Roster and Fantasy GM Thread: Pre-Draft Silly Season
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Bleach Clean
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On Gagner - yes, I do.
Not sure on Del Zotto. Probably more of a neutral value.
Bleach Clean
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How are you coming to the assertion that Gagner is viewed as a cap dump around the league after 34 games? Or, that Del Zotto is not one during the same time frame?
I'm being a bit pedantic here because I'm not sure that this perception is corroborated anywhere. Gagner has been bad here. We think it's a poor contract, but I'm not sure the league does. Not in 34 games anyway. It's like saying he was a cap dump as soon as his contract was signed...
A cap dump doesn't garner any positive value. The team takes nothing back, or negative value back. Is that your interpretation as well?
- Jan 23, 2010
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I think term is important - Gagner has an additional 2 years left while MDZ only has 1. Del Zotto also played very well for a long stretch earlier than this year, while Gagner has had no such stretch.
Besides, lots of higher-priced UFAs become negative assets pretty quickly after signing.
Here's a better question - if the Canucks were to waive Gagner and MDZ, would either get picked up? I'd say a definite no for Gagner.
Addison Rae
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I'm probably in the minority here but I wouldn't mind taking a run at Kris Letang, this is a player that's been the second most productive defender of this era behind only Erik Karlsson. He's having a rough season, but this is a player that's been regarded as a number 1 defender for the past ~5 years. Having Chris Tanev on this team allows Letang to get easier deployment and can help anchor this teams power play for the next 5 years.
If you're able to "buy low" on him at the price of Alex Edler, Brandon Sutter and a young piece not named Horvat, Pettersson, Juolevi or Boeser I'd do it. A top 4 offensive minded RHD has been what this team has needed for as long as I can remember. He obviously has an extensive injury history and is on a pretty rich contract, but if they're able to move Sutter in this deal I wouldn't worry as much about Letangs cap hit.
Just spit balling here.
If you're able to "buy low" on him at the price of Alex Edler, Brandon Sutter and a young piece not named Horvat, Pettersson, Juolevi or Boeser I'd do it. A top 4 offensive minded RHD has been what this team has needed for as long as I can remember. He obviously has an extensive injury history and is on a pretty rich contract, but if they're able to move Sutter in this deal I wouldn't worry as much about Letangs cap hit.
Just spit balling here.
I think it's a safe bet to say we're not on his 18 team trade list, but who knows. I still question Edler waiving his NTC as well.
Addison Rae
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Horse McHindu
They call me Horse.....
Hence, my earlier think-outloud idea about trading for Dion Phaneuf.
The Canucks take on a horrid contract, but atleast said player gives us depth in a position that we're in dire need of (i.e. Top 4 RHD). The Canucks also get a 1st round pick back. I'm not a huge fan of this idea (I don't think it will work from a long term cap standpoint in terms of us re-upping our next core), but I haven't done the math.
I think it is also safe to say the Pens want no part of Brandon Sutter. The GM there has dealt him away twice. Mention him on the main boards and pen's fans all barf at the mention of him coming back.
Addison Rae
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A GM trading a player away for practically zero value (Rutherford with Pouliot) is different than trading him for value. Rutherford traded Sutter+ in a trade for Jordan Staal, Carolina needed a centre capable of playing 2nd like minutes behind Eric Staal so they traded Sutter for a 24 year old ~55 point Selke level centre.
In the second deal he traded Sutter for a better player on a significantly better contract and got a high pick.
Right now Pittsburgh has a glaring hole at 3C, I understand your point but I don't think it's fair to suggest that this GM doesn't value Sutter just because he traded him 2 times.
As for their fans barfing af the mention of Sutter, I barfed af the idea of him coming here pre-trade but that didn't stop my GM.
Baby Pettersson
Moderator
Looking like Vanek could return a decent piece at the deadline. You think we could rob a late first off some team?
Ryp37
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Wo Yorfat
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What? No. Last yr at the deadline he was .79 ppg (38 in 48). This yr he's at .62 (23 in 37) and -14 as opposed to +2. He got a 4th when doing much better. Both yrs he'll have been a pure rental.
Could a desperate gm pay more for a player despite a drop off in performance? Sure. Could the gap be a 4th to a 1st? No f***ing chance.
The only way I see us getting a 1st for him would be to also take on a somewhat big cap dump, and it may not even be a 1st for this year's draft. It's probably not realistic, but I'd look at something like Vanek to Minnesota for Ennis and their 1st*. Ennis is signed for another year @ $4.6M, Minnesota has no cap space, and they could use another top 9 forward. And yes, I know they bought him out last year.
*conditional on them making the playoffs, otherwise it's pushed back a year
y2kcanucks
Le Sex God
The only way I see us getting a 1st for him would be to also take on a somewhat big cap dump, and it may not even be a 1st for this year's draft. It's probably not realistic, but I'd look at something like Vanek to Minnesota for Ennis and their 1st*. Ennis is signed for another year @ $4.6M, Minnesota has no cap space, and they could use another top 9 forward. And yes, I know they bought him out last year.
*conditional on them making the playoffs, otherwise it's pushed back a year
Why would Benning take on a cap dump when he can just go out and sign free agents?
/Benning
Melvin
21/12/05
Baby Pettersson
Moderator
I feel like Vanek puts up enough points that some stupid GM would overpay for him. But then again not every GM is Benning. I have to remember that.
RandV
It's a wolf v2.0
Yes this is where expectations should be set. But... trade deadlines prices are highly situational and player values can vary from year to year, so there's always the chance that depending on the team and the need you could get a much better return. Still early but looking ahead to this deadline if both Chicago and Pittsburgh are going to be out that could embolden a number of teams to make more of a push turning it into a better sellers market.
I think GMs already know that Vanek is not a playoff performer. He is a lazy floater who cannot grind through the tougher postseason. He is extremely skilled but does near nothing for any playoff team. I would be happy if he brought back a 5th
ginner classic
Dammit Jim!
to be fair....Recchi spent a great deal of his career as a floater. Age can change people.
RobertKron
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He was also a doctor that could diagnose injuries thousands of miles away on tv...
RobertKron
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So he had a strong NHL career while going to med school. Doesn’t sound like a floater to me.
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