Raptors Discussion: V63 Round 3! First conf. finals in franchise history!

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Shwaguy*

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Do people really think this current Roster could be better than 56 wins + ECF with a better coach than Casey?

Casey is getting the most results possible out of this roster IMO. Even with the GOAT coach Popovich they wouldn't be a 60 win team nor would they be beating Cleveland, OKC, Golden State, San Antonio.

The only complaint is that it isn't pretty an it makes fans feel self-conscious.

But you're not gonna get results better than what we are getting with this year's version of the roster (We can build to be a finals team as we are relatively young with lots of assets) with a different coach. Sure it might look prettier but that doesn't matter if the results are the same.
 

Man Bear Pig

Registered User
Aug 10, 2008
31,102
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Do people really think this current Roster could be better than 56 wins + ECF with a better coach than Casey?

Casey is getting the most results possible out of this roster IMO. Even with the GOAT coach Popovich they wouldn't be a 60 win team nor would they be beating Cleveland, OKC, Golden State, San Antonio.

The only complaint is that it isn't pretty an it makes fans feel self-conscious.

But you're not gonna get results better than what we are getting with this year's version of the roster (We can build to be a finals team as we are relatively young with lots of assets) with a different coach. Sure it might look prettier but that doesn't matter if the results are the same.
If there's one thing I've learned about sports over the years it's that 99% of the time, a different coach will improve the team. The grass is always greener. I question Caseys moves at times but it's a guarantee that for those of us who do question his moves, we'd do the exact same thing with a different coach. It's human nature to question leadership/the boss.
 

Budsfan

Registered User
Sep 17, 2006
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rapsheat-game6-756-1.jpg


Game 6 Preview: Raptors @ Heat
Posted: May 12, 2016

Holly MacKenzie - Raptors.com

Series: Raptors Lead 3-2

After a 99-91 Game 5 victory at the ACC on Wednesday, the Raptors hope to take advantage of the opportunity to close out their second-round series against the Heat in Miami on Friday night. DeMar DeRozan and Kyle Lowry combined for 59 points in Game 5, including 20 of the team’s 24 fourth quarter points.

Tip-off: 8 P.M. ET

Broadcast Info: SNET, ESPN, TSN1050

Ford Fanzone open: 6 P.M. ET

Pregame Show: 6:30 P.M. ET on NBATV Canada

projectedlineups-051316-1.jpg


LESSONS LEARNED

Movement matters

After the Raptors got caught holding onto the ball, resulting in stagnant offence down the stretch of the team’s Game 4 loss in Miami, head coach Dwane Casey stressed the importance of movement. With and without the ball.

“The key is we've got to move,” Casey said. “We can't stand. There are so many clips, if you watch where we were standing. When we pass the ball you've got to move, move the ball, move your body.”

Toronto got off to a good start in the first quarter of Game 5, getting out in transition for easy buckets, as well as racking up 11 assists in the first half, after managing just 12 total in Game 4. Looking ahead to Friday’s game, the Raptors need to continue moving the ball — and moving without the ball — to ensure open looks.

Biyombo as game changer

Bismack Biyombo started his second consecutive game in place of the injured Jonas Valanciunas. Biyombo was on the bench down the stretch in the fourth quarter and overtime of Game 4 because the team elected to go with a small lineup. In Game 5, he made it nearly impossible to take him off the court with the energy he brought on both ends of the floor. Although Biyombo’s stat line was modest — 10 points, six rebounds and a playoff career-high four blocked shots — his teammates, along with the ACC crowd, fed off his non-stop energy.

“He’s been tremendous,” Casey said. “The thing with Bismack is he’s accepted his role, he knows who he is, he’s ready in his role. If he comes off the bench he comes off the bench. If he starts, he starts with the same energy and focus defensively, [and] he’s making his free throws which is huge.”
GAME 6 TALKING POINTS

Carroll questionable for Game 6

DeMarre Carroll injured his left wrist when he crashed to the floor and landed awkwardly after colliding with Goran Dragic on a drive to the basket. Carroll remained on the floor in a considerable amount of pain before immediately leaving the game and undergoing tests on the wrist. The team announced on Thursday that tests were negative and that Carroll would be treated symptomatically for a left wrist contusion with his availability for Game 6 being listed as questionable.

