Post-Game Talk: Scoring, lack of. Jets lose 3-0

[Heldig]

So neither wheeler or perfetti now are top 6ers according to folks on here. Ehlers gone. So we only have 3 top 6 fwds?

So you think Perfetti is a top 6 forward already. Maybe he is, barely.

Maybe I am expecting too much offense when the team is clearly playing Bowness' defensive scheme (which is amazing to see compared to the chaos we saw the past few seasons).

As great as Scheifele has been he sits 94th in scoring.

 

[KingBogo]

Wasting assets for rental isn't what I'd be doing if I was the Jets. Ride it out or get someone with term.

Or weaponize your cap space. There are a few overpaid middle 6 wingers out there that would still be a big upgrade and wouldn’t cost much in return. Just don’t get stuck with too much term.

 

[surixon]

So you think Perfetti is a top 6 forward already. Maybe he is, barely.

Maybe I am expecting too much offense when the team is clearly playing Bowness' defensive scheme (which is amazing to see compared to the chaos we saw the past few seasons).

As great as Scheifele has been he sits 94th in scoring.

The entire top 6 is struggling to generate offense so far in Bowness' offensive system. I think it's clear the main focus has been on defense and not offense though so the teams struggles to score shouldn't really be a surprise.

Couple this with Bowness' track record the last number of years with a Dallas team that was also very low scoring and I think we should probably be resigned to the fact this team likely doesn't score a lot or look all that dangerous at 5 on 5. This is a defensive/grinding coach so we see going to get a defensive/grinding team that doesn't score a lot of pretty goals.

I still maintain that Bones is here to pit in place a strong defensive foundation but they will need a different coach to come in and build the offense on top of it. This team needed that defensive foundation though so I'm not complaining about it.

 

[MardyBum]

Team needed a good middle 6 scoring W before Ehlers injury and surgery, definitely need one now. Jets are basically mid at offense and defense, which is fine for right now with Helle, but they need more shooting talent as they figure out how to properly play this system

 

[DRW204]

So you think Perfetti is a top 6 forward already. Maybe he is, barely.

Maybe I am expecting too much offense when the team is clearly playing Bowness' defensive scheme (which is amazing to see compared to the chaos we saw the past few seasons).

As great as Scheifele has been he sits 94th in scoring.

Personally I had perfetti in the 40ish pts for the year. The talks on here of him scoring 30+ goals, or scoring like other young current stars/Nhl players imo were far-fetched for this season. I don't disagree 40ish pts is probably a low end for top 6 wingers in absolute terms though. But for a rookie it's solid. This team has had problems scoring for the year, and the second line considerably at 5v5 the past few games. He needs to start helping scoring goals, but ofc its not all on him. It's a team issue.

I am just saying, Perfetti apparently isn't top 6, every one complains about wheeler as a top 6er and now we're out Ehlers. This is a problem.

 

[Heldig]

Personally I had perfetti in the 40ish pts for the year. The talks on here of him scoring 30+ goals, or scoring like other young current stars/Nhl players imo were far-fetched for this season. I don't disagree 40ish pts is probably a low end for top 6 wingers in absolute terms though. But for a rookie it's solid. This team has had problems scoring for the year, and the second line considerably at 5v5 the past few games. He needs to start helping scoring goals, but ofc its not all on him. It's a team issue.

I am just saying, Perfetti apparently isn't top 6, every one complains about wheeler as a top 6er and now we're out Ehlers. This is a problem.

Good points.

Yes, we were probably short a top 6 guy before Ehlers was injured depending on how you view Wheeler.

I really hoped Chevy would/could acquire a top 6 RW this offseason (Konecny, Bjorgstrand, Boeser / Garland...) and bump Wheeler down - giving him lower minutes and keeping him fresh for PP duty.

As far as D carries a team, not sure how many teams in the bottom 3rd of scoring succeed in the playoffs.

 

[surixon]

Personally I had perfetti in the 40ish pts for the year. The talks on here of him scoring 30+ goals, or scoring like other young current stars/Nhl players imo were far-fetched for this season. I don't disagree 40ish pts is probably a low end for top 6 wingers in absolute terms though. But for a rookie it's solid. This team has had problems scoring for the year, and the second line considerably at 5v5 the past few games. He needs to start helping scoring goals, but ofc its not all on him. It's a team issue.

I am just saying, Perfetti apparently isn't top 6, every one complains about wheeler as a top 6er and now we're out Ehlers. This is a problem.

Even with his slump he's scoring at a 40 point pace while learning solid defensive play. He's going to have periods where he's hot as well thatt balances things out.

Anyhow this team is 30th in terms of 5 on 5 g/60 so the whole team can't score worth a damn 5 on 5. I also don't really expect that to change much until the coaching is satisfied with the teams defensive play and opt to open things up more in the ozone.

Most everything the team is doing right now is about risk mitigation. Breakouts is always chip out if there is some pressure by the opposition on the wall. On offense almost always chip in or carry in and make the safe play to rim it behind the net to a waiting player to start the cycle. As mentioned by @ecload the plan is to then get it to the point and look for tips and rebounds off point shots. Everything is so risk adverse and simplified.

