Speculation: Sens, Lebreton, and the NCC

[L'Aveuglette]

Sometimes I wonder how JD1 and the Count aren't totally exhausted from trying to spin every single aspect of this situation in favor of Melnyk while making everyone else look bad. Phew!

 

[Take a Bath Son]

Sometimes I wonder how JD1 and the Count aren't totally exhausted from trying to spin every single aspect of this situation in favor of Melnyk while making everyone else look bad. Phew!

The amount of energy expended arguing this is quite incredible actually. To be fair to Melnyk, I really don't see any issue with him musing about the state of the condo market-directly or indirectly and its impact on the project.

What I can't wrap my head around is that the longer this drags out, the taller his partner's Trinity at Bayview project keeps getting. Proposal is now 65 stories and I don't think Melnyk has any skin in it-regardless of whether it is rental, commercial or condo or a combo of the 3, that project is competition for whatever goes up on Lebreton. It really makes me wonder about that partnership and/or whats going on behind the scenes. I just feel there is a hell of a lot of stuff being worked through that isn't public realm.

 

[BonkTastic]

Funny part, majority of the time, the people saying that wouldn't be able to do the "job" they say isn't real.

I mean, there are certainly a minority of federal public servants who got their union-guaranteed positions and then phoned it in for 20 years. That's certainly a thing, but it doesn't mean the job itself is easy. It just means the government painted themselves in a corner during contract negotiations and are stuck with some dead weight. If anything it makes the jobs for everyone else that much harder.

Just because a small number of people have taken advantage of the system, it doesn't mean the job isn't difficult, or that the people who succeed in those jobs don't work hard. We can agree that the slugs within the system exist without dismissing the entire system and everyone in it.

The kinds of people who sit on their arses in the public service never go anywhere - they never move anywhere in their career, because no managers want them. they never move up, never get better jobs, never develop their careers. They are stuck in the low-level jobs they started at. The kind of people who move up within the government - like the Director of Communications for the Speaker of the House of Commons - generally do it by working their asses of.

 

[Ray Kinsella]

I mean, there are certainly a minority of federal public servants who got their union-guaranteed positions and then phoned it in for 20 years. That's certainly a thing, but it doesn't mean the job itself is easy. It just means the government painted themselves in a corner during contract negotiations and are stuck with some dead weight. If anything it makes the jobs for everyone else that much harder.

Just because a small number of people have taken advantage of the system, it doesn't mean the job isn't difficult, or that the people who succeed in those jobs don't work hard. We can agree that the slugs within the system exist without dismissing the entire system and everyone in it.

The kinds of people who sit on their arses in the public service never go anywhere - they never move anywhere in their career, because no managers want them. they never move up, never get better jobs, never develop their careers. They are stuck in the low-level jobs they started at. The kind of people who move up within the government - like the Director of Communications for the Speaker of the House of Commons - generally do it by working their asses of.

Lol... that last part was pretty funny

 

[Pancakes Pancakes]

Hey guys, I was at Lansdowne with the kids this weekend and Jim Watson walked by, some kid said Hi Jim! and Jim said, HI!. Damn that Jim Watson always interjecting himself into everything....damn career public servant shouldn't be allowed to talk.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

He's the mayor of the city on which a multi-billion dollar development is being finalized.

On what god damned earth do you live in where the Mayor shouldn't have an opinion on that?!?

Did you read the article ........ the land is Owned by the NCC, not the City, other than the planned park and library.

The Mayor is not involved at this point of the negotiations, he's reacting to the comments about the condo market that Melnyk made earlier in the week ....... I think that the RLG has some issues about the possible saturation of condos in the areas surrounding Lebreton Flats, and the RLG has some legitimate business issues, the Mayor hasn't got a clue about the Private sector and Urban development.

Reevely: Melnyk's right to be worried about financing LeBreton project with condos

The RLG is negotiating, at this time, with the NCC, and they're on the record as having no problems about the current state of negotiations...... the only person that is shooting off his mouth, is Watson, during an election year.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

Apparently working for the Canadian federal public service isn't a real job.

The contempt some bitter people have for public servants in this city is palpable.

No one, except you are saying that.

But, are you also saying that there is no difference between the private sector and the public sector???

 

[Heady Topper]

Did you read the article ........ the land is Owned by the NCC, not the City, other than the planned park and library.

