John Flyers Fan
Registered User
If the 2nd team was good they would very much care see .. NY Mets, NY Jets, NY Islanders, Chicago White Sox, Anaheim Angels etc.
If the 2nd team was good they would very much care see .. NY Mets, NY Jets, NY Islanders, Chicago White Sox, Anaheim Angels etc.
What? Pittsburg and KC are 13 hours apart.
841 miles
Maybe you were being sarcastic, but who knows.
Top cities: KC - arena deal, and AEG wants a hockey team in that arena.
Las Vegas - Someone's going to do it.
And the NHL connections are in place with Anschutz and AEG running things in KC.
Brooklyndevil
Registered User
Right on the money about luxury boxes. If an arena doesn't have them, it's basically useless to a professional franchise. Even if they had twenty thousand seats and were sold out.
Houston? Isn't one texas team enough? Pass
Kansas City? Already got one shot and failed. Plus, they can't really support anything but football. Pass
Portland? I see no issue, but would rather see it in a city that lost a team for no reason (WPG, HFD, QBC)
Egil
Registered User
Call them the Montreal Seperatists or the Montreal Qubecois and see what happens!
ej_pens
Registered User
Why?? There are two teams in Florida? Houston has a hockey history and an arena that would work.
Good thing the NHL did not go back to failed franchise locations such as Colorado and Minnesota.
Winnipeg and Quebec City lost their teams for a reason... they could not make a go of it economically and even in salary capped NHL that would not change.
Hartford IIRC had arena problems.
I don't know the Quebec story, but Winnipeg's situation is very similar to Pittsburgh. The "Coles Notes" version: they played in an antiquated arena from which they couldn't generate sufficient revenue, and couldn't find the $250M Cdn they need to buy the team, build the building and keep the team afloat for 2-3 years waiting for construction.
Hartford got screwed royal. IIRC, the state and city gave into Karmanos' demands for a new rink and he moved them anyway.
To stir the pot some more:
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/news_story/?ID=190690&hubname=
Mario is in discussions with KC.
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/news_story/?ID=190690&hubname=
Mario is in discussions with KC.
Jaded-Fan
Registered User
The Pens get to keep every dime a new Pittburgh arena generates, including the 318 non-hockey days a year the arena is rented out to everything from Christina Aguilara to the Circus and Ice Capades. Not so in KC or other cities.
Experts like offer to Penguins
....... (The pens offer) could be a better offer than those of so-called "free arenas" in cities such as Kansas City or Portland.
Scheduled to open in September, Kansas City's Sprint Center does not have a main tenant, and is offering a guarantee that all luxury boxes will be sold through the first season for a National Hockey League franchise.
But the operator, AEG, a subsidiary of the Anschutz Company, invested $54 million toward the cost of the $276 million Sprint Center, allowing it to determine how much money would go to a main tenant.
"Revenues are certainly key to the sports franchise," said Neil Irwin, a sports analyst at Bryan Cave in Phoenix. "If they're not able to tap into other revenue sources, the sports side of it will usually not support itself."
.......
"This is a better than average deal that the Penguins are being offered," Zimbalist said. "It's hard to imagine available cities out there that are better hockey cities than Pittsburgh. But I don't know what is the starting point for the Penguins."
The city offers the Penguins an established hockey market with a rich tradition and strong fan base. That can be a priceless commodity, especially in the National Hockey League.
"There is real concern when you have to start from zero season tickets," said Marc Ganis, president of Sportscorp Ltd. in Chicago. "Pittsburgh doesn't need to be dollar-to-dollar with the other markets."
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/penguins/s_486775.html
What is the definition of "main tenant"? And who is the "main tenant" if/when the NBA would join the NHL in KC?
AEG/Penguins hold a press conference tomm
Saw it on this message board, but people on the pittsburgh and another KC message board I go to are saying it.
Are the pens gone?
Saw it on this message board, but people on the pittsburgh and another KC message board I go to are saying it.
Are the pens gone?
skullman80
Registered User
I doubt it.
It will be interesting though. They are supposed to meet with local officials here in the city tomorrow though.
Just have to see what happens. I've said it before and I will say it again..this is gonna get worse before it gets any better.
It will be interesting though. They are supposed to meet with local officials here in the city tomorrow though.
Just have to see what happens. I've said it before and I will say it again..this is gonna get worse before it gets any better.
Bixby Snyder
IBTFAD
SomeDude
Registered User
As someone on that board said, it's probably just something to announce they're in the running. They're not going to sign anything before talking to the Pittsburgh city officials.
Jaded-Fan
Registered User
Impossible. The league has to agree to a move, and would expect that Pittsburgh would be given the opportunity to make plan B workable. Did the board of Governors meet to approve any move? I thought not. Likely just a pressure move before the Pittsburgh meeting scheduled for tomorrow to say that they had a nice prodictive meeting and got along.
