Proposal: Rumors and Proposals Thread | Under Sell and Over Deliver or Stuck in First Gear?

[Forgot About Drai]

They are, that’s my point, if a team who’s a near perfect fit, wants to move him, it’s likely best to stay well clear

Ahhh I see. Fair point.

 

[soothsayer]

To me Hamilton is pretty much what Bouchard will be once he gets going.

Rishaug this morning was on again about how dumb it was to walk away from "top pairing d man" Barrie and expect a 20 game pro to fill in. For next season in isolation he is probably right, but it drives me crazy that he can't see that it's quite likely that the contract becomes an albatross in year 2 which absolutely can't happen in a flat cap. Not worth the risk.

Yeah, there may be players whose leverage you would expect the Oilers to cave to, but Barrie isn't one of them. Hell, Nuge isn't one of them. If the Oilers aren't going to bend for RNH, they surely aren't going to accept a beating from Barrie.

 

[Aerchon]

Step 1. Get Nurse signed long term.

Step 2. Get the goaltending situation figured out.

Step 3. Fill out defense.

Step 4. Prioritize quality over quantity at the forward position. Too many reclamation projects and just throwing shit at the wall and hoping something sticks.

1 Quality forward to replace Nuge. Or bring back him at a reduced price and 4 years max.

1 Quality forward preferebly a #3 center.

Next year really should be a focus on quality and utilizing our prospect pool as much as possible. Benson, McLeod Holloway etc...

Resign guys like Puljujarvi and Yamamoto on cheap, long term, team friendly contract.

 

[iCanada]

I wonder if a guy like Boone Jenner could be pried from CBJ.

He'd look amazing at 3C or on Draisaitl's wing imo.

 

[iCanada]

Step 1. Get Nurse signed long term.

Step 2. Get the goaltending situation figured out.

Step 3. Fill out defense.

Step 4. Prioritize quality over quantity at the forward position. Too many reclamation projects and just throwing shit at the wall and hoping something sticks.

1 Quality forward to replace Nuge. Or bring back him at a reduced price and 4 years max.

1 Quality forward preferebly a #3 center.

Next year really should be a focus on quality and utilizing our prospect pool as much as possible. Benson, McLeod Holloway etc...

Resign guys like Puljujarvi and Yamamoto on cheap, long term, team friendly contract.

I think you can run with the defense as it is. I don't think our defense is really the problem.

Our wings are atrocious though. Don't get me wrong, I love Puljujarvi... but the fact that he's our best winger is pretty sad. I'm pretty sure we have the worst collective group of wingers in the league.

 

[K1984]

Yeah, there may be players whose leverage you would expect the Oilers to cave to, but Barrie isn't one of them. Hell, Nuge isn't one of them. If the Oilers aren't going to bend for RNH, they surely aren't going to accept a beating from Barrie.

Exactly.

The opinion that we should sign RNH to a less than comfortable contract because having him leave opens up too many holes is a valid one even if not everyone agrees with it.

Barrie though? Not a chance. It's not even like he was lights out in the playoffs, he was a disaster in Game 1 and 2 to the point where he got relegated to limited action on the 3rd pair. Had a better Game 3 and a really good Game 4, but if the point of re-signing him is to have this ultra reliable d-man that you can't get from a younger player as Rishaug perceives him it just isn't the case. He played his way to sheltered minutes just this playoff, how is that different from what you would get from Bouchard defensively?

The way I see it:

Offence = Barrie > Bouchard
Defence = Barrie => Bouchard (Barrie maybe slightly better, but not significant)
Puck moving = Barrie = Bouchard (Bouchard might even have a better first pass)
Salary = Bouchard >>>>>>>>>>>>> Barrie

 

[ujju2]

Should be a no go. You’d have to think why would a team, with a heavy Russian presence, competing for a cup, be willing to trade Kuznetsov? His contract is not great either

The fact that they have a heavy Russian presence is part of the problem I think. Kuzy seems to be a negative influence off-ice on guys like Samsonov and Orlov. Maybe that changes in a "boring" city like Edmonton without many Russians on the team.