While Carroll hopes to be cleared to play on Friday, he’s relieved the injury wasn’t as bad as he feared immediately after hitting the ground.

“Initially I thought I broke it ‘cause my whole wrist went numb,” Carroll said.”[I thought], ‘Here we go again.’ But I tried to stay positive. I got to the back, stayed positive and eventually after a couple minutes, the numbness in my wrist just kind of went away.”

Carroll said the training staff is doing treatment “day and night” on the wrist, including mobile, stimulation and ice, or “any treatment you can name.” Whether he’s cleared to play on Friday will be up to the medical staff, but tests coming back negative is welcomed news for a Raptors team already shorthanded with Valanciunas out. In the event that Carroll doesn’t play in Game 6, Casey is ready to go to his bench.

“Like we’ve always said, next guy up,” Casey said. “All guys are in play, all 13 guys that are healthy or however many it is are in play and everything’s on the table. I thought Jason Thompson came in and gave us a good boost off the bench [in Game 5], he hadn’t played and was ready to go. Whoever it is has to be ready, professional and our guys are doing a good job, our coaching staff is doing a good job of working with those guys at night time before practice, after practice, keeping them ready.”

Shoelace magic

DeMar DeRozan has been battling a sore thumb in his shooting hand since injuring it at the end of Game 1. Cameras caught Raptors director of sports science Alex McKechnie tightly wrapping the thumb in a red shoelace when DeRozan was on the bench. The treatment seemed to help DeRozan’s thumb as he had his strongest effort of the postseason, scoring 34 points on 11-for-22 field goals, including a perfect 11-for-11 from the free throw line, with 13 of his 34 points coming in the fourth quarter.

After the game, as McKechnie walked by DeRozan in the locker room, DeRozan joked with him that he’d have to start selling shoelaces. When DeRozan was asked about the surprising assist the shoelace provided, he kept things short and sweet.

“Thousand-dollar shoelace” he said. “That’s all I can say.”

DeRozan did hit his thumb in the game and had to go into the locker room to have the training staff look at it, but returned to action and said after the game that it’s just something he’ll have to continue to deal with.

"It was interesting,” Casey said of the shoelace. “It was an excellent method, I guess, from Alex McKechnie. I'd never seen it before. Whatever works. Whatever means necessary. Alex is one of the best. That's why he's one of the best in the business, with his methods. I had never seen that before."

While it’s unknown if he’ll be able to have a repeat performance in Miami, what is certain is that DeRozan and the training staff will be doing everything they can to have him ready to play his game.

Raptors-Miami Heat: Game 6 game preview

Game 7, if necessary, is Sunday at 3:30 p.m., at the Air Canada Centre.

By Chris O’LearySports Reporter
Thu., May 12, 2016

This matchup is the perfect example of how injuries have come to dominate this series.

If Miami is missing Deng — they already are missing Hassan Whiteside in the paint — the scoring burden will only increase on Wade. That’s why who the Raptors have guarding him will be so important. If it’s Carroll, he’ll have a long night, especially with a sore left wrist. If Carroll sits, a heavy responsibility shifts to a combination of players, including Norman Powell, who has looked his most rookie-like in the playoffs guarding his idol. Patrick Patterson has chipped in on defence and Carroll’s injury could see the return of James Johnson, who got in for five minutes in Game 2.

Need to know: Carroll remains questionable for Game 6 with a left wrist contusion. Deng, also suffering from a wrist injury accrued in Game 5, appears to be a game time decision . . . Whiteside (right MCL sprain) is expected to miss Game 6 . . . Friday’s game marks the eighth time in team history the Raptors have had a close-out opportunity. They’ve won two of those seven previous games . . . DeMar DeRozan matched a playoff career-high with his 34 points in Game 5 . . . Kyle Lowry’s 25 points and 10 rebounds in Game 5 gave him his second career playoff double-double.

