Speculation: O'Reilly Mega Thread - ALL ROR Speculation Here

Colt55

Registered User
Sep 28, 2017
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st. Louis
If that's you angle, then that's fine. But to imply that O'Reilly has no business being valued like Parayko is nonsense.
Lets do the comparison, but dont forget top pairing RHD are worth more than #2 c.
Parayko
age- 24
Contract-4yrs left at 5.5 mil will be 28 when contract over
Parayko is a 30-35 point big rhd defenseman. top line minutes and top line stats.

Ryan O
age- 27
contract-5 yrs 7.5 mil will be 32 when contract is over
Ryan is 50-60 point center and career +/- - player

If we are wanting to trade parayko for a center it would be for a younger center with cost control not for a 27 year old center locked up for 7.5 mil and until he is 32. ROR just isnt worth parayko.
 

KingBran

Three Eyed Raven
Apr 24, 2014
6,436
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If you took the time to watch parayko, look at his stats, look at his toi, look at his warrior stats, compair him to others around him you would get why he is coveted the way he is. Since day one no one gave this kid his due cause he was a no name drafted in the 3rd round. All of a sudden he is on everyones list. You ask for him and when we say no thanks you get bhurt and say he is overated. ok you keep your opinion and we will keep our overated defense man.

Also for the other gentleman who thinks you should trade your second best defenseman for orielly because we have petro. Have you seen Nashvilles stacked D. Thats why
"Since day 1 nobody gave him his due"

...Really? Dude he was an INSTANT fan favorite from day 1. What are you even talking about being "bhurt"? All I said was he is overrated. I even said I am a Blues fan and I like Parayko. But valuing him over someone like ROR because a hockey forum has fans from other teams that always talk about trading for Parayko is just silly.

Nashville also has Rinne who will most likely win the Vezina. Horrible comparison.


Holy overreaction Batman. :laugh:
 

TheGoldenGod

5 Star Man
Nov 8, 2017
3,867
6,689
The entire team looked bad in the end half and down the stretch. There's no denying Parayko looked bad, but so did Petro, he was absolutely brutal at times. They are still top pairing dman. I do not agree that a good top 4 dman is easier to acquire then a top 6 center. Both Duchene and Turris was acquired with future packages. There just aren't any realistically available top 6 centers available that I would move our 2nd best dman for. RoR definitely isn't on that list. He's a more expensive stastny.

If the only way the Blues can get another top 6 center is by trading Parayko, then I'd rather they just rely on Thomas or FA. Creating holes to try and plug later just isn't a viable solution.

Then I’m done. I respect your opinion and its more than fair but we obviously don’t agree. Petro is on a different level than Parayko and played outstanding hockey down the stretch when it counted most. We had no scoring and bad goaltending. I guess I just believe Petro Eddy and Dunn have the stuff to make this a prominent Dcorps with capable veterans surrounding them.

No blues fan is willing to move the prospects with value. No fan is willing to trade Parayko. Again I have never said anything about Parayko straight up for a 2c or ROR. All I said is that he shouldn’t be considered untouchable. He has not earned that right. I will agree it is possible to find a stop gap at 2c until Thomas proves he’s ready for that role but I still think Paraykos physical tools and potential could land something special with his current perception league wide. That will not be the case if he has a repeat of last season though.

A move is coming if we miss out on JT regardless. Armstrong just talked with Bernie M on 101 saying a top 6 center will be pursued this summer either through FA or trades because right now we only have Schenn. After JT pickings are slim to none in FA.
 
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Sabresruletheschool

Registered User
Jul 16, 2012
4,642
867
Lets do the comparison, but dont forget top pairing RHD are worth more than #2 c.
Parayko
age- 24
Contract-4yrs left at 5.5 mil will be 28 when contract over
Parayko is a 30-35 point big rhd defenseman. top line minutes and top line stats.

Ryan O
age- 27
contract-5 yrs 7.5 mil will be 32 when contract is over
Ryan is 50-60 point center and career +/- - player

If we are wanting to trade parayko for a center it would be for a younger center with cost control not for a 27 year old center locked up for 7.5 mil and until he is 32. ROR just isnt worth parayko.

So Parayko is a top pairing guy, but O'Reilly's a 2C. That's the problem right there. Take off those glasses.
 

Bluesnatic27

Registered User
Aug 5, 2011
4,718
3,223
No, I gave an opinion. YOU are the one saying "but everyone on a hockey forum requests him in the trade talk section!" as your justification of real value of a player.

I never mocked you or said I was smarter than anyone.

Holy cow you are getting way to sensitive about this. Take a deep breath dude. All I said was it's silly to me to judge the value of a player based on the trade talk on a hockey forum on the internet.

I think Parayko is overrated and the Blues / Army would be idiots if they said no to trading Parayko for ROR. If that upsets you to the point where you have to lie and say I am mocking you and saying I am smarter than everyone else then maybe you need to take a break.
See, here in lies why this concept makes no sense when discussing a trade topic on a forum.