Kuzy would provide us with a level of 2nd line scoring that we haven't had in a LONG time. The only thing to me is where he fits if McDavid and Leon are each centering their own lines. I don't think Kuznetsov has played wing really ever. So perhaps Drai has to play wing, either with McDavid or with Kuzy. Maybe we see something like this:

Draisaitl-McDavid-Yamamoto
RNH-Kuznetsov-Puljujarvi

I think that's a beautiful top-6 group.

Of course, all conditional on Kuzy being affordable. enough to obtain. His value has certainly plummeted over the past couple seasons, so if we can get him cheap I'd be all over it.

 

[belair]

Why?

You're taking on more salary for the next two years for a heavily declining player whose contract isn't buyout friendly. It makes much more sense to try to trade Neal at 50% retained or just buy it out altogether. Trading for a worse contract isn't the answer.

@CupofOil

Following the logic used in the article, he's still a highly productive puck-moving offensive D that would be available to Edmonton in the instance Klefbom remained injured. Elite PP, stays healthy and addresses a role we filled with a combination of Russell/Lagesson/Jones/Koekkoek/Kulikov this past season.

He's not the most preferable option, but at the expense of dead cap, he's an upgrade.

It's a deal where both teams could play with retention and Edmonton could probably squeeze out an asset or two, because Florida is ultimately saving themselves cap space assuming they buy out Neal.

 

[ujju2]

Any chance at all the Avs could be convinced to trade Nichushkin? I've been super impressed by his play in the Vegas series, but the production hasn't really matched my eye test. Could be a hidden gem imo.

 

[soothsayer]

Any chance at all the Avs could be convinced to trade Nichushkin? I've been super impressed by his play in the Vegas series, but the production hasn't really matched my eye test. Could be a hidden gem imo.

No way Colorado trades one of the best players in the world . . .

 

[belair]

Not even that.

Barrie is a player you find value in but you don’t overpay and tie down cap too. The same reason Colorado dealt him in the first place, the same reason Toronto signed Brodie and let Barrie walk, and the same reason Edmonton will likely sign or trade for a more complete player this year.

Barrie is the player who gets signed to a big ticket on a team like Vancouver, who throw money everywhere, or Seattle, where you need to sell some Jerseys and have name recognition.

Colorado traded Barrie because they drafted Makar and realized he was ready before they moved on from the former. Toronto traded Barrie because he was a horrendous fit and was utilized poorly. Highly doubtful Barrie had any interest of signing there.

If Barrie's able to grab a big ticket, let him. But if he's willing to sign a reasonable extension, you do it because he's a very good player that you don't have the ability to replace.

 

[Smartguy]

Colorado traded Barrie because they drafted Makar and realized he was ready before they moved on from the former. Toronto traded Barrie because he was a horrendous fit and was utilized poorly. Highly doubtful Barrie had any interest of signing there.

If Barrie's able to grab a big ticket, let him. But if he's willing to sign a reasonable extension, you do it because he's a very good player that you don't have the ability to replace.

This alone isn’t true, they also filled a massive hole in their lineup with those dollars they would have had to pay Barrie with Kadri.

Much like Edmonton spending 6M+ with term when they have so many more pressing holes, with budding defense prospects in Broberg and Bouchard.

If they choose to re-sign Barrie, for a “reasonable” number, what do you do with Bouchard? Because Larsson is rumored to be re-signed, they already couldn’t squeeze him in this last year. Move Bear then to allow him room to grow? Bear is used on the PK, something Bouchard likely won’t be. There also shouldn’t be a universe where Bouchard in 2 years shouldn’t be on PP1, without him having a massive regression, he’s borderline at that stage already.

A big reason Holland bought out Sekera, in his words, we’re to allow a guy like Bear into the lineup.

Re-signing Barrie at a number over 4.5, which he laughs at, is a luxury the Oilers can’t afford.

