Player Discussion Rick Nash

[will1066]

Maybe we put too much pressure on him. You know how tough we can be on our players.


If you just took what I wrote seriously, you're too serious.

 

[Inferno]

When we use regular season stats we say only use the most recent stats so it fits the narrative...when we use playoff stats we use all the stats since the most recent don't fit the narrative.

What're nashs points per 60 last few seasons...ppg isn't as useful since his toi is lower than most other players of his ilk...and he probably gets the most pktoi of his peers...

 

[True Blue]

I've kept a list of Rick Nash excuses since 2014, and

It's the fan's fault

might be the best yet.

Kudos @SlapshotTheMovie

When there are more excuses than playoff goals, that is an issue.

 

[True Blue]

Like I said I go back and forth about whether I would still pull the trigger on that deal.

I would not. But again, that is just me. Did not love the trade then, hate it now.

I get your "clutch" points. Fair enough. Let's then just say that various reasons, his disappearance in the playoffs has been the single biggest disappointment to me.

 

[TheTakedown]

delete

 

[SA16]

When we use regular season stats we say only use the most recent stats so it fits the narrative...when we use playoff stats we use all the stats since the most recent don't fit the narrative.

What're nashs points per 60 last few seasons...ppg isn't as useful since his toi is lower than most other players of his ilk...and he probably gets the most pktoi of his peers...

It is in fact the 3rd best among any Ranger since 14-15 to play in the playoffs. Zibanejad 2.28 in 12 games, then Brassard 2.27 in 24, then Nash 1.97 in 36.

If you want to remove 14-15 since he had a lot of points then well since 15-16 he is 2nd on the teams in points/60 after Zuccarello among players who have played at least 200 mins 5v5 (7th among 18 players if you drop to 100 mins but then you have real small sample size coming in like...Glass being first).

He hasn't been bad in the playoffs for years people just like to complain because of two playoffs 4-5 years ago where he shot 3.2% over 125 shots.

 

[TheTakedown]

When we use regular season stats we say only use the most recent stats so it fits the narrative...when we use playoff stats we use all the stats since the most recent don't fit the narrative.

What're nashs points per 60 last few seasons...ppg isn't as useful since his toi is lower than most other players of his ilk...and he probably gets the most pktoi of his peers...

In the past 4 seasons, plus this current season, Nash is currently at .6PPG.

If you cut out his 14-15 campaign, which was clearly a fluke, he's a .54 PPG.

This current season, he's at .4PPG...

ALL of these numbers are completely unacceptable for his salary. He's been worth his contract exactly 2 seasons, and 1 of those he was a no show for the final 1/4 of the regular season, and then stat-padded himself in the playoffs.

It is in fact the 3rd best among any Ranger since 14-15 to play in the playoffs. Zibanejad 2.28 in 12 games, then Brassard 2.27 in 24, then Nash 1.97 in 36.

If you want to remove 14-15 since he had a lot of points then well since 15-16 he is 2nd on the teams in points/60 after Zuccarello among players who have played at least 200 mins 5v5 (

That points to a system issue. If Rick Nash has been your best player point wise, then this team just isn't very good

 

[SA16]

That points to a system issue. If Rick Nash has been your best player point wise, then this team just isn't very good

Except his 1.97 pts/60 in the playoffs the last 3 playoffs is 12th best among forwards who have played over 300 mins (100 players) so he really has not been the problem at all his production has been significantly above average.

That’s a higher pts/60 than Kessel, Pavelski, Kane, Backstrom, Tavares and a bunch of other guys I can’t check because if Corsica crashes on me one more time my computer may go right out the window.

 

[eco's bones]

0 points in his last 10 games. 6 points in his last 23 games. Nash's offense usually slows down in the latter part of the year. It's already at such a crawl that I don't think it can slow down anymore than it has already.

 

[McRanger]

I would not. But again, that is just me. Did not love the trade then, hate it now.

I get your "clutch" points. Fair enough. Let's then just say that various reasons, his disappearance in the playoffs has been the single biggest disappointment to me.

Him being a shell of himself in 2014 is a disappointment that's going to linger for a long time. Its probably the biggest reason we didn't win in 2014.