Up next: Game 7, if necessary, is Sunday at 3:30 p.m., at the Air Canada Centre.
 

Neil Hamburger

Five Bagger!
Jun 15, 2010
3,553
6
Toronto
How much money will Biyombo be looking at this summer?

I believe he's a UFA since Charlotte didn't give him a qualifying offer last summer, and he'll definitely turn down his player option.

I really hope we can keep him around.
 

sparxx87

Don Quixote
Jan 5, 2010
13,834
4,705
Toronto
How much money will Biyombo be looking at this summer?

I believe he's a UFA since Charlotte didn't give him a qualifying offer last summer, and he'll definitely turn down his player option.

I really hope we can keep him around.

Centers get paid. 10m, maybe more to a desperate team. I think he'll be gone simply because JV signed long term and he'll want an opportunity to start. He's definitely a valuable player but a legit starting 4 is a more pressing need.

Lots of money will be committed over the next two offseasons. It'll be interesting to see how the roster evolves.
 

Gary Nylund

Registered User
Oct 10, 2013
30,007
22,364
Do people really think this current Roster could be better than 56 wins + ECF with a better coach than Casey?

Casey is getting the most results possible out of this roster IMO. Even with the GOAT coach Popovich they wouldn't be a 60 win team nor would they be beating Cleveland, OKC, Golden State, San Antonio.

The only complaint is that it isn't pretty an it makes fans feel self-conscious.

But you're not gonna get results better than what we are getting with this year's version of the roster (We can build to be a finals team as we are relatively young with lots of assets) with a different coach. Sure it might look prettier but that doesn't matter if the results are the same.

Maybe you're right, maybe not. I don't care about the 56 wins, I care about looking like a team that hasn't a clue on offence in the playoffs. I read somewhere a breakdown of DD's shots in the playoffs, apparently he's jacking it up from on average significantly longer distances then he was during the regular season. Can this group of players really not do better than having DD chucking away? Somehow I think that it's possible to do better, maybe much better.
 

Neil Hamburger

Five Bagger!
Jun 15, 2010
3,553
6
Toronto
Centers get paid. 10m, maybe more to a desperate team. I think he'll be gone simply because JV signed long term and he'll want an opportunity to start. He's definitely a valuable player but a legit starting 4 is a more pressing need.

Lots of money will be committed over the next two offseasons. It'll be interesting to see how the roster evolves.

I was hoping for something like Joseph's deal, 4 years 30 million. 10 million would be too much imo.
 

Suntouchable13

Registered User
Dec 20, 2003
43,353
18,655
Toronto, ON
One thing that sucks about the NBA is that it does not feel as wide open as other leagues. Nobody believe that either Miami or Toronto can beat Cleveland. If Toronto advances it just feels like the end of the road. It does not feel like there is a legitimate shot. It should be exciting, you're going to the ECF with a chance to advance to the Finals! But then you realize who we're playing and you know that it won't happen. In the NHL or MLB there is no such feeling. Anybody can get hot and win it all.
 

Vexed

Magic Marner
Feb 4, 2011
5,648
85
Barrie
Maybe you're right, maybe not. I don't care about the 56 wins, I care about looking like a team that hasn't a clue on offence in the playoffs. I read somewhere a breakdown of DD's shots in the playoffs, apparently he's jacking it up from on average significantly longer distances then he was during the regular season. Can this group of players really not do better than having DD chucking away? Somehow I think that it's possible to do better, maybe much better.

That's not on the coach, that's on DD and his supporting cast. DD is timid in the playoffs, mostly because he can't rely on the refs whistle like in the regular season.

Lowry's shooting is also a major problem in the offence. It allows for help to drop more aggressively to DD and with JV out, there isn't much of an offensive inside presence to keep the D honest.