 

[CupofOil]

@CupofOil

Following the logic used in the article, he's still a highly productive puck-moving offensive D that would be available to Edmonton in the instance Klefbom remained injured. Elite PP, stays healthy and addresses a role we filled with a combination of Russell/Lagesson/Jones/Koekkoek/Kulikov this past season.

He's not the most preferable option, but at the expense of dead cap, he's an upgrade.

It's a deal where both teams could play with retention and Edmonton could probably squeeze out an asset or two, because Florida is ultimately saving themselves cap space assuming they buy out Neal.

They don't need an "elite" PP Dman. You can plug any Dman with an ounce of skill in that role and the PP will be in good shape. Hell, Bouchard could likely play that role next season and it wouldn't miss a beat.

Yandle is an old very expensive 3rd pairing Dman whose contract is worse than Neal's, a lot worse because it's a higher caphit and is buyout proof. It makes no sense IMO.

If you want a puckmoving Dman for the bottom pairing, sign somebody like Gustafsson for cheap and buyout Neal. I'd much, much rather take on the $1.9M dead cap in Years 3 and 4 and have the near $4M in cap space in Years 1 and 2 than clog up the cap in Years 1 and 2 with a worse contract and have the freed up money in Years 3 and 4.

The next few years are absolutely critical in the Oilers development and they have a lot of holes to fill. Holland needs to use any mechanism possible within reason to improve the team in the next few years. Trading Neal for Yandle complicates that.
Furthermore, if they don't buy out Neal or find a way to make that contract disappear through other means then the Lucic trade was pointless and actually a losing trade because they lost the pick, took on a bit more cap and Lucic is a better player currently.

 

[belair]

This alone isn’t true, they also filled a massive hole in their lineup with those dollars they would have had to pay Barrie with Kadri.

Much like Edmonton spending 6M+ with term when they have so many more pressing holes, with budding defense prospects in Broberg and Bouchard.

If they choose to re-sign Barrie, for a “reasonable” number, what do you do with Bouchard? Because Larsson is rumored to be re-signed, they already couldn’t squeeze him in this last year. Move Bear then to allow him room to grow? Bear is used on the PK, something Bouchard likely won’t be. There also shouldn’t be a universe where Bouchard in 2 years shouldn’t be on PP1, without him having a massive regression, he’s borderline at that stage already.

A big reason Holland bought out Sekera, in his words, we’re to allow a guy like Bear into the lineup.

Re-signing Barrie at a number over 4.5, which he laughs at, is a luxury the Oilers can’t afford.

They retained on Barrie to pick up Kadri. They got massive value in the deal. And with Makar on the roster taking all of Barrie's assignments, it was incredibly easy for them to walk away.

And if Barrie was willing to re-sign for something in that ballpark, they'd be stupid to walk away. Because there's no replacement for the offense that he's capable of. He produces at the rate of a high end winger here. Something that we've yet to see from one of our wingers.

It's pointless to speculate on this because Barrie's looking for a payday. But the same logic would apply to signing Hamilton, or trading for Jones or Parayko. What are you doing with Bouchard?

Bouchard is a bottom pairing defenseman next season. Regardless of what happens with the roster.

 

[McJesusSaves97]

I think you can run with the defense as it is. I don't think our defense is really the problem.

Our wings are atrocious though. Don't get me wrong, I love Puljujarvi... but the fact that he's our best winger is pretty sad. I'm pretty sure we have the worst collective group of wingers in the league.

100% agree that we have the worst collection of wingers, but our D is certainly not okay. Who is our 1RD & 2LD...those are very important.

 

[belair]

They don't need an "elite" PP Dman. You can plug any Dman with an ounce of skill in that role and the PP will be in good shape. Hell, Bouchard could likely play that role next season and it wouldn't miss a beat.

Yandle is an old very expensive 3rd pairing Dman whose contract is worse than Neal's, a lot worse because it's a higher caphit and is buyout proof. It makes no sense IMO.