But he was a big part of the reason we went made it as far as we did in 2015. He gave us exactly what can be expected to get when he's healthy.

As for the trade I wasn't a huge fan when it happened. But I think that was just attachment to guys like Dubi and AA. Nash has grown on me since the trade. Speaking from personal experience concussions are serious news. And its extraordinarily irksome how people either pretend they don't exist or call them excuses.

 

[silverfish]

0 points in his last 10 games. 6 points in his last 23 games. Nash's offense usually slows down in the latter part of the year. It's already at such a crawl that I don't think it can slow down anymore than it has already.

Nash's career points/gp by month:

October - 0.81
November - 0.78
December - 0.70
January - 0.80
February - 0.81
March - 0.73
April - 0.75

 

[McRanger]

Except his 1.97 pts/60 in the playoffs the last 3 playoffs is 12th best among forwards who have played over 300 mins (100 players) so he really has not been the problem at all his production has been significantly above average.

That’s a higher pts/60 than Kessel, Pavelski, Kane, Backstrom, Tavares and a bunch of other guys I can’t check because if Corsica crashes on me one more time my computer may go right out the window.

He's not wrong about the system, though. Its not very adaptable and that is problematic in 7 games series. Both on offense and defense.

 

[offdacrossbar]

0 points in his last 10 games. 6 points in his last 23 games. Nash's offense usually slows down in the latter part of the year. It's already at such a crawl that I don't think it can slow down anymore than it has already.

pretty much

not really sure what smashing numbers together over long periods of an otherwise decent career does for us right now.

no one is disputing what his numbers are for an entire career. but defending him for his lack of results today by continually looking back at what he produced as a much younger man does nothing for me.

PAST PERFORMANCE IS NOT INDICATIVE OF FUTURE RESULTS

rick nash today. 0 points in last 10 games for 8 mil per. blah.

 

[Quinnisinoverhishead]

Nash has been a useful player. However, he has not lived up to his cap hit.
If he wants to be a New York hero, he should do us a favour and sign 3 years at 3mill per.
I would love to see a line of Filip Chytil - Lias Andersson -Rick Nash.
Would be a pretty good third line.

 

[LeetchisGod]

Nash has been a useful player. However, he has not lived up to his cap hit.
If he wants to be a New York hero, he should do us a favour and sign 3 years at 3mill per.
I would love to see a line of Filip Chytil - Lias Andersson -Rick Nash.
Would be a pretty good third line.

I have no desire to see Nash in a Ranger uniform for three more years. His production is pathetic now and is likely to get worse. He is tied for tenth on the team in points. Yuck.

 

[Ori]

Nash will more likely be moved end of this season or earlier - both Chytil & Lias gain benefits of players who is quick to play the puck like Miller, Zucc, or Buch.

 

[Inferno]

In the past 4 seasons, plus this current season, Nash is currently at .6PPG.

If you cut out his 14-15 campaign, which was clearly a fluke, he's a .54 PPG.

This current season, he's at .4PPG...

ALL of these numbers are completely unacceptable for his salary. He's been worth his contract exactly 2 seasons, and 1 of those he was a no show for the final 1/4 of the regular season, and then stat-padded himself in the playoffs.



That points to a system issue. If Rick Nash has been your best player point wise, then this team just isn't very good

lets not do points per game. lets do even strength and pp points per 60.

if Crosby plays 20 minutes in a game, odds are its 5 mins on the pp and 15 mins at ES

if Nash plays 20 mins in a game, its the apocalypse because AV never plays anyone more than like 15 mins a game. But if he did play 20 mins in a game it would be like...12 mins at ES, 2 mins on the PP, and 6 mins on the PK.

Lets do a quick look at one of the NHLs best players shall we?

Nikia Kucherov.

He plays 20:26 per game. of which 3:51 comes on the PP, and 0:00 comes on the PK

Rick Nash plays 17:01 per game...2:06 on the PP and 1:47 on the PK.

so he's already playing 3 and a half minutes less per game than Kucherov, but then youre factoring in that he plays almost a full 2 minutes of his lesser ice time on the penalty kill, and almost a full 2 minutes of his ice time less on the PP than Kucherov and you ask yourself...is it REALLY fair to compare Kucherovs 60 points (jesus) to Nashs 17 (jesus yuck) in a straight 1:1?