If all that matters is what the GMs of the league think of a trade idea, then there is no point in giving an opinion on the idea. It doesn’t matter if you find Parayko overrated because it’s irrelevant to how Armstrong views such a trade. It’s also irrelevant to what I think the trade is like because, again, it only matters what the GMs think. How else is anyone supposed to have a discussion of player values when we aren’t GMs? Using perceived player values based upon trade posts is not some silly way to judge value because there are enough knowledgeable fans giving insights into players. The aggregation of all these insights can provide anyone a good idea of a player’s value both on his respective team and around the league. That doesn’t mean that we, as fans, know how GMs value them, but in truth we never will.

As for Parayko being overrated, I suggest looking at his metrics, because he is usually within the top 40 - 30 in any respective metric you could use. He’s a real top notch defenseman that is proving to be a top pairing player. Is he better than Pietrangelo? No, but that’s not as much an indictment of Parayko as much as a testament to Pietrangelo.
 
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dasaybz

da saybz
Aug 2, 2005
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IF Buffalo gets the #1 pick ( ha ha), would the Blues be interested in a trade with Reinhart and Schwartz being the two primary pieces? Imo, Reinharts talent is being wasted playing wing, and with Dahlin added to the D, Buffalo could use a speedy winger more then a center playing wing. What would it take?
What are you talking about? He's clearly a winger now. Why would you trade a winger for a winger?
 

KingBran

Three Eyed Raven
Apr 24, 2014
6,436
2,284
See, here in lies why this concept makes no sense when discussing a trade topic on a forum.

If all that matters is what the GMs of the league think of a trade idea, then there is no point in giving an opinion on the idea. It doesn’t matter if you find Parayko overrated because it’s irrelevant to how Armstrong views such a trade. It’s also irrelevant to what I think the trade is like because, again, it only matters what the GMs think. How else is anyone supposed to have a discussion of player values when we aren’t GMs? Using perceived player values based upon trade posts is not some silly way to judge value because there are enough knowledgeable fans giving insights into players. The aggregation of all these insights can provide anyone a good idea of a player’s value both on his respective team and around the league. That doesn’t mean that we, as fans, know how GMs value them, but in truth we never will.

As for Parayko being overrated, I suggest looking at his metrics, because he is usually within the top 40 - 30 in any respective metric you could use. He’s a real top notch defenseman that is proving to be a top pairing player. Is he better than Pietrangelo? No, but that’s not as much an indictment of Parayko as much as a testament to Pietrangelo.
And here is the problem with not reading... I never said Parayko was bad or not a good player. People assume too much when they don't read.
 

Bluesnatic27

Registered User
Aug 5, 2011
4,718
3,223
And here is the problem with not reading... I never said Parayko was bad or not a good player. People assume too much when they don't read.
You said that you thought he is overrated, I pointed out that he's a top pairing defenseman based on plenty of metrics that are incredibly easy to find. I don't see where I thought you said he was a bad player.

Talk about not reading.
 

Shwabeal

Registered User
Feb 24, 2016
791
416
These teams just aren't good trading partners. Buffalo has a surplus of top 6 centers (assuming Buffalo is going to bring Mittlestadt in as 2nd line center immediately) and needs top 4 defenseman. The Blues need a top 6 center but don't have any top 4 D that can realistically be on the table without another top 4 D coming back. When Blues fans say Parayko is untouchable, what they are really saying is Parayko can't be moved without a replacement (don't read that as an equivalent player, just someone else that can eat 19-21 minutes a night and take some tough minutes away from Pietro). If Buffalo had a top 4 RHD that they would part with to upgrade said player, we might have something here. It'd be something like O'Reilly + "top 4 RHD" for Parayko + whatever add would fit one of Buffalo's other needs that bridges the value gap.

As currently constructed, these rosters don't matchup as trading partners in the slightest.
 

KingBran

Three Eyed Raven
Apr 24, 2014
6,436
2,284
You said that you thought he is overrated, I pointed out that he's a top pairing defenseman based on plenty of metrics that are incredibly easy to find. I don't see where I thought you said he was a bad player.

Talk about not reading.
Yes. When someone thinks he is more valuable compared to someone like ROR I personally think he is being overrated. He wasn't that great overall this past season (in m opinion) and was downright awful the last month of the season. Some people go off of advance stats and charts, some people go off of what people on a hockey forum say. I go off of what I see and to me, its silly to think Parayko has more value than ROR.
 

TheGoldenGod

5 Star Man
Nov 8, 2017
3,867
6,689
These teams just aren't good trading partners. Buffalo has a surplus of top 6 centers (assuming Buffalo is going to bring Mittlestadt in as 2nd line center immediately) and needs top 4 defenseman. The Blues need a top 6 center but don't have any top 4 D that can realistically be on the table without another top 4 D coming back. When Blues fans say Parayko is untouchable, what they are really saying is Parayko can't be moved without a replacement (don't read that as an equivalent player, just someone else that can eat 19-21 minutes a night and take some tough minutes away from Pietro). If Buffalo had a top 4 RHD that they would part with to upgrade said player, we might have something here. It'd be something like O'Reilly + "top 4 RHD" for Parayko + whatever add would fit one of Buffalo's other needs that bridges the value gap.

