Speculation: Roster Building Thread Part XIV: There ain't no gettin' off of this train we're on

[NernieBichols]

You guys also don’t understand players’ leverages in these things. Everyone and their mom would burn you at the stake for saying karlsson was gonna have to be traded or lost for nothing and that he would end up on the block. Same with seguin, his free agency is coming up. He was traded to the stars, he wasn’t drafted by them, and he didn’t sign a ufa deal there. Who says he wants to stay in Dallas, TX for the rest of his career. Dallas will be in the same position as these other teams have been in, the same position the rangers were in with mcdonagh and the rangers made the right move and traded him before it was too late. Did it with Stepan too. Did it with Callahan, and didn’t do it with Girardi and staal bc it would have killed the teams cup chances mid-season.

Seguin is either gonna be traded or will go UFA. Trade value is not what you think or even his own GM thinks with these deadlines in place.

 

[NernieBichols]

An interesting observation I’ve made watching these situations play out with players contracts and trade status.

As a simple fan, I would trade players proactively if I saw these situations arising, the best value your ever gonna get is by making the call early and a team paying a real premium for cost-controlled years

But I seen from teams- owners and GMs points of view, a lot of teams look at the cost of the player, the value of said player to that year or years of ticket paying customers and the product they pay to see. I’ve gotten the inklings that some teams hold on to these guys even though they know the eventual is coming, bc the owner is a fixed cost kind of thinking, if I were to trade this guy away, even though I know I’m gonna loss him for nothing and my hockey product will suffer later, I’m not gonna risk fan $$ support by trading the guy now.

A lot of organizations are not in the business of building and maintaining a championship caliber hockey organization. They care about making money. And that leads to short term $ based decisions and not hockey roster building based decisions. That’s why you see all these prime players waiting for their UFA status to come up. More and more guys are gonna go UFA or take it all the way up to the deadline to pick their locations. It’s just the evolution of the player’s business side of things. Looking out for what he really wants, same way the owners do

 

[Lays]

I like the looks of that young big RD Dallas have, Johns? What’s his name?

Anyone know if he is untouchable for them? He is big and tough, but he actually also is a pretty good player. I am sure someone will check CF% and he is probably not a Clendenning there, Dallas are what they are and he has a defensive role. But he actually skates fairly well and also moves the puck fairly well.

New acquaintance for me, but I would move Zucc straight up for him if Dallas was willing. Then trade Shatty and go with TDA/Johns/Pionk on the right side.

Johns is not good..I’d rather have a 3rd round pick than him honestly he’s a decent 5/6 D with no more potential

 

[flamesftw]

I like the looks of that young big RD Dallas have, Johns? What’s his name?

Anyone know if he is untouchable for them? He is big and tough, but he actually also is a pretty good player. I am sure someone will check CF% and he is probably not a Clendenning there, Dallas are what they are and he has a defensive role. But he actually skates fairly well and also moves the puck fairly well.

New acquaintance for me, but I would move Zucc straight up for him if Dallas was willing. Then trade Shatty and go with TDA/Johns/Pionk on the right side.

Lindell maybe

 

[Roo Returns]

Dallas has a great thing going with Seguin. Those type of players don't grow on trees and they were extremely lucky (it's their version of the Hodge/Middleton, McD/Gomez trade). Rousell, Spezza, Lethonnen, and Hamnuis...there's your Seguin raise money. He'll prob make like $11 million.

 

[Captain Lindy]

Would it be safe to buy a Spooner or Namestnikov jersey or tee shirt? What do you guys think?

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Stephen Johns isn't untouchable, but he isn't that great

No real desire to acquire him. And stop with the Seguin stuff, Dallas will break the bank to keep him there, as they should

Would it be safe to buy a Spooner or Namestnikov jersey or tee shirt? What do you guys think?

I'm planning to buy a Namestnikov shirt the next opportunity I get

But I wouldn't say it's safe for either

 

[hi]

Would it be safe to buy a Spooner or Namestnikov jersey or tee shirt? What do you guys think?

Everyone should get tested for the Hossa fabric allergy but you should be fine

 

[Captain Lindy]

I'd wait until training camp starts, at least. I don't know but I would suspect Spooner/Namestnikov are the type of players we want on a team we want to win in the future? Maybe that's just me.

 

[Captain Lindy]

Everyone should get tested for the Hossa fabric allergy but you should be fine

I prefer tee shirts, actually, long sleeve of course.

 

[Alluckks]

Long sleeve t-shirts are the dominant t-shirt race

Roll up them sleeves, good to go

 

[bl02]

I'd wait until training camp starts, at least. I don't know but I would suspect Spooner/Namestnikov are the type of players we want on a team we want to win in the future? Maybe that's just me.