No, of course not.
we're halfway through the season and Kucherov has already played 162 more minutes at even strength, 74 more minutes on the power play, and 75 fewer minutes than Nash has on the penalty kill.

It's also worth noting that Nash's most common linemates this year are Hayes and Zucc, but its spread out all over the place...none of the players he's played regular minutes with has exactly tore it up offensively. While Kucherovs most common linemates are Stamkos and Namestnikov.

So yes...Rick Nash has had an ABYSMAL season...and really he hasnt produced to the level he is expected to in a while...but if you dont think their are factors in that...like the quality of his teammates, the way he's deployed (53: oz to Kucherovs 63%), and his minutes, then you're either hating just for hatings sake, or absolutely blind to the other aspects of hockey that come into play.

I'd be really curious to see how Nash would do under a better coach who deployed him the way other stars are deployed.

Nash is clearly still getting a ton of A+ opportunities that hes not burying...so you cant say hes a worthless player...worthless players dont get those chances...his lack of finish could be a few things, like a wrist/shoulder injury...sheer luck....weak character/brain/self defeating attitude, etc.

with aaaallllll of that said...i'd still trade nash..because i dont think this team will win a cup in the next few years, and i think Nash, if other coaches/gms are really paying attention, should garner a decent return. id trade everything that isnt bolted down and start over, because i just dont think you can win a cup without someone to lead the way...the rangers are a collection of supplemental players, spearheaded by a braindead head coach.

 

[will1066]

Nash's career points/gp by month:

October - 0.81
November - 0.78
December - 0.70
January - 0.80
February - 0.81
March - 0.73
April - 0.75

Let's worry about this year.

 

[Ori]

If we can`t move him - I really doubt that we resign him since he is UFA, and we need that cap for our future prospects.

 

[offdacrossbar]

i move nash without question plus grabs and RM27 without hesitation. those 3 bring back a really decent return. i think mcdonough needs to be shipped out. theres a guy that will bring back quality.

return back picks in the top 100 draft eligible players- lots of em and a young man who can play big top 4 minutes along side 76, 22 and 42 or sadly 55. with ADA, pionk and graves i think were ok defensively but still lack a big time top 4 type kid.

i also promote ADA and let him play alot.

 

[Riche16]

So disappointing.



Not at all what we thought we traded for. I definitely thought we were getting an elite goal scorer when we made that trade. Doesn't seem to be the case.

Too bad we can't use the fact that his TOI is dramatically lower than all the names around him because that would be EXTRAPOLATING.

What's too bad is that his contract isn't longer then... so next year and the year after you could post that chart again and see how f***ing far he falls.

 

[silverfish]

What's too bad is that his contract isn't longer then... so next year and the year after you could post that chart again and see how ****ing far he falls.

He doesn't have to be a Ranger for you to do that...

I think people fundamentally don't understand the economics of player AAV. You sign Rick Nash to a 8 year, $7.8m AAV contract, you know you're not getting a $7.8m AAV player at the end of the deal. That doesn't make it a bad contract. You sign the 8 year deal instead of a 5 year deal so the AAV isn't $10m. It would be a bad deal if you didn't get a $7.8m AAV player in years 1-4 or 5, but guess what, you did, whether you like to admit it or not.

For five years of that deal, you had an objectively elite 5v5 scorer.

This isn't hard to understand.

 

[Riche16]

He doesn't have to be a Ranger for you to do that...

We should revisit then.

Do you think he holds his ground at all?

 

[silverfish]

We should revisit then.

Do you think he holds his ground at all?

Of course not, he's 33. I don't care if he holds his ground, I care if he earned his contract and was a good Ranger.

I think he was, and I think the evidence is on my side.

We're all biased though, I guess.

 

[Riche16]

Of course not, he's 33. I don't care if he holds his ground, I care if he earned his contract and was a good Ranger.

I think he was, and I think the evidence is on my side.

We're all biased though, I guess.

So you agree he will CONTINUE to decline the way he has been.