As currently constructed, these rosters don't matchup as trading partners in the slightest.
I know this is unpopular even including myself but Bouw is somebody that the front office/coaching staff has always been more than comfortable giving big minutes too...Has that changed since the injury, maybe, but a that's pretty much been Bouw's calling card in the past. For the record I'm not saying he's a better player than Parayko and it would be an obvious downgrade but Bouw has been a big minute Dman through most of his career. Gunnarson looked more that solid last year when healthy and Bortz looked great rounding out the year. Is Schmaltz ready to take the next step...I personally think so but again, definitely a downgrade to Parayko
 

Colt55

Registered User
Sep 28, 2017
6,786
1,437
st. Louis
"Since day 1 nobody gave him his due"

...Really? Dude he was an INSTANT fan favorite from day 1. What are you even talking about being "bhurt"? All I said was he is overrated. I even said I am a Blues fan and I like Parayko. But valuing him over someone like ROR because a hockey forum has fans from other teams that always talk about trading for Parayko is just silly.

Nashville also has Rinne who will most likely win the Vezina. Horrible comparison.


Holy overreaction Batman. :laugh:

No it is not an overreaction. Its the truth, I didnt say you were bhurt, but plenty of fan bases, namley EDM, Tor, Have wanted parayko after his break out year. His stats alone, plus age, Cost controlled contract position make him better than a 50-60 pt center. Its funny how you missed the point completely. But let leave it like this. I apologize if i offended you not my intention.
We the blues fans do not want to trade you Parayko for ROR.
 

TheGoldenGod

5 Star Man
Nov 8, 2017
3,867
6,689
I know were getting way off the rails of this thread (probably my fault) but I can live with this d core if and only if we get a significant return on Parayko

Gunnarson Pietrangelo
Dunn Edmundson
Bouw Bortuzzo
Schmaltz (resign cheap)
 

Colt55

Registered User
Sep 28, 2017
6,786
1,437
st. Louis
So Parayko is a top pairing guy, but O'Reilly's a 2C. That's the problem right there. Take off those glasses.

Parayko puts up top pairing numbers, Points, TOI.

ROR puts up 2c numbers, 2c stats, 1c toi.

Not homer glasses reality. He is another paul statsny. Not worth Parayko and i feel most people agree with this that are not saber fans
 

bleedblue1223

Registered User
Jan 21, 2011
52,085
15,130
No it is not an overreaction. Its the truth, I didnt say you were bhurt, but plenty of fan bases, namley EDM, Tor, Have wanted parayko after his break out year. His stats alone, plus age, Cost controlled contract position make him better than a 50-60 pt center. Its funny how you missed the point completely. But let leave it like this. I apologize if i offended you not my intention.
We the blues fans do not want to trade you Parayko for ROR.

Over the past 5 seasons, he's averaged 63 points per 82 games along with elite defense. He's more than just a 50-60 point center.
 

Sabresruletheschool

Registered User
Jul 16, 2012
4,642
867
What are you talking about? He's clearly a winger now. Why would you trade a winger for a winger?

He's a center playing winger on a team with 2 top centers and no top 6 wingers. His game and style would be much better suited for playing a defensive style center role that can chip in 20-30 goals a year. Buffalo needs a speedy winger with a good shot.
 

Sabresruletheschool

Registered User
Jul 16, 2012
4,642
867
Parayko puts up top pairing numbers, Points, TOI.

ROR puts up 2c numbers, 2c stats, 1c toi.

Not homer glasses reality. He is another paul statsny. Not worth Parayko and i feel most people agree with this that are not saber fans

He does not. He puts up comparable numbers to Toews and Bergeron except on a much crappier team.
 

Dbrownss

Registered User
Jan 5, 2014
31,359
8,734
Then I’m done. I respect your opinion and its more than fair but we obviously don’t agree. Petro is on a different level than Parayko and played outstanding hockey down the stretch when it counted most. We had no scoring and bad goaltending. I guess I just believe Petro Eddy and Dunn have the stuff to make this a prominent Dcorps with capable veterans surrounding them.

No blues fan is willing to move the prospects with value. No fan is willing to trade Parayko. Again I have never said anything about Parayko straight up for a 2c or ROR. All I said is that he shouldn’t be considered untouchable. He has not earned that right. I will agree it is possible to find a stop gap at 2c until Thomas proves he’s ready for that role but I still think Paraykos physical tools and potential could land something special with his current perception league wide. That will not be the case if he has a repeat of last season though.

A move is coming if we miss out on JT regardless. Armstrong just talked with Bernie M on 101 saying a top 6 center will be pursued this summer either through FA or trades because right now we only have Schenn. After JT pickings are slim to none in FA.
I wasnt trying to push that narrative. I dont think that player will be made available to get Parayko was my point. It seems we do agree that it's not ROR.
 

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