Player Discussion Philip Broberg - Berries are brewing

[GOilers88]

Nothing about the Edmonton Oilers screams championship team so if it takes Broberg plus to even get one more competitive player into the system that can actually play two-way hockey against the elite teams then he should be traded.

Everyone not named McDavid or Draisaitl should be on the table. Trade Broberg but Bouchard is our big trading chip that could actually help correct the team roster in a meaningful way. But that's only part of it. We need a new system. We should be emulating Vegas. I don't care if you hate them. That team gets it.

Even if it isn't Steve Staios we need management reaching out and we need better pro scouting. We need better amature scouting so Bettman's teams stop getting all the good players year after decade. When do we get to draft good NHL players outside of our lottery picks? And even those lotto picks are 50/50.

Most of all we need a team identity and that starts with a new coach.

Trade McLeod. That kid is giving me nightmares. He represents the ineffectiveness of the Edmonton Oilers. Him, Ceci, Yamamoto and Broberg. The list goes on.

Who are you trading Bouchard for?

Edit: caught up and see you'd trade him for some mid first round picks.

Even if I don't believe any team is giving up multiple firsts for Bouchard, let's say they do. Who are you then targeting with those picks to replace Bouchard? To get the kind of defenseman you're thinking cap will need to go out, so at least one or two of those picks are out the door to compensate for cap dumps. So who are we replacing Bouchard with, with a mid to late first rounder and like, Lavoie or XB?

 

[Broberg Speed]

Who are you trading Bouchard for?

Edit: caught up and see you'd trade him for some mid first round picks.

Even if I don't believe any team is giving up multiple firsts for Bouchard, let's say they do. Who are you then targeting with those picks to replace Bouchard? To get the kind of defenseman you're thinking cap will need to go out, so at least one or two of those picks are out the door to compensate for cap dumps. So who are we replacing Bouchard with, with a mid to late first rounder and like, Lavoie or XB?

Let's get this straight once and for all; "the equivalence in value of three mid-first round draft picks." It could come in multiple variations. That's my template for the value that must be received for Bouchard. Any deal in itself involving Bouchard could have multiple moving parts.

The players we could parlay with those picks, or any of the multiple variations received in a transaction, along with other club owned assets that could be used as barter makes my mouth water.

I'd be aiming for some of my favorite players in the league and I'd have to think long and hard about... value, age, viability of winning in the playoffs, excetera.

I'd move out either Lavoie or Bourgeois as a sweetener in a heartbeat.

Even if Bouchard signs a club friendly and cap justifiable contract with the Oilers, which should make everyone including myself satisfied, I likely still move Lavoie and Bourgeois to improve the club.

If one or both are sacrificed to correct Holland's mistakes or find some cap relief to bring in actual championship caliber players, so be it.

 

[GOilers88]

Let's get this straight once and for all; "the equivalence in value of three mid-first round draft picks." It could come in multiple variations. That's my template for the value that must be received for Bouchard. Any deal in itself involving Bouchard could have multiple moving parts.

The players we could parlay with those picks, or any of the multiple variations received in a transaction, along with other club owned assets that could be used as barter makes my mouth water.

I'd be aiming for some of my favorite players in the league and I'd have to think long and hard about... value, age, viability of winning in the playoffs, excetera.

I'd move out either Lavoie or Bourgeois as a sweetener in a heartbeat.

Even if Bouchard signs a club friendly and cap justifiable contract with the Oilers, which should make everyone including myself satisfied, I likely still move Lavoie and Bourgeois to improve the club.

If one or both are sacrificed to correct Holland's mistakes or find some cap relief to bring in actual championship caliber players, so be it.

Do you really think teams would value Bouchard at the equivalent of 3 mid first round picks?

Do you have an example in mind that you would share? I'm simply struggling to come up with an example here.

 

[Broberg Speed]

Do you really think teams would value Bouchard at the equivalent of 3 mid first round picks?

Do you have an example in mind that you would share? I'm simply struggling to come up with an example here.

That's the value I place on Bouchard. At the deadline it was two mid-first round draft picks.

Bouchard's playoffs increased his value by 33.3%. But the Oilers are out of the Stanley Cup race early.

With some wheeling and dealing before the deadline the club we entered into the playoffs could have looked considerably different.

I have two or three scenarios running, one I have stated in this thread. I like Ivan Provorov and I like cap space.

Presently Bouchard could possibly get you both when dealing with Philadelphia as Provorov only has two years remaining on his contract. We could send a cap dump out along with Bouchard and possibly expect Philadelphia to retain, if only a little, on Provorov.

At the deadline Provorov would have cost more as it would have been two full seasons and the remainder of the post deadline season and the playoffs remaining on his contract. Now Provorov is worth less in value as we'd retain his rights for a shorter term and Bouchard is worth more because of the points he produced in the playoffs.

Only problem is Provorov plays LD. I would like to see LD Ekholm playing his off side on the first pairing with Nurse. Too many LD. A major shake up of the defence isn't out of the question to strengthen the RD.