This team doesn't have an out and out superstar though so the drop in positive statistics was always going to happen. There is a reason why the vast majority of times in the NBA the best player wins the title.

Personally, I think Coach C deserves a lot of credit for the team being in the position it is considering the injuries and the complete drop off of Lowry. They've had to battle and win ugly to compensate but it is working so far. The defense is doing so much of the heavy lifting and that is almost always attributed to the coach more so than anything offensively.
 

Gary Nylund

Registered User
Oct 10, 2013
30,007
22,364
That's not on the coach, that's on DD and his supporting cast. DD is timid in the playoffs, mostly because he can't rely on the refs whistle like in the regular season.

Lowry's shooting is also a major problem in the offence. It allows for help to drop more aggressively to DD and with JV out, there isn't much of an offensive inside presence to keep the D honest.

This team doesn't have an out and out superstar though so the drop in positive statistics was always going to happen. There is a reason why the vast majority of times in the NBA the best player wins the title.

Personally, I think Coach C deserves a lot of credit for the team being in the position it is considering the injuries and the complete drop off of Lowry. They've had to battle and win ugly to compensate but it is working so far. The defense is doing so much of the heavy lifting and that is almost always attributed to the coach more so than anything offensively.

That depends. It's on DD if he's going against the coach's orders but on the coach if he's chucking with the coach's blessing. Since it's been the same story all season long, I think it's safe to assume he has the coach's blessing.
 

Radiohead

Street Spirit
Sep 6, 2008
3,171
242
Wonder if that will be Duncan's final game. Amazing player, all class.

Knowing San Antonio, both Manu and Timmy will re-sign for the veteran minimum. They will then go out and sign Mike Conley Jr. and Pau Gasol.
 

Radiohead

Street Spirit
Sep 6, 2008
3,171
242
Biz's contract could turn into another poison pill however. There's some Asik downside to it.

Asik's contract is not a poison pill though. New Orleans signed him to their own terms last summer.

Again, if Ross' contract can be traded, I would not mind signing Biz to that amount. He's only Val's age (reportedly). Asik is 30.
 

Eyedea

The Legend Continues
Jan 29, 2012
27,498
3,302
Toronto, Ontario
Asik's contract is not a poison pill though. New Orleans signed him to their own terms last summer.

Again, if Ross' contract can be traded, I would not mind signing Biz to that amount. He's only Val's age (reportedly). Asik is 30.

Asik's first contract when the Rockets offer sheeted him. Still, Asik's second contract is widely considered the worst in the NBA. Last offseason was just a terrible sight with the cap rising, and this offseason likely won't be any different.

I'm aware that poison pill generally refers to restricted free agents, but Biyombo seems like he kinda is one in a sense that he would allow us to match any offer. I'm not sure if we're well off committing to him though and instead choose a big in the draft or use Bebe as the backup for next season.

Here's hoping DD flies to LA and we can re-sign Biz and get Batum in free agency.
 
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Swervin81

Leaf fan | YYZ -> SEA
Nov 10, 2011
36,460
1,553
Seattle, WA
Asik's first contract when the Rockets offer sheeted him. Still, Asik's second contract is widely considered the worst in the NBA. Last offseason was just a terrible sight with the cap rising, and this offseason likely won't be any different.

I'm aware that poison pill generally refers to restricted free agents, but Biyombo seems like he kinda is one in a sense that he would allow us to match any offer. I'm not sure if we're well off committing to him though and instead choose a big in the draft or use Bebe as the backup for next season.

Here's hoping DD flies to LA and we can re-sign Biz and get Batum in free agency.

Doesn't Batum hate us from when we made him fall in the draft by leaking medical concerns of his to the rest of the league after we worked him out pre-draft?
 