Remember that every baseball team looking to get a sweet stadium deal from their hometown in the 80's and 90's went and kissed and shared a beer with Tampa Bay. But in the end that was what they all were doing using TB to get a sweet deal. No different here that I can see. The Pens and Pittsburgh are not that far apart. $4 mil per year and the Pens picking up less than 20% is the starting offer. Experts even say with the Pens being offered all non-hockey revenues and KC not offering that the current nsweetened Pittsburgh offer is better than KC's ( http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/penguins/s_486775.html ). I have done enough deals to know that when sides are this close deals get done. Factor in the league preference in preserving the Pittsburgh market (has everyone forgotten that Basille dropped out TWICE because he was told that the Pens would not be moved) and Mario making Pittsburgh home and likely not wanting to go and with a little movement on both sides a deal very very likely gets done. Sorry KC, but at least in this case, and many others to come most likely, you will be used but in the end come up short.
Ted Hoffman
Done
- Dec 15, 2002
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I'm willing to give this a little time to show up on an established media source instead of another message board; I'm not familiar with the site linked and I'm hesitant to rely on reports from another message board alone.
That said, I thought it was at least reported that Lemieux had met with some of the Kansas City group today; a press conference following up on that wouldn't be a huge surprise.
That said, I thought it was at least reported that Lemieux had met with some of the Kansas City group today; a press conference following up on that wouldn't be a huge surprise.
HandshakeLine
A real jerk thing
Right. If it was a move, you can be damn sure KC would be all over the place with the story. It'd be huge.
It's probably nothing more than a mention of continuing discussions with Lemieux Group.
Jaded-Fan
Registered User
Another good point. In KC, Portland, etc, the Pens would only be the main tenant until another was added. But even if none ever is being a 'main tenant' in KC is a pretty hollow title. It comes with no benefits. What they are talking about in the article is Pittsburgh offering all non-hockey revenues to the Pens. Concerts, Circuses, Ice Capades, whatever comes there and whoever they can rent to. KC is run by the same people who own the Kings, and they have invested something over 20% into the cost of building the KC Sprint center. As part of the deal they get all of the non-hockey revenues. So even with the Pens paying, the experts quoted say that the Pittsburgh deal is a better one. Add in the difference in markets and the Pittsburgh deal is world's better. The Pens could pull in $20 mil. more per year than they currently do with the Pittsburgh deal as it is currently written. But Pittsburgh has already said that they will sweeten the deal, with figures more than halving the $4 mil. per year in the current offer being mentioned ($1.6 mil. per year).
Talk of a new arena is one thing, actually digging the hole and have financing in place is a whole different story.
Jaded-Fan
Registered User
Sounds like Anschutz, and Anschutz alone, is calling the news conference. Pretty ho hum stuff:
Michael Roth, a spokesman for Los Angeles-based Anschutz Entertainment Group, which will operate the new Sprint Center, issued a statement Wednesday confirming that meetings were scheduled with the ownership group of the Pittsburgh Penguins and his organization.
Company officials declined to comment further, but a news conference was planned for Thursday in Kansas City.
http://www.kansas.com/mld/kansas/16376636.htm
Mario and Co. will be in Pittsburgh discussing an 'improved Plan B':
Lemieux and Burkle were scheduled to meet late Thursday with Pennsylvania Gov. Ed Rendell, Allegheny County Chief Executive Dan Onorato and Pittsburgh Mayor Luke Ravenstahl.
The sides will likely discuss an improved Plan B agreement, which involves Detroit-based gambling company owner Dan Barden.
(same article)
Michael Roth, a spokesman for Los Angeles-based Anschutz Entertainment Group, which will operate the new Sprint Center, issued a statement Wednesday confirming that meetings were scheduled with the ownership group of the Pittsburgh Penguins and his organization.
Company officials declined to comment further, but a news conference was planned for Thursday in Kansas City.
http://www.kansas.com/mld/kansas/16376636.htm
Mario and Co. will be in Pittsburgh discussing an 'improved Plan B':
Lemieux and Burkle were scheduled to meet late Thursday with Pennsylvania Gov. Ed Rendell, Allegheny County Chief Executive Dan Onorato and Pittsburgh Mayor Luke Ravenstahl.
The sides will likely discuss an improved Plan B agreement, which involves Detroit-based gambling company owner Dan Barden.
(same article)
Malice430
Registered User
Jaded-Fan
Registered User
The KC Royals are 28/30 teams in attendence in baseball. Granted the Pirates are not a large amount better, but there is a history of a strong hockey market in Pittsburgh built over more than a hundred years. KC? the worst attendence in hockey for two years and moved. KC is a huge question mark as a hockey market or sports market and anyone who says otherwise is not telling the truth. The untested nature and previous failures are the biggest acheles heals in the KC/NHL question.
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