We see the benefits in the teams GA/60 and improved defensive play but those improvements are coming at the expense of the teams offensive play. I guess the hope is once that foundation is in place we maybe start to see more robust offensive schemes layered on top of it.

 

[DRW204]

Good points.

Yes, we were probably short a top 6 guy before Ehlers was injured depending on how you view Wheeler.

I really hoped Chevy would/could acquire a top 6 RW this offseason (Konecny, Bjorgstrand, Boeser / Garland...) and bump Wheeler down - giving him lower minutes and keeping him fresh for PP duty.

As far as D carries a team, not sure how many teams in the bottom 3rd of scoring succeed in the playoffs.

The fwd group is missing 3 top9ers so I do wonder if that'll up the urgency a bit for Chevy to make a move.

Barron should be back in a couple weeks. I also was wondering how Lucius has been as of late. Could he be an option? I'm not sure which teams are shopping top 6-9 fwds atm.

 

[gojetsgo]

 

[surixon]

The fwd group is missing 3 top9ers so I do wonder if that'll up the urgency a bit for Chevy to make a move.

Barron should be back in a couple weeks. I also was wondering how Lucius has been as of late. Could he be an option? I'm not sure which teams are shopping top 6-9 fwds atm.

Lucious is atleast a year away from what I've seen of him.

 

[sipowicz]

I would like to see Eyssimont move up the lineup. I think he has more to give.

He’s a better player than Hurtkins or Tonynado who are AHL level scrubs!

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Game could have gone either way.
When Pens scored, I thought, 'next goal wins'. Unfortunately Jets didn't get next goal.
We need more finish in front of the net. Well, anywhere actually. We need to be able to score.

We just couldn't hit the net.

Onto the next game.

Right. We hit goaltender, not twine.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I thought the Jets played pretty well. Jarry got pretty lucky.

I thought the Jets played pretty well. Jarry was pretty good.

 

[LowLefty]

Anyhow this team is 30th in terms of 5 on 5 g/60 so the whole team can't score worth a damn 5 on 5. I also don't really expect that to change much until the coaching is satisfied with the teams defensive play and opt to open things up more in the ozone.

They are getting shut down in the ozone - teams are playing them tight and our offense struggles when they don't have much room - especially without Ehlers.
The Pen's played 3 periods of defensive hockey against us - and they are one of the highest scoring teams - why do you suppose they did that - and why are a lot of good teams doing the same thing when they meet the Jets?
It's hard to open it up when the apposing team is taking away all your space and time.

I'm not sure system changes will have much of an impact - it's not like we don't already of 5 guys playing offense out there but having a lot of trouble getting anything going once they run into the blueline.

We lack players that can skate through a trap - Ehlers was one (he'd beat you wide) and to an extent, so was Apples (who would bull his way through).
Teams will hone in on your weaknesses and work to minimize your strengths - we are weak on zone entries and strong when we have time to make plays.

Looks like Bones is trying to build a one line team with offense - he's stacked his top line and threw the rest together and called it a second. PLD spends a huge amount of time tangled up with other player(s), Wheels is hurry, hurry hard for about 10/15 seconds and then floats, and Perfetti is left without a target.
Man, this line needs a shooter who can find open ice -

The thirds is shut down and the 4th is now getting next to nothing in minutes.

IMO, Bones is playing defensive because he is getting shut down and is hoping to get enough goals out of his top line to win - while he waits for reinforcements. Based on the line make up with what we have, I don't see systems change doing much good - it's mainly a player issue and the holes from injuries are killing us.

 

[Adam da bomb]

So no games for Ville.

 

[Adam da bomb]

They are getting shut down in the ozone - teams are playing them tight and our offense struggles when they don't have much room - especially without Ehlers.
The Pen's played 3 periods of defensive hockey against us - and they are one of the highest scoring teams - why do you suppose they did that - and why are a lot of good teams doing the same thing when they meet the Jets?
It's hard to open it up when the apposing team is taking away all your space and time.

I'm not sure system changes will have much of an impact - it's not like we don't already of 5 guys playing offense out there but having a lot of trouble getting anything going once they run into the blueline.

We lack players that can skate through a trap - Ehlers was one (he'd beat you wide) and to an extent, so was Apples (who would bull his way through).
Teams will hone in on your weaknesses and work to minimize your strengths - we are weak on zone entries and strong when we have time to make plays.

Looks like Bones is trying to build a one line team with offense - he's stacked his top line and threw the rest together and called it a second. PLD spends a huge amount of time tangled up with other player(s), Wheels is hurry, hurry hard for about 10/15 seconds and then floats, and Perfetti is left without a target.
Man, this line needs a shooter who can find open ice -

The thirds is shut down and the 4th is now getting next to nothing in minutes.

IMO, Bones is playing defensive because he is getting shut down and is hoping to get enough goals out of his top line to win - while he waits for reinforcements. Based on the line make up with what we have, I don't see systems change doing much good - it's mainly a player issue and the holes from injuries are killing us.

