Post-Game Talk: | Pens vs Kraken | Loss | Release the Jarry!
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ZAR gets special teams time? He's our 4th most used PKing forward on a nightly basis, and was last night as well, despite being in the box for one of two kills.
I would also add that
a) Under 10 minutes a night minus PKing is pretty usual for a 4th liner; Stepan and Martinook are there for Carolina, Raddysh and Katchouk for Tampa, etc.etc.
b) Without having read the thread, I don't think anyone here thinks a 4th line of our 12th to 14th forwards is that good? Its ceiling is a bit of decent possession hockey in the opposition zone while everyone else catches their breath and the occasional goal from Boyle to counteract the occasional goal it concedes. Not that this hugely matters if the three lines ahead of it are doing well but like everyone else, I have questions about those lines.
I think Carter's 2 way presence has been solid this year and besides, it's not like there's a defensive conscience on Malkin's line in general right now. Not up for increasing his minutes though.
ZAR has played his off-wing before, although it's moot as Heinen plays RW a lot.
Re ERod... I am curious as to how he'd go back at C. But, while I think he's better there, I don't think it's quite that simple.
ERod's best period of success came when he was generating McDavid-esque numbers of zone entries and chances from them. The rest of the league has noticed. They're not being so cavalier about giving him space and the middle of the ice. Most teams in general aren't to anyone. It's a lot easier to find those opportunities too as the second attacking line rather than a more match up line (or the first attacking line). I suspect we might find ourselves a little disappointed. ERod's possession numbers in defensive usage were more in line with Blueger than his superstar streak.
But I'd still like to see it just to be sure.
Also McCann's best spot here was as Malkin's wing and I will die on that hill. Not an everyday C at all.
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HandshakeLine
A real jerk thing
Absolute lol, I was reading the wrong player line on naturalstattrick.
I take that back. Serves me right for posting during a work meeting.I get that lots of teams run their 4th lines on a short leash, but I don't think we used to have it THAT short. My opinion is that it's not ideal bench management for an older group of players to keep that 4th line so short, so if possible, I'd rather get guys that we can run for 10-12 minutes a night there and shorten Carter, Geno, and Sid's ice time a bit when necessary. Also, again, I just don't remember seeing ZAR or the defensive lines out to protect a lead in the last minutes very much and I'm curious as to when we stopped doing that-- because that was kind of a fixture on the B2B teams.
Again, I feel like the Pens have like 90% of the parts they need to create 4 great lines and we just struggle with the inertia of our current lines.
Absolute lol, I was reading the wrong player line on naturalstattrick.
I get that lots of teams run their 4th lines on a short leash, but I don't think we used to have it THAT short. My opinion is that it's not ideal bench management for an older group of players to keep that 4th line so short, so if possible, I'd rather get guys that we can run for 10-12 minutes a night there and shorten Carter, Geno, and Sid's ice time a bit when necessary. Also, again, I just don't remember seeing ZAR or the defensive lines out to protect a lead in the last minutes very much and I'm curious as to when we stopped doing that-- because that was kind of a fixture on the B2B teams.
Again, I feel like the Pens have like 90% of the parts they need to create 4 great lines and we just struggle with the inertia of our current lines.
16-17, Kuhnhackl and Fehr played 8:40 a night each at 5v5. Boyle's at 8:30 a night now, Simon's at 9:10, and ZAR-Bloogs-McGinn are at 11:50 to 12:50 each (thanks to injury inflated usage). I think it's the exact same philosophy.
Last minute lead protection... not a lot of easy stats at that, but my gut instinct/eyetest is we've gone to using Sid and mish-mash bottom six line using two centres as our standard now, and maybe in the past used Sid a little less. Which fits with the vs empty net stats at least; Blueger and Carter lead the way, Sid's line and McGinn's line come next, then you get ZA and Boyle with equal usage. I also think most of the time we seem to find ourselves with either a 3rd line that's not super hot defensively, or a mishmash 4th line that Sully doesn't particularly love, which influences things.
Lines... I like our talent, but I don't know I like the mix. We will tear apart anyone stupid enough to give us a decent amount of rushes or who are sloppy against the forecheck, but against a snorefest team where the only goals will be sick snipes and greasy goals? And yeah, the current lines are a bit hmm.
HandshakeLine
A real jerk thing
Well, we certainly shouldn't double shift Sid like we used to.
The change looks like it was 2016-2017, because in 2015-2016, Cullen was averaging 13:53 minutes a night (Bonino was just a few shifts higher at 15 something). Fehr was around 12, and Kuhnhakl was like 12:12. (Weirdly enough Sheary was getting like 9 a night that year for half the year.) Now granted that's total TOI, but the trend's there. Incidentally, the bottom 6's ATOI remains pretty constant for the playoffs too, dropping slightly because of the lower amounts of PKing during the playoffs, but they're still averaging around 12-13 minutes a night for most of them.
So the first cup, we leaned on those two lines really hard, and then we backed off it a bit. I kind of wish we'd go back to that though, when healthy, especially with Carter as 3C.
The change looks like it was 2016-2017, because in 2015-2016, Cullen was averaging 13:53 minutes a night (Bonino was just a few shifts higher at 15 something). Fehr was around 12, and Kuhnhakl was like 12:12. (Weirdly enough Sheary was getting like 9 a night that year for half the year.) Now granted that's total TOI, but the trend's there. Incidentally, the bottom 6's ATOI remains pretty constant for the playoffs too, dropping slightly because of the lower amounts of PKing during the playoffs, but they're still averaging around 12-13 minutes a night for most of them.
So the first cup, we leaned on those two lines really hard, and then we backed off it a bit. I kind of wish we'd go back to that though, when healthy, especially with Carter as 3C.
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HandshakeLine
A real jerk thing
Well, we certainly shouldn't double shift Sid like we used to.
The change looks like it was 2016-2017, because in 2015-2016, Cullen was averaging 13:53 minutes a night (Bonino was just a few shifts higher at 15 something). Fehr was around 12, and Kuhnhakl was like 12:12. (Weirdly enough Sheary was getting like 9 a night that year for half the year.) Now granted that's total TOI, but the trend's there.
So the first cup, we leaned on those two lines really hard, and then we backed off it a bit. I kind of wish we'd go back to that though, when healthy, especially with Carter as 3C.
Big PK usage for Cullen and Fehr. Fehr was under 10 minutes a night at 5v5 (Kuhnhackl was at 11 and I suspect saw substantial third line usage).
Honestly in the last 9 games I think the general usage has been fine. Sid's played 15 at 5v5, Geno's played 13:40, Carter 13:20, and Blueger 10 - and it's probably closer if you subtract Winnipeg. I wouldn't mind seeing Blueger take an extra shift or two from Sid during the regular season but that seems a good pattern.
It gets shakier when Blueger is out but last two games, Boyle's played 9:20, Sid's played 14:30, Carter 14:50, and Geno's played 15:10... so we're not killing Sid. But we are increasing ice time for the others.
ZAR's played 8 minutes a night in them. Tbh I feel like you can sense Sully's trust in him slipping. Boyle and Simon both look better.
spcastlemagic
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Simon's taken some bad penalties and had some sloppy turnovers lately though. I'd love to see Zohorna get another shot if Simon and ZAR are slipping.
Zirakzigil
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