I agree. Both are guys that have had taste of winning. Obviously Names with TB and spooner this year with Boston. They are in their prime and capable of contributing points and character.

 

[NernieBichols]

Dallas has a great thing going with Seguin. Those type of players don't grow on trees and they were extremely lucky (it's their version of the Hodge/Middleton, McD/Gomez trade). Rousell, Spezza, Lethonnen, and Hamnuis...there's your Seguin raise money. He'll prob make like $11 million.

That’s all fine and well from Dallas POV, but how about seguin’s.

Yeah it’s a great situation for Dallas. Seguin can get the same money from his team of choose.

I know you have been big on Dallas being happy with seguin. Yeah I’m sure they are. That doesn’t mean seguin is gonna resign for the rest of his career in Dallas.

 

[Lion Hound]

Would it be safe to buy a Spooner or Namestnikov jersey or tee shirt? What do you guys think?

Id go with Spooner

 

[Edge]

I may in the minority, but I think both Names and Spoon will be on the opening night roster.

 

[TheTakedown]

There's a lot of talk here about trading Zucc at the draft. With all the prospects this team has gained in the past 2 seasons, and a wealth of picks in this years draft I just don't see them making this move.
If Zucc was moved I think they will look for a roster player rather then a prospect and a pick.

I have to agree here. I'm not seeing any reason to trade Zucc. He's not stepan (overpaid with NMC), he's not Nash (Overpaid by a ton), Grabner (Low key UFA Rental)...

What I would like to think is that Zucc takes a 4 year $5.35M contract, something similar to what Zibanejad and Kreider got. He's averaging out as a 57 point player who still oozes talent and has a very vocal personality for this team.

He's someone I would hang onto. At $5.35M, he's not really overpaid, as long as that contract is back-loaded (for buyout purposes) and is 4 or less years.

 

[TheTakedown]

Would anyone consider Boedker if SJ was willing to get creative? Paul Martin has $4.85m cap hit next year only. Beodker has $4m for next year and the following year.

Staal for Boedker + Martin?

year 1
5.7m for $4m + $4.85m
-$3.15m

year 2
$5.7m for $4m
+$1.7m

year 3
$5.7m for $0
+$5.7m

Perhaps the Rangers retain $1.4m so it looks like:

year 1
4.3m for $4m + $4.85m
-$4.55m

year 2
$4.3m for $4m
+$0.3m

year 3
$4.3m for $0
+$4.3m

Overall it gets both teams a bit of help. SJ is probably looking to compete over the next 2-3 years with Pavelski, Thornton, Couture, Jones, Burns. This frees up cap space for them to dabble in UFA this off-season and gives them a nice shut-down defenseman to help Vlasic and Braun. The Rangers add a player in Boedker who is a nice 3rd line speed winger. Perhaps he helps make up for some speed lost by losing Grabner. Yes he is overpaid but his contract runs 1 year less than Staal.

Boedker would fit perfectly in AV's system...

Now if only a coach could take that speed element from AV's system and implement it with actual defense...

 

[EdJovanovski]

I’m sure at the very least Namestnikov is staying since Gorton was the one who initiated the Miller/Namestnikov swap, it wasn’t like he was just a body or throw in for McDonagh

 

[TheTakedown]

He played great his us and seemed like a good teammate, hope he makes out like a bandit on what could be his final contract.

I get the feeling Grabs doesn't want to cash out. He's already made $21M, and he still has a skillset where he can contribute. I'd like to believe that his good play for NYR is due to the fact that he's comfortable here, in which case He's probably take a pay cut.

$2M/year for 3 years is a raise on what he was making, still a pay cut against the UFA market

 

[Irishguy42]

 

[DutchShamrock]

I have to agree here. I'm not seeing any reason to trade Zucc. He's not stepan (overpaid with NMC), he's not Nash (Overpaid by a ton), Grabner (Low key UFA Rental)...

What I would like to think is that Zucc takes a 4 year $5.35M contract, something similar to what Zibanejad and Kreider got. He's averaging out as a 57 point player who still oozes talent and has a very vocal personality for this team.

He's someone I would hang onto. At $5.35M, he's not really overpaid, as long as that contract is back-loaded (for buyout purposes) and is 4 or less years.

If you have to structure the contract for buyout purposes, it's a bad contract on day 1.

 

[RangerBoy]

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Shut Shattenkirk down for the season for Christ sake

No need for him to come back on this throwaway season

Come back next year

 

[Irishguy42]

Sproul up whole ADA is out

 

[duhmetreE]

Kreider Chytil Zibanejad
Kovy Names Buchnevich
Spoon Hayes MZA
Vesey Andersson Fast

I feel that's pretty strong forward group. Making a major assumption that Chytil could perform at 1c.

Hopefully with a different system our defense with Hank can tighten up.