We've got a great season underway, I love the chemistry and can't see anyone who would fill his slot.

If it's a sudden decline, it's a huge problem based on the contract duration at $5.8M per year. As the GM, you would have to ask yourself a tough question on asset management. When to make such moves is a tougher question for a franchise that's not had success compared to say a Blackhawks franchise with a winning recent history. Obviously it's also one that gets GMs fired.

For now, I'm going to be the fan (certainly a more realistic role for me). . But I would also have my antennae up for possible exit strategies.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Yea anyone that understands that hockey isnt all points and fantasy land of bringing in potential young prospects knows that a guy like Dubi is incredibly valuable to this teams success.

We need a guy like Dubinsky if we make the playoffs (Hartnell too). Those dudes perform when it matters.

 

[section 204]

Wait until the pens are here next week and Dubi has once again crawled up under Crosby's skin, and this thread will have a different vibe.

 

[LetsGOJackets!!]

There is absolutely no reason on God's green earth for the CBJ to trade Dubinsky. He is one of the guys that helped us change our image. Now if you wanted to ban him from future Meyer's Jeweler commercials I believe we would all be in favor of it. Other teams hate Dubinsky and Hartnell. They are the perfect grinders that have enough skill and grit to jell the team.

just my .02, but lets let Mgmt manage, they seem to be doing a pretty good job lately.

 

[NotWendell]

I don't see this. Can you elaborate? Maybe I am not getting it.

SuperGenius said it as well as I could have hoped to, so I'll spare you the extra words.

 

[We Want Ten]

SuperGenius said it as well as I could have hoped to, so I'll spare you the extra words.

That's what I figured.

 

[SuperGenius]

Yea anyone that understands that hockey isnt all points and fantasy land of bringing in potential young prospects knows that a guy like Dubi is incredibly valuable to this teams success.

 

[blahblah]

Let's not get crazy here. Dubinsky is the key to Tortorella being successful as head coach here.

Dubinsky is important to this team, but hardly "the key".

 

[Cowumbus]

We need a guy like Dubinsky if we make the playoffs (Hartnell too). Those dudes perform when it matters.

Eh. Hartnell maybe, Duby I'm not so sure. He shut down Crosby a few times but if we're being honest Crosby still took it to us in the last series. Also Duby has 37 GP in the playoffs, Saad has 30 more than that... Let's not talk like Dubinsky has a ton of playoff experience. That being said if he can shut down the other teams top line then he will be useful, however his line this year has been terrible defensively.

If he is declining we need to trade him asap. We lucked out with Clarkson but with Duby Foligno Hartnell all aging the odds of us getting lucky that they all play at a high level till their contract expires are low. Duby of the three is the only one who appears to be showing signs of age and decline.

Who knows maybe I'm looking into it to much but I think that after this year he have players in the system that could do fine in his role. Aka Jenner (who I think could be our Cotourier)

 

[Socks]

Extra points for being right, concise and for the excellent reference.

 

[SuperGenius]

Eh. Hartnell maybe, Duby I'm not so sure. He shut down Crosby a few times but if we're being honest Crosby still took it to us in the last series.

I think your memory is failing you. In 6 games, Crosby did have 6 points, but 4 were on the power play and he was an overall -2. That's pretty pedestrian for the greatest player in the game. He also had the game tying goal in the waning seconds of game 4, if you recall.

 

[major major]

Eh. Hartnell maybe, Duby I'm not so sure. He shut down Crosby a few times but if we're being honest Crosby still took it to us in the last series. Also Duby has 37 GP in the playoffs, Saad has 30 more than that... Let's not talk like Dubinsky has a ton of playoff experience. That being said if he can shut down the other teams top line then he will be useful, however his line this year has been terrible defensively.

If he is declining we need to trade him asap. We lucked out with Clarkson but with Duby Foligno Hartnell all aging the odds of us getting lucky that they all play at a high level till their contract expires are low. Duby of the three is the only one who appears to be showing signs of age and decline.

Who knows maybe I'm looking into it to much but I think that after this year he have players in the system that could do fine in his role. Aka Jenner (who I think could be our Cotourier)

He is slowly declining, and we really don't need to do anything ASAP. There's no plausible reason to trade him other than "he is declining", other clubs know it, they have pro scouts, and no team is going to get excited for acquiring that contract. There's no ASAP to it. He's overpaid but useful, and we don't get any advantage by trying to dump him quickly.

It's also not a huge issue in general. He'll underperform his deal, but people shouldn't act like it's some death knell for the franchise. Just about every team has a deal like that on the books.

We might buy him out a bit before his deal is done.

 

[Viqsi]

I frankly don't know if Dubi is in a slump or in an aggressive decline.

I hope it's the former. As a fan, I like Dubi and what he's brought to the CBJ. We've got a great season underway, I love the chemistry and can't see anyone who would fill his slot.

If it's a sudden decline, it's a huge problem based on the contract duration at $5.8M per year. As the GM, you would have to ask yourself a tough question on asset management. When to make such moves is a tougher question for a franchise that's not had success compared to say a Blackhawks franchise with a winning recent history. Obviously it's also one that gets GMs fired.

For now, I'm going to be the fan (certainly a more realistic role for me). . But I would also have my antennae up for possible exit strategies.

This is why I'm leaning towards maybe moving him - I have some fear that it's an aggressive decline. He's approaching the age where one has to be wary about such things. And it's possible that Hartnell's Ageless Wonder status has a horrible, horrible price paid by all around him or something.

That said, I'm in no rush. If it's garden variety aging instead of Horrible Sudden Doom, then I'm good with keeping him. He's been awesome for us, after all.

 

[EdwardG]

I'm ok with Dubinsky as a player- he brings value to the team. I just wish the Jackets hadn't given him a contract worthy of a better player. For years the Jackets gave out contracts to guys at the height of their value.

Oh well, it is what it is at this point.

Would someone tell him to quit trying to take the puck through two defenders at the blue line, though? Tired of watching him lose the puck that way.

 

[major major]

What happened to Jenner defensively. Yeesh. Watch the 1st and 3rd Caps goals - those were his guys that got lose and scored.

The 2nd goal was bad luck. The 4th on Dubi for an awful giveaway. The 5th on a Nutivaara giveaway (and really Bob's fault - the only one on him).

 

[Old Guy]

I'm ok with Dubinsky as a player- he brings value to the team. I just wish the Jackets hadn't given him a contract worthy of a better player. For years the Jackets gave out contracts to guys at the height of their value

Oh well, it is what it is at this point.

Would someone tell him to quit trying to take the puck through two defenders at the blue line, though? Tired of watching him lose the puck that way.

Things are returning to normal. It might have happened, but I can't remember anybody complaining or dissing Jarmo and/or the CBJ for bad contracts in about two months .

Seems funny how a sustained stretch of good play can make the "bad contract" talk much less or maybe even go away?.

 

[JohnnyJacket13]

I've kept my opinions about Dubi/Jenner quiet during this hot streak - mainly because it wasn't truly affecting how well the entire team has played - but I am really growing wary of Jenner. I'm just not his biggest fan...really reminds me of what David Clarkson was in NJ.

His style of play really does not fit well with the fast identity that the team is building. And his defensive deficiencies and general puck possession (through the eye test, atleast) have been like a boat anchor at times (not just last night in Washington). In all honesty, I would love to make a move to swap Jenner out for a player who is a little more of an offensive catalyst. Not sure what is available out there, perhaps Landeskog?, but a very solid player could come back in return.