The Mayor is not involved at this point of the negotiations, he's reacting to the comments about the condo market that Melnyk made earlier in the week ....... I think that the RLG has some issues about the possible saturation of condos in the areas surrounding Lebreton Flats, and the RLG has some legitimate business issues, the Mayor hasn't got a clue about the Private sector and Urban development.

Reevely: Melnyk's right to be worried about financing LeBreton project with condos

The RLG is negotiating, at this time, with the NCC, and they're on the record as having no problems about the current state of negotiations...... the only person that is shooting off his mouth, is Watson, during an election year.

Bill, you don't know that. Do you have proof that they're the only ones negotiating?

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

He "injected" himself because he was asked for a quote by a reporter. He also runs the city and has a vested interest, and I believe he sits on the board of the NCC, giving him even more reason to be involved. I get those that knock Watson because he's never found a microphone he didn't like, but damn, if this isn't something he should be addressing then I don't know what is.

(Also, read the article you linked. It's wandering, devoid of a succinct point, devoid of any hard facts and should barely qualify as an op-ed, let alone an article on which opinions should be based.)

The Mayors of Gatineau and Ottawa both have "Observer, non voting" chairs on the NCC, neither factor into any decision made by the NCC.

 

[Heady Topper]

No one, except you are saying that.

But, are you also saying that there is no difference between the private sector and the public sector???

Are you saying they both aren't equally capable? That's not right...

 

[Heady Topper]

The Mayors of Gatineau and Ottawa both have "Observer, non voting" chairs on the NCC, neither factor into any decision made by the NCC.

You don't know that they aren't being consulted or part of the dialogue though. They very well could be. Unless you're in the room, likely with Melnyk, you have no way of knowing for sure.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

Bill, you don't know that. Do you have proof that they're the only ones negotiating?

The timeline of the Lebreton Flats development negotiations are covered in the two Local Papers. As of now the City is not involved, but will be in the future, because of the city's responsibility for road and traffic management, and the planned parks.

The two principle groups who are negotiating right now, are the RLG, and the NCC
and as s far as NCC chief executive Mark Kristmanson is concerned, the LeBreton talks are going "generally as planned". In fact he said so recently and this was reported in the two local papers.

here the relevant excerpt.

Kristmanson said environmental studies are moving again, and that he had a productive lunch with Melnyk and Trinity boss John Ruddy three weeks ago.
Asked if comments like Melynk's undermine public confidence in the process, Kristmanson wouldn't comment on Melynk's statements, but said that in these sorts of huge projects, there will always be a "swirl of commentary."
"And we'll have our ups and downs on this process, but so far, so good. I'm not dismayed."

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

You don't know that they aren't being consulted or part of the dialogue though. They very well could be. Unless you're in the room, likely with Melnyk, you have no way of knowing for sure.

Well if you read what Watson is whining about, and compare that to what the Chief Executive the NCC said, one would come to the conclusion that Watson has not been involved in the current negotiations, from the picture he paints of the project status.


One the other hand, you have the Chief Executive the NCC saying "business as usual, no problems, as expected" ...... so I'll give more weight to what he says, that a Career Politician in an election year.

 

[Ray Kinsella]

The timeline of the Lebreton Flats development negotiations are covered in the two Local Papers. As of now the City is not involved, but will be in the future, because of the city's responsibility for road and traffic management, and the planned parks.

The two principle groups who are negotiating right now, are the RLG, and the NCC
and as s far as NCC chief executive Mark Kristmanson is concerned, the LeBreton talks are going "generally as planned". In fact he said so recently and this was reported in the two local papers.

here the relevant excerpt.

Kristmanson said environmental studies are moving again, and that he had a productive lunch with Melnyk and Trinity boss John Ruddy three weeks ago.
Asked if comments like Melynk's undermine public confidence in the process, Kristmanson wouldn't comment on Melynk's statements, but said that in these sorts of huge projects, there will always be a "swirl of commentary."
"And we'll have our ups and downs on this process, but so far, so good. I'm not dismayed."

But those articles in those two “local newspapers” are likely written by “unpaid volunteers”... so why give it any weight!

 

[slamigo]

The kind of people who move up within the government - like the Director of Communications for the Speaker of the House of Commons - generally do it by working their asses of.

