The Official Tank Thread II

[Red Stanley]

To HockeyinHD and whoever else, yes I do want to lose. That's right, I want this team to lose every game moving forward. Why?

Because a win will not help us this season, we are not making the playoffs. In fact, wins serve only to endanger our draft position at this point. A win also doesn't help next season. Losses now may not help this season but they could as early as next season, and for potentially many years after that depending on who we draft.

And I want the team to lose a lot again next year. Why? Because I don't know how anyone can look at this roster and think it has a serious chance of competing for anything. But the bounties that can be gained with a few years of suck can reap rewards for many more years.

Which brings us to the crux of the issue, why do I want this?

Because it makes me really sad to see how far this team has fallen. Obviously we all have benefitted from an embarrassment of riches the past couple decades+, but the contrast is just jarring. We used to watch Yzerman, Fedorov, Lidstrom, Shanahan, Hasek, Larionov, Hull, Hossa, Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Rafalski, etc, etc, etc... Now we watch Sheahan not able to score a goal to save his life, overpaid/overrated vets on their retirement contracts (Helm, Abby & Co), goalies who always seem to be either injured or 'finding their game', I could go on but we are all very familiar with these issues at this point. And what does all that add up to? Boredom. This is a boring team to watch.

That's why I want to see this team lose. Because if they do, it may not be too long before we have some actual exciting players to rally around. And these players are fun to watch even while the team still sucks. Edmonton may have still been a bad team their first year with McDavid, but you know damn well that Edmonton fans were having a blast watching McDavid out there, even if the team still had issues. I want to have fun watching this team again.

I think Holland displayed a staggering lack of self-awareness when he dismissed the idea of a full rebuild because those take 10-15 years. Well we're about 6 years into his 'rebuild on the fly' and trending downwards in a major way. How long will this take? The returns, 6 years in, are not promising. That's why I want Holland gone, I don't think he's capable of clearly and objectively evaluating where this team is, how the league/game has changed, and what needs to be done to right the ship.

The most interesting aspect of being a Wings fan right now is finding out how long it will take for "yay we lost again, boo Holland" to change to "boo we lost again, boo -insertGMnamehere-".

 

[Orthodox Caveman]

Why did they have to win these last 2 ughhhh

It'd be nice if they could just finish 2nd or 3rd worst and get a better pick than 7th or 8th. Can't even tank right....

Where do you think we'll pick in 2018? It'd be nice to know what direction this team is going to be moving towards. Can we please suck next season and get Dahlin? Is that too much to ask?

 

[BinCookin]

I think so. Not to finish, but to actually start an honest to goodness rebuild.

I would say the GM that traded 4 players for draft picks as someone who is doing the rebuild.

 

[lidstromiscool]

Maybe a dumb question, but are the first 3 picks of all upcoming drafts up for lottery or is it just like that this year? If they are all like this year, tanking will be a lot harder than in past years

 

[jkutswings]

Maybe a dumb question, but are the first 3 picks of all upcoming drafts up for lottery or is it just like that this year? If they are all like this year, tanking will be a lot harder than in past years

All drafts have the first three picks decided by lottery. They draw for the first overall pick, then the second overall, then the third, and then the rest of the order is set, based on record (and playoff positioning, for playoff teams).

For all rounds after the first round, non-playoff seeding is based on record. I'm not positive, but I'm assuming that Vegas drafts 3rd for all rounds after the first round.

 

[TheMule93]

the standings frustrate me

we've risen up so much. We're not even gonna get rewarded for this season, are we?

 

[Dotter]

the standings frustrate me

we've risen up so much. We're not even gonna get rewarded for this season, are we?

I guess the teams that suck worse than we do will get better picks, if that's what you mean.

 

[HIFE]

I would say the GM that traded 4 players for draft picks as someone who is doing the rebuild.

Do you actually believe that waiving...er I mean trading 3 totally insignificant players and a has-been for a handful of 3rd round picks is rebuilding? Yeah big, big moves there signaling the shift we'll be recalling for years.