But with Nurse, Ekholm and Provorov we'd be one intimidating team to face in the playoffs. I believe we would have finished off L.A. in quick fashion then pulverized Vegas. Moved on to face Dallas and likely be in the finals.

I'll post my trade ideas in the "Rumors & Proposals Thread" for criticism when I am able.

 

[McDoused]

Ekholm, Nurse and Kulak are signed for the next 3ish years at least. I would absolutely trade Broberg to a team that could retain cap on an upgrade for Ceci that can afford to wait on Broberg's development.

I agree with this but I dont think Broberg is that far off in his development. With the cap in place we need to save money where we can so if you trade a cost controlled defenceman you better be getting something really good back.

 

[SwedishFire]

Ekholm, Nurse and Kulak are signed for the next 3ish years at least. I would absolutely trade Broberg to a team that could retain cap on an upgrade for Ceci that can afford to wait on Broberg's development.

Thats a perfekt L side. Ekholm is the No1 leader, Nurse is a good #2 D att 2nd pair, taking liads if min. And kulak is a smart D, who leads a 3rd pair.
Broberg isnt perfekt for a 2nd pairing.
Cecilia si good in a vakuum, but not beside Nurse.
If VD could play with Nurse, Kulak Ceci would rock as a 3rd pairing.
Until Niemilainen becomes anknytning worthy.

 

[GOilers88]

What did we think tonight, all things aside?

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

What did we think tonight, all things aside?

A big fat pile of nothing. Like most Oiler picks.

 

[TopShelfGloveSide]

What did we think tonight, all things aside?

I didn’t mind his game.

 

[Trafalgar Sadge Law]

He's been fine both games so far. Not exactly Miro Heiskanen out there but he's been a net positive on the season which is more than what can be said about some of the other players.

 

[MessierII]

I thought he sucked especially on the PK. He just doesn’t do anything well.

 

[OiledUp]

What did we think tonight, all things aside?

Probably should've been tighter on Kuzmenko on the Nucks PP goal but made a lot of good small defensive plays to regain possession and get the puck moving in the right direction, had the occasional offensive play, was open for a clean shot a couple of times in the offensive zone but Kulak had the blinders on. Over two games he's probably been the team's most solid D-man despite not being more than average/slightly above average really.

Was definitely not the main issue on his pairing.

 

[TheNumber4]

Was a culprit on a goal last game with his lack of awareness in terms of net front coverage, double downed and did it again this game.

Aside from that, he's been mostly low key, which is a good thing for him as a defenceman defenceman. Doesn't do much offensively though.

 

[Anarchism]

Was a culprit on a goal last game with his lack of awareness in terms of net front coverage, double downed and did it again this game.

Aside from that, he's been mostly low key, which is a good thing for him as a defenceman defenceman. Doesn't do much offensively though.

Making short little safety passes. Doesn't do much of anything. Not overly good defensively. Can't make a transition pass to save his life. They are dialing back his TOI.

 

[Mr Positive]

Making short little safety passes. Doesn't do much of anything. Not overly good defensively. Can't make a transition pass to save his life. They are dialing back his TOI.

This was mostly expected and as of now its not like the rest of the D is going great and he's dragging them down. He'll move and down the depth chart, or rather he will get shifts with lots of partners and we'll see how it plays out. With a young player you can expect his worse games to be earlier. We need to see if he takes a step forward.

I do see him used quite a bit on the right side. That is a challenge for him. But, it's also comparable to Ekholm's time in Nashville. I'd still guess the team sees Broberg as turning into a player similar to Ekholm

 

[Anarchism]

This was mostly expected and as of now its not like the rest of the D is going great and he's dragging them down. He'll move and down the depth chart, or rather he will get shifts with lots of partners and we'll see how it plays out. With a young player you can expect his worse games to be earlier. We need to see if he takes a step forward.

I do see him used quite a bit on the right side. That is a challenge for him. But, it's also comparable to Ekholm's time in Nashville. I'd still guess the team sees Broberg as turning into a player similar to Ekholm

I'm just not seeing the elite skill anywhere. Not only seems hesitant but while i have seem him join the rush once he didn't do much with it.
What skills are you seeing that give you hope? Maybe your seeing more than is there?
We need this argument to be right.

 

[Heavy Dee]

Time to trade this player while he might still have value.

 

[bucks_oil]

I'm just not seeing the elite skill anywhere. Not only seems hesitant but while i have seem him join the rush once he didn't do much with it.
What skills are you seeing that give you hope? Maybe your seeing more than is there?
We need this argument to be right.

I think the skating is there but you aren't seeing it on offense or defense, because:
1) On offense he is being very, very, very cautious and not carrying the puck longer than required to make a short 15 foot pass to an open vet.
2) On defense he's playing cautiously enough that he hasn't had to turn on the jets to track anyone down. He's been back, generally in position and coasting.