In that case I’d move Perfetti up and really become a 1 line team. Maybe try Gus on 2nd. We don’t have the players to play 4 line hockey. Also could be interesting moving Axel up Gagner is too slow.

 

[surixon]

They are getting shut down in the ozone - teams are playing them tight and our offense struggles when they don't have much room - especially without Ehlers.
The Pen's played 3 periods of defensive hockey against us - and they are one of the highest scoring teams - why do you suppose they did that - and why are a lot of good teams doing the same thing when they meet the Jets?
It's hard to open it up when the apposing team is taking away all your space and time.

I'm not sure system changes will have much of an impact - it's not like we don't already of 5 guys playing offense out there but having a lot of trouble getting anything going once they run into the blueline.

We lack players that can skate through a trap - Ehlers was one (he'd beat you wide) and to an extent, so was Apples (who would bull his way through).
Teams will hone in on your weaknesses and work to minimize your strengths - we are weak on zone entries and strong when we have time to make plays.

Looks like Bones is trying to build a one line team with offense - he's stacked his top line and threw the rest together and called it a second. PLD spends a huge amount of time tangled up with other player(s), Wheels is hurry, hurry hard for about 10/15 seconds and then floats, and Perfetti is left without a target.
Man, this line needs a shooter who can find open ice -

The thirds is shut down and the 4th is now getting next to nothing in minutes.

IMO, Bones is playing defensive because he is getting shut down and is hoping to get enough goals out of his top line to win - while he waits for reinforcements. Based on the line make up with what we have, I don't see systems change doing much good - it's mainly a player issue and the holes from injuries are killing us.

I would agree if we didn't see the exact same type of pattern in his Dallas teams. He seems to prefer this type of game plan. I don't disagree that more talent upfront would help a lot as well but we are definitely playing more low event defensive hockey and that seems by design.

 

[Inanna]

plays like our old friend Svetchnikov - only preferably at least one notch higher - and at a quicker pace.

So, in other words, not like Svetchnikov.

 

[surixon]

So no games for Ville.

Them being on the ice doesn't mean they will play tomorrow.

 

[LowLefty]

I would agree if we didn't see the exact same type of pattern in his Dallas teams. He seems to prefer this type of game plan. I don't disagree that more talent upfront would help a lot as well but we are definitely playing more low event defensive hockey and that seems by design.

I agree we are playing low event hockey - some of it by design (bottom 6) and some of it based on how the opposition is playing us (top six - especially line 2).

I don't think Scheif or KC no what low event hockey is -

The second line does and they are probably not happy with it - but that line was build for low event hockey.

Bottom 6 - absolutely

 

[Nickel eye Heel hers]

Perfetti makes some slick passes but other than that is he not a top 6 forward (yet).

Jets really need another top 6 forward.

I disagree.
He already has the skill and confidence of a top 6 forward.
Perfetti plays both ends of the ice, he makes clean passes, takes the puck off opposition sticks, and hustles back more often than the veteran top 6.

I do agree we need more depth at middle/top 6.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I like the idea of plugging Lambert into the lineup and see how he does. He played well in the preseason, and we'd have 2 young guys that can gain some NHL experience, in Lambert and Perfetti. If hedoesn't work out, you can send him back down. It's worth a shot.

He's done nothing in the A to even hint faintly at being ready for the NHL. We have a guy sitting in the press box who was scoring at a point and a half a game in the AHL. We have another guy playing on the 4th line who was scoring ppg in the AHL.

Its time to end the Gagner experiment on the 1st line. He can't keep up. Try Harkins there. Yes, Harkins. He has always played well when given the opportunity to play with skilled players. It is as a checker that he has been weak.

 

[Heldig]

I disagree.
He already has the skill and confidence of a top 6 forward.
Perfetti plays both ends of the ice, he makes clean passes, takes the puck off opposition sticks, and hustles back more often than the veteran top 6.

I do agree we need more depth at middle/top 6.

I have not watched ALL the games but in my viewing he is easily knocked off the puck (and off his feet), struggles along the boards and the play dies a LOT on his stick.

Obviously skilled. Not sure Bowness' system fits him very well. Also thinks he need a Scheifele or Connor on his line that will look to shoot first...hopefully we see continuous improvement

 

[Adam da bomb]

I'd be more interested in adding something to the second line to get them going - they look like 3 players that have no clue what each other is doing out there.

That’s because Wheeler is not a top 6 player anymore. Pld is not a superstar and perfetti right now is a complimentary top 6 player.

 

[surixon]

I agree we are playing low event hockey - some of it by design (bottom 6) and some of it based on how the opposition is playing us (top six - especially line 2).

I don't think Scheif or KC no what low event hockey is -

The second line does and they are probably not happy with it - but that line was build for low event hockey.

Bottom 6 - absolutely

What your describing is exactly what his Dallas Stars were. An offensive line backed by an offensive top pairing to help them generate with the rest tasked with being low event.

It might help our second line generate more offense if they weren't stuck with our third pairing backing them up the vast majority of the time. This is where a Heinola would be of use.