Meh, the bureaucrats at the House are so lazy...especially procedural clerks. They’re the worst.

 

[BonkTastic]

Did you read the article ........ the land is Owned by the NCC, not the City, other than the planned park and library.

The Mayor is not involved at this point of the negotiations, he's reacting to the comments about the condo market that Melnyk made earlier in the week ....... I think that the RLG has some issues about the possible saturation of condos in the areas surrounding Lebreton Flats, and the RLG has some legitimate business issues, the Mayor hasn't got a clue about the Private sector and Urban development.

Reevely: Melnyk's right to be worried about financing LeBreton project with condos

The RLG is negotiating, at this time, with the NCC, and they're on the record as having no problems about the current state of negotiations...... the only person that is shooting off his mouth, is Watson, during an election year.

So the mayor of the city of Ottawa, which this development is being built in, in which Ottawa citizens will work, Ottawa citizens will live, Ottawa citizens will spend money at... he doesn't even get to have an OPINION about it?

Get out of here with that narrow-minded garbage-tier logic. If the NCC were proposing to put a max-security national penitentiary on that land, and the Mayor said nothing about it, you'd be livid. But this is a hockey arena, so he doesn't get an opinion about it?

What seems far, far more likely, the more you talk about this, is that you just don't like Jim Watson, and that this has nothing to do with Lebreton.

 

[inthewings]

No one, except you are saying that.

But, are you also saying that there is no difference between the private sector and the public sector???

There may be differences, but they're immaterial to whatever point you're trying to make in this thread:

Canada's civil service is world's most effective: UK report

The Canadian federal public service is actually quite good at what they do.

 

[BonkTastic]

No one, except you are saying that.

Your comments about the public service were laced with enough venom that it's pretty easy to tell how you feel about it.

I mean... you're not exactly covert about how you feel about these sorts of things. You drop clues like a dog drops deuces.

But, are you also saying that there is no difference between the private sector and the public sector???

No... but while we're on the topic, are you saying that it's somehow relevant?

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

But those articles in those two “local newspapers” are likely written by “unpaid volunteers”... so why give it any weight!

ha ha, you're funny ...... Local Papers, as in the Citizen and the Sun.

can't get past the community papers thing can you.

 

[Heady Topper]

Well if you read what Watson is whining about, and compare that to what the Chief Executive the NCC said, one would come to the conclusion that Watson has not been involved in the current negotiations, from the picture he paints of the project status.


One the other hand, you have the Chief Executive the NCC saying "business as usual, no problems, as expected" ...... so I'll give more weight to what he says, that a Career Politician in an election year.

On the other other hand, you have the person who won the bid whining about how it's too expensive and that he might not want to do it anymore. And you coming to your own distorted conclusions doesn't hold water. If you don't have a link confirming this, I'm sorry, I can't take it for gospel. The picture clearly being painted is that the mayor doesn't want to waste time with this clown.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

There may be differences, but they're immaterial to whatever point you're trying to make in this thread:

Canada's civil service is world's most effective: UK report

The Canadian federal public service is actually quite good at what they do.

Not, may be, there are differences.

The Public Sector does not create wealth in the economy, only the Private sector does.

That's a big difference.

 

[BonkTastic]

Meh, the bureaucrats at the House are so lazy...especially procedural clerks. They’re the worst.

I've heard mixed reviews about Hill staff from some friends who have worked there in the past.

Basically - anyone with no upwards mobility and have been in the same job for a decade are as useful as warts on a frog. Anyone with legit career aspirations are in and out of there within 5 years.

 

[Heady Topper]

ha ha, you're funny ...... Local Papers, as in the Citizen and the Sun.

can't get past the community papers thing can you.

You'll need to provide proof though. You can't go around asking to prove this, prove that and then go and speculate about stuff and believe your own fabrications, don't you think?

 

[BonkTastic]

Not, may be, there are differences.

The Public Sector does not create wealth in the economy, only the Private sector does.

That's a big difference.

 

[Ray Kinsella]

ha ha, you're funny ...... Local Papers, as in the Citizen and the Sun.

can't get past the community papers thing can you.

“Community papers” is something YOU said.

IT (the information) said “local newspapers”.

It sort of would be like you describing yourself as “tenacious” and I would interpret it as “narcissistic”.