Isn't that exactly what you want the guy to start his season like? Wouldn't we like to see more of that from some of our riverboat gamblers (like Nurse)?

 

[Mr Positive]

I'm just not seeing the elite skill anywhere. Not only seems hesitant but while i have seem him join the rush once he didn't do much with it.
What skills are you seeing that give you hope? Maybe your seeing more than is there?
We need this argument to be right.

Broberg is a transition D and so we shouldn't expect him to show specialized skills like a great shot or physical edge. Like Klefbom, if he develops right he would just be a smart Dman who is in the right spots and makes simple passes.

I see his slowness as hesitancy. He is thinking through plays too long. Imo that problem will go away over time. The fact that he is thinking a lot might pay off as he learns more about the NHL game.

I'm not a Broberg fan boy or anything. He is reminding me a bit of Griffin Reinhart in that hesitancy. But, that doesn't mean Broberg ends the same way.

I think the skating is there but you aren't seeing it on offense or defense, because:
1) On offense he is being very, very, very cautious and not carrying the puck longer than required to make a short 15 foot pass to an open vet.
2) On defense he's playing cautiously enough that he hasn't had to turn on the jets to track anyone down. He's been back, generally in position and coasting.

Isn't that exactly what you want the guy to start his season like? Wouldn't we like to see more of that from some of our riverboat gamblers (like Nurse)?

That's a great breakdown actually, and it does point to Broberg being a good complement to the D. Some caution to balance out the gamblers

 

[GOilers88]

I think the skating is there but you aren't seeing it on offense or defense, because:
1) On offense he is being very, very, very cautious and not carrying the puck longer than required to make a short 15 foot pass to an open vet.
2) On defense he's playing cautiously enough that he hasn't had to turn on the jets to track anyone down. He's been back, generally in position and coasting.

Isn't that exactly what you want the guy to start his season like? Wouldn't we like to see more of that from some of our riverboat gamblers (like Nurse)?

While I admit you obviously expect someone drafted there to be a big impact guy, if he can simply become a steady, safe, keep it simple kind of option for even the bottom pair this year and beyond, that's big for the team.

Ceci, while being played over his head, was that guy his first year here, and it was big. Team obviously could do with a proven commodity for the second pair, and I think and hope they have a plan to address it at the deadline this year.

I honestly think Ekholm-Bouchard, based on how well the meshed last year, would be the most ideal and readily available first pairing option. Unfortunately having a 9 million dollar second pairing defenseman in Nurse is not ideal, I think Nurse-Ceci on the second pair fits better for both. With Kulak and Broberg on the bottom pair, I think it gives Bro a steady partner he can rely on to allow him to open his game up as things progress. I don't find the lack of a third right shot guy on the bottom to be a really a big deal.

 

[Anarchism]

While I admit you obviously expect someone drafted there to be a big impact guy, if he can simply become a steady, safe, keep it simple kind of option for even the bottom pair this year and beyond, that's big for the team.

Ceci, while being played over his head, was that guy his first year here, and it was big. Team obviously could do with a proven commodity for the second pair, and I think and hope they have a plan to address it at the deadline this year.

I honestly think Ekholm-Bouchard, based on how well the meshed last year, would be the most ideal and readily available first pairing option. Unfortunately having a 9 million dollar second pairing defenseman in Nurse is not ideal, I think Nurse-Ceci on the second pair fits better for both. With Kulak and Broberg on the bottom pair, I think it gives Bro a steady partner he can rely on to allow him to open his game up as things progress. I don't find the lack of a third right shot guy on the bottom to be a really a big deal.

So what your saying is you hope someday is that Broberg becomes what Kovy is now. And Kovy can play in the top 4 like he is now and has size and intimidation that he is increasingly using.
Hmmmmm.....
Even i see Broberg getting better with passing and transition and finding his times to pinch. However some of that hesitancy is lack of vision. Learning this by rote takes a long time.

Lets compare this 2019 7th overall to a 2020 85th overall Brock Faber this year.

 

[Anarchism]

Time to trade this player while he might still have value.

Its way too late!
Any value he might have had was pissed away his first game of camp.

 

[Stealth1616]

I don’t think this guy has shown any ounce of improvement in the last 3 years

 

[Tobias Kahun]

Making short little safety passes. Doesn't do much of anything. Not overly good defensively. Can't make a transition pass to save his life. They are dialing back his TOI.

You're aware that he got 16 minutes in game 1 cause it was 8-1 right?

For someone who played hockey, you'd realize that teams dial back the top players when its a blow out.

 

[Anarchism]

You're aware that he got 16 minutes in game 1 cause it was 8-1 right?

For someone who played hockey, you'd realize that teams dial back the top players when its a blow out.

13.25 GAME TWO.
Broberg is a top player in pickle ball. And you know maybe shuffleboard. Maybe he should take up cricket.
Only you could think Broberg is a top player ....i got it ...he is a 2019 7th overall.....
Compare him to a 2020 85th overall in Brock Faber.

Are you strung out?