Gary Nylund

Registered User
Oct 10, 2013
30,007
22,364
This was posted a couple of days ago in a Raptors forum, and this sums up my problem with DD - he's a chucker. Admittedly these numbers are before the last game where he actually played very well.
-----------------------------------------------------------

Remember when everyone was cheering for DeMar's improved shot selection during the regular season because he was only taking .247% of his shots from 16-23?...in the playoffs that number is up to .358%(disgustingly his lowest ever in the playoffs) and shooting .346%....2nd most used area? 10-16 ft for .211% of his shots, shooting an even worse .326% from there.....

Sigh.....
 

Eyedea

The Legend Continues
Jan 29, 2012
27,498
3,302
Toronto, Ontario
Doesn't Batum hate us from when we made him fall in the draft by leaking medical concerns of his to the rest of the league after we worked him out pre-draft?

There was that Zach Lowe nugget last offseason where he said Batum expresses a desire to play for the Raptors. Not to mention Ujiri has been trying to acquire him since he was in Denver.
 

CharlieKelly

Registered User
Feb 19, 2012
42
2
One thing that sucks about the NBA is that it does not feel as wide open as other leagues. Nobody believe that either Miami or Toronto can beat Cleveland. If Toronto advances it just feels like the end of the road. It does not feel like there is a legitimate shot. It should be exciting, you're going to the ECF with a chance to advance to the Finals! But then you realize who we're playing and you know that it won't happen. In the NHL or MLB there is no such feeling. Anybody can get hot and win it all.

In my opinion this is largely the result of the impact that individual players have on every game and consequently series in the NBA. When your best players play 90+% of the game (as opposed to say 33% in the NHL) it's hard to overcome the serious talent deficiency when going up against a bonafide superstar with good team play alone. That's not to say their aren't exceptions, I would say SA did it in 2014. But for the most part, the best individual players dictate the series much more in the NBA than any other sport.

Until you have a Lebron, Steph, Russ, KD, Kawhi to rely on - it's never going to feel like you have a chance against those guys (as long as they have a decent supporting cast). You just go give'em hell and hope for the best.
 

The Kessel Run

Registered User
Jun 7, 2011
12,719
4,290
If Lowry and DD don't crap the bed tonight, we should win. It's their moment. Show everybody how far they have come since their first playoff series a couple of years ago.

I have a real good feeling about tonight. The series SHOULD be over, for all intents and purposes. However, I have no doubts that there will be several moments of painstaking anger (most likely 1:40 binges at the end of quarters).:rant:
 

Marmoset

Registered User
Apr 4, 2015
712
362
GTA
Centers get paid. 10m, maybe more to a desperate team. I think he'll be gone simply because JV signed long term and he'll want an opportunity to start. He's definitely a valuable player but a legit starting 4 is a more pressing need.

Lots of money will be committed over the next two offseasons. It'll be interesting to see how the roster evolves.

I would love to keep him, but as you say, that's a lot of money we would be committing to a backup centre.

I think we will need to overpay significantly to keep Biyombo because he can start on a lot of teams, but clearly won't start for the Raptors. If it's equal money, he would very likely go to the team where he starts compared to being the backup.
 

McDeepika

Registered User
Aug 14, 2004
9,346
1,153
This was posted a couple of days ago in a Raptors forum, and this sums up my problem with DD - he's a chucker. Admittedly these numbers are before the last game where he actually played very well.
-----------------------------------------------------------

Remember when everyone was cheering for DeMar's improved shot selection during the regular season because he was only taking .247% of his shots from 16-23?...in the playoffs that number is up to .358%(disgustingly his lowest ever in the playoffs) and shooting .346%....2nd most used area? 10-16 ft for .211% of his shots, shooting an even worse .326% from there.....

Sigh.....

It would be one thing if he was taking those shots at the end of the shot clock when we couldn't get a better look. He actually hunts down those shots which is what makes everything so frustrating.

Hopefully he attacks today. I can live with him getting into the lane and missing a bunch of floaters because that will allow our bigs to own the offensive glass. Much harder to get a rebound off a missed jump shot.
 
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