I'm going to have a huge chuckle at who Holland signs this summer to fill their space.

 

[Marky9er]

the standings frustrate me

we've risen up so much. We're not even gonna get rewarded for this season, are we?

A loss to buffalo would go a long way.

 

[Retire91]

Lol at the people using the 10 years of loosing mark as a reason not to rebuild but are okay with the last 6 years of loosing but not loosing enough for it to make a difference.

Bring on 10 more years of stop gap veteran non-possession hockey. I didn't realize how many people appreciated that style of play.

 

[Wingsfan 4 life]

I would say the GM that traded 4 players for draft picks as someone who is doing the rebuild.

He traded 3 pending UFA's and a guy who wanted out. Any team out of playoff contention would attempt to do the exact same thing, whether they were rebuilding or not.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Lol at the people using the 10 years of loosing mark as a reason not to rebuild but are okay with the last 6 years of loosing but not loosing enough for it to make a difference.

Bring on 10 more years of stop gap veteran non-possession hockey. I didn't realize how many people appreciated that style of play.

Didn't realize being among the best teams in the league and making the 2nd round was called "losing". And even years in which we've been a borderline playoff team have been 100x more fun than this. I was fine with being a mediocre team through a rebuild. We didn't manage to keep it up, doesn't mean we should settle in as a bottom 5 team now if we can help it.

 

[jkutswings]

Didn't realize being among the best teams in the league and making the 2nd round was called "losing". And even years in which we've been a borderline playoff team have been 100x more fun than this. I was fine with being a mediocre team through a rebuild. We didn't manage to keep it up, doesn't mean we should settle in as a bottom 5 team now if we can help it.

I hope you're referring to the 2nd round losses to San Jose, and not the Chicago series. Detroit hasn't been among the better teams in the league for 5 years.

I'd rather miss the playoffs, but have a cornerstone or two in place, than pad the streak but never have the horses to do any damage once getting in.

 

[BinCookin]

Do you actually believe that waiving...er I mean trading 3 totally insignificant players and a has-been for a handful of 3rd round picks is rebuilding? Yeah big, big moves there signaling the shift we'll be recalling for years.

I'm going to have a huge chuckle at who Holland signs this summer to fill their space.

Yes Usually moves like that are the Hallmark signal of the beginning of a rebuild.

Now there are many different levels such a rebuild could take:

Simply trade UFAs when they expire for picks each year, and do not sign any vets to longg contracts
Start trading players age 30+
Start trading players age 27+
Start trading players age 25+

All are acceptable. Feel free to be jaded about our GM, and it will likely ttake 2 full years to see the signs of a "confirmable" rebuild. But I would say he gets it as a last place team the choices are obvious.

 

[SirloinUB]

I hope you're referring to the 2nd round losses to San Jose, and not the Chicago series.

All of the above were highly entertaining and a fun ride. I'd gladly take a second round exit over this team's current standing.



Now the reality is the Wings are at the bottom and need the highest pick possible. However, and I said it over a week ago, but I think the pro-tank/rebuild crowd is in for a rough ride to end the season. Detroit has a soft schedule and I confidently believe that they can climb up around the 20th spot.

 

[Frk It]

I hope you're referring to the 2nd round losses to San Jose, and not the Chicago series. Detroit hasn't been among the better teams in the league for 5 years.

I'd rather miss the playoffs, but have a cornerstone or two in place, than pad the streak but never have the horses to do any damage once getting in.

We beat the #2 seed Anaheim, and took the #1 seed Chicago to 7 games in the 2nd round.

You can say the Wings shouldn't have been one of the better teams in the league that year... but they were.

Props to Babcock for getting that team to overachieve, although I know some like TZE will point out he got outcoached in that Chicago series, which I understand.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

I hope you guys are ready for the "We climbed our way out of last place, so we don't really need to rebuild" line. It's coming.

 

[lidstromiscool]

All drafts have the first three picks decided by lottery. They draw for the first overall pick, then the second overall, then the third, and then the rest of the order is set, based on record (and playoff positioning, for playoff teams).