If you want a puckmoving Dman for the bottom pairing, sign somebody like Gustafsson for cheap and buyout Neal. I'd much, much rather take on the $1.9M dead cap in Years 3 and 4 and have the near $4M in cap space in Years 1 and 2 than clog up the cap in Years 1 and 2 with a worse contract and have the freed up money in Years 3 and 4.

The next few years are absolutely critical in the Oilers development and they have a lot of holes to fill. Holland needs to use any mechanism possible within reason to improve the team in the next few years. Trading Neal for Yandle complicates that.
Furthermore, if they don't buy out Neal or find a way to make that contract disappear through other means then the Lucic trade was pointless and actually a losing trade because they lost the pick, took on a bit more cap and Lucic is a better player currently.

I don't disagree completely, but I'm saying that I believe there's logic behind it because Yandle is still a productive NHL defenseman. Still good for 30-40 points per year.

If Holland can squeeze out an asset or two in a deal with Florida, they're coming out ahead.

 

[belair]

I think you can run with the defense as it is. I don't think our defense is really the problem.

Our wings are atrocious though. Don't get me wrong, I love Puljujarvi... but the fact that he's our best winger is pretty sad. I'm pretty sure we have the worst collective group of wingers in the league.

This is the defense today...

Nurse - Bear
Jones - Russell
Lagesson - Bouchard

Barrie and Larsson are UFAs and Klefbom is still highly doubtful to return.

At the very least the team needs a capable second pairing LHD in a addition to Larsson returning because Klefbom coming back at 100% is highly improbable.

 

[CupofOil]

I don't disagree completely, but I'm saying that I believe there's logic behind it because Yandle is still a productive NHL defenseman. Still good for 30-40 points per year.

If Holland can squeeze out an asset or two in a deal with Florida, they're coming out ahead.

If Florida attaches a forward that can instantly upgrade the top 9 then I'd consider it but this eliminates the buy out option so you're stuck with Yandle for the next two years whereas they could just rid of the Neal headache one way or another right now with the worst case scenario being them dealing with $1.9 dead cap in Years 3 and 4.

 

[780il]

Canes fans set the bar at 7.5m for Dougie. Say that anyone going over that will regret it pretty fast, and I’m with them. You don’t give that much money to a guy that can’t anchor a pairing. He’s always been able to play with Gio and Slavin that really anchor and stabilize that pairing so he can do his thing offensively. Yes, we have a guy like that in Nurse, but if your paying upwards of 7.5 to even 8.5 million for dman you want a guy that can anchor his own pairing and we can run Nurse/other guy like Nashville used to run Josi/Subban or Josi/Weber on different pairings.

Hamilton’s gonna get a massive contract that he almost certainly won’t be worth. If we’re going for a big name defender this summer, go for Jones or don’t go for one at all.

 

[belair]

If Florida attaches a forward that can instantly upgrade the top 9 then I'd consider it but this eliminates the buy out option so you're stuck with Yandle for the next two years whereas they could just rid of the Neal headache one way or another right now with the worst case scenario being them dealing with $1.9 dead cap in Years 3 and 4.

This is what I'm suggesting. At the very least, it would need to be a net 0 cap impact. They'd have to retain. But you could probably squeeze them for an asset or two, assuming Yandle was willing to waive.

Odds are that guys like Acciari or Vatrano are fair game. They need to shed salary and they need to open up roster slots for rookies coming in.

I do think the Oilers ultimately buy out the Neal contract, but this is an option that piqued my interest because the $3.7m freed up probably doesn't get you much of an upgrade at LD looking at the options available in free agency.

 

[McAsuno]

 

[AddyTheWrath]

Do they have any inside info even? Probably just speculating on the rumors.

 

[Oilhawks]

I don’t see why they trade for Seth Jones and why he extends here (maybe they protect Caleb and that helps), but okay

 

[Forgot About Drai]

Do they have any inside info even? Probably just speculating on the rumors.

To be fair, Oddshark has Raptors as the 2nd biggest favorite for Kawhi when there was ZERO reports on Kawhi coming to raps.

 

[Nostradumbass]

Do they have any inside info even? Probably just speculating on the rumors.

Can the GMs place bets?