For all rounds after the first round, non-playoff seeding is based on record. I'm not positive, but I'm assuming that Vegas drafts 3rd for all rounds after the first round.

Sweet deal, thanks

 

[jkutswings]

We beat the #2 seed Anaheim, and took the #1 seed Chicago to 7 games in the 2nd round.

You can say the Wings shouldn't have been one of the better teams in the league that year... but they were.

Props to Babcock for getting that team to overachieve, although I know some like TZE will point out he got outcoached in that Chicago series, which I understand.

I saw them play a solid series against the Ducks...then saw a Chicago team sleepwalk through a few games before waking up and being clearly the better team.

Agree to disagree, I guess.

 

[jkutswings]

All of the above were highly entertaining and a fun ride. I'd gladly take a second round exit over this team's current standing.

While making the second round certainly has more immediate gratification than a season like this one, that overachievement by a declining team whose window had already closed was part of the ammo that this front office used to continue loading up on "pad the streak" moves.

I happily would turn that year into another one like this one, if it meant a better pipeline/cap for a rebuild.

 

[DanZ]

I saw them play a solid series against the Ducks...then saw a Chicago team sleepwalk through a few games before waking up and being clearly the better team.

Agree to disagree, I guess.

Chicago was losing game 6 by two goals and had to come back and then had to go to OT to win game 7. I don't see how they were clearly the better team other than maybe game 5.

 

[theYman]

I saw them play a solid series against the Ducks...then saw a Chicago team sleepwalk through a few games before waking up and being clearly the better team.

Agree to disagree, I guess.

Yeah and they ended up to be the Stanley Cup champs, btw. Lids should have played that season too. It was a short season anyways. I bet we would've gotten another cup.

 

[Retire91]

Didn't realize being among the best teams in the league and making the 2nd round was called "losing". And even years in which we've been a borderline playoff team have been 100x more fun than this. I was fine with being a mediocre team through a rebuild. We didn't manage to keep it up, doesn't mean we should settle in as a bottom 5 team now if we can help it.

A team playing over its head that had no chance at a cup lead by one of the greatest coaches of all time reduced to realgud dump and chase trap hockey with a non-possession roster and a crumbling aging core with only two elite players entering their twilight years who eventually got beat by the better team.

Making the second round isn't technically loosing but it was another waisted season of the same old tierd and ineffective stop gap roster.

 

[Red Stanley]

A team playing over its head that had no chance at a cup lead by one of the greatest coaches of all time reduced to realgud dump and chase trap hockey with a non-possession roster and a crumbling aging core with only two elite players entering their twilight years who eventually got beat by the better team.

Making the second round isn't technically loosing but it was another waisted season of the same old tierd and ineffective stop gap roster.

Well it looks like you get to enjoy a few seasons of technically "losing" and not "wasting" seasons being in the playoffs. Those draft days sure will be exciting, though. We'll be the envy of other teams' theory crafting junkies and armchair GMs for years to come. Now if only I could copy/paste my NHL game saves into the actual NHL, the Wings would win every year cause I'm amazing at building pixel championship teams.

 

[jkutswings]

Well it looks like you get to enjoy a few seasons of technically "losing" and not "wasting" seasons being in the playoffs. Those draft days sure will be exciting, though. We'll be the envy of other teams' theory crafting junkies and armchair GMs for years to come. Now if only I could copy/paste my NHL game saves into the actual NHL, the Wings would win every year cause I'm amazing at building pixel championship teams.

If the current era is wasted on poor decisions and continued floundering about, denying the need to rebuild, then it'll be all the fun of a root canal.

If it's utilized to start acting like a rebuild is both necessary and a positive step towards returning to contention, and that approach is coupled to some smart moves and a healthy dose of good luck, then it could be fantastic to watch the next several years unfold.

Most likely, it will be somewhere in between, but the crossroads this franchise is approaching was inevitable. It was just a matter of when.