Confirmed Trade: [NYR/OTT] Mika Zibanejad & 2018 2nd round pick for Derick Brassard & 2018 7th rounder

[MarkStone]

Sure. But then you either get a guy back that is just as inconsistent, or has a lower skill level. Because I really don't see a great argument as to why Zibanejad's point totals are inflated relative to his skills compared to Brassard.


They don't tell everything, but they sure as hell say more than large parts of one fanbase ragging on a guy they just traded as wildly inconsistent. It's not as if there's a great deal of balanced scouting reports on the two presented.

http://www.ottawasun.com/2013/09/30/ottawa-senators-send-mika-zibanejad-to-ahl-binghamton

The complaints about Zibanejad have been going on for a number of seasons now. I will give him credit for making strides as a player (the point total per season increase does reflect that to an extent) but the same themes of not having an off-season commitment to fitness and generally being too inconsistent and timid as a big-man never went away.

 

[BondraTime]

Brassard fits with the Sens so much better than Zib. We gain a much needed left handed center, as well as our only playmaking pivot (Stone was our only playmaker in the top 6, Turris/Hoffman/Ryan/Zib/Mac are all shoot first guys).

You guys will love Zib, but he will also frustrate you to no end. He is a downgrade, but he fits your teams outlook, and will hopefully improve for another season or two.

Do you guys have a playmaking winger? I think Zucc will mesh well with him, similar to Bobby and Brassard.

 

[Scrub*]

I recall many times Ottawa fans saying Zibby had tremendous trade value. In comparison to Kadri, they claimed he was the much better player and his value var exceeded him.

In contrast, there is no way I would trade Kadri + 2nd, for Brassard.

Rangers win this won easily in my books. Less cap hit, younger, and the better pick.

yet kadri has one 50 point season(less than brassard or zibby) and you would rather have him than players that score equal to him or better.

 

[WesMcCauley]

Brassard fits with the Sens so much better than Zib. We gain a much needed left handed center, as well as our only playmaking pivot (Stone was our only playmaker in the top 6, Turris/Hoffman/Ryan/Zib/Mac are all shoot first guys).

You guys will love Zib, but he will also frustrate you to no end. He is a downgrade, but he fits your teams outlook, and will hopefully improve for another season or two.

Do you guys have a playmaking winger? I think Zucc will mesh well with him, similar to Bobby and Brassard.

It goes both ways, NYR gain a much needed RH top 6 forward. NYR needs a shoot first guy which they get in Zib. Zib is 6 years younger and NYR gets a 2nd rounder aswell. Not much between them in terms of points. I love Brass but this was a damn good trade for us!

 

[Vipers31]

The problem with Zibanejad is work ethic, effort level, and an unwillingness to play even remotely physical or tough. Too many times last year games he'd finish with 1 assist and he'd be less noticeable than the backup goalie. For a forward that's supposed to be a power forward, that's not a compliment. You'll see what we mean after about a month.

http://www.ottawasun.com/2013/09/30/ottawa-senators-send-mika-zibanejad-to-ahl-binghamton

The complaints about Zibanejad have been going on for a number of seasons now. I will give him credit for making strides as a player (the point total per season increase does reflect that to an extent) but the same themes of not having an off-season commitment to fitness and generally being too inconsistent and timid as a big-man never went away.

It's alright to mention his problems, but this thread just measures the two guys by vastly different standards. With Zibanejad, it's all inconsistency, untapped potential, work ethic. It just seems completely over the top for a guy with a near-identical output, that can't hasn't reasonably been explained by favourable usage or linemates.

I'm not a Rangers fan, btw. I'll watch these two teams to the same degree as before.

Personally, I think it's a big chemistry move by Pierre Dorion. Ryan is going to be here forever because that contract is not moveable. Zibanejad hasn't meshed particularly well with anyone and that includes Ryan. I think Dorion wants to get the right 50 point center for our team, not just fumble around trying to make lines that never quite work.

I could see that, and it does make some sense. I know how difficult it is for Bobby to find chemistry with centers from his Anaheim days.

 

[Scrub*]

Does a left handed shot centre help Ryan more, and does a right handed shot centre help Nash more?

 

[trentmccleary]

It's alright to mention his problems, but this thread just measures the two guys by vastly different standards. With Zibanejad, it's all inconsistency, untapped potential, work ethic. It just seems completely over the top for a guy with a near-identical output, that can't hasn't reasonably been explained by favourable usage or linemates.

I could see that, and it does make some sense. I know how difficult it is for Bobby to find chemistry with centers from his Anaheim days.

There's a certain lack of intensity for long stretches and then he'll put his size/skating package together and look great. He's been a kid on a lot of pro teams for a long time, so I always wonder if he knows what it takes to lead because he hasn't had a chance to do it. IMO, he's probably an ideal candidate for a year or two of Mike Keenan (Jokinen, Pronger, Chreighton, Matteau, Roenick) or whichever coach could do that now.

 

[playasRus]

Hes also 23 and brassard is just as hit and miss. Not sure where this "Zibanjead is inconsistent, Brassard is consistent " bandwagon started but it's pretty silly. I mean hell if Brassard was "consistent" he'd have probably hit the 60 point mark more then once in his career.

It probably comes from Brassard being a lock to be a 50-60 pt center, while Zibanejad's season projection ranges from 40-70pts. Ottawa didn't want to get the 40 pt version who'd need a raise in the 5mil range anyways. Worse, a 70pt centre they can't afford to keep and have to trade for scraps.

 

[trentmccleary]

Does a left handed shot centre help Ryan more, and does a right handed shot centre help Nash more?

A left handed play making center should help Ryan, yes. Behind the net and on the rush (Brass-left, Bobby-right) are easy situations to imagine where a lefty would be better. There's also a lot of down low cycling plays where a pass from a righty to a righty would typically cross through the path of a defender.

 

[harrisb]

ZBad although has the talent cannot put it together. With a healthy Turris last year he would have ended the season on our third line and he does not have the proper skillset for the role nor should Pageau be a #2 centre at this point. The sens did find out what we had in Pageau when he was forced to play up the lineup and I believe they like what they saw more than ZBad. We also just signed Kelly for the 4th line centre / PK and have White and Brown developing as blue chippers. And to those knocking our prospect pool, we have a bunch of young players on the team already plus Chabot, the aforementioned centres, Perron, we'll be fine.

 

[MikeK]

Both good players who fill a need and agenda for their new clubs. If we are to assign a winner I have to give it to the NYR. That 2nd round pick makes this an over payment in my book. But it's not franchise crushing bad move for OTT. The Canadien still hold that title for the summer.

 

[MarcusKane*]

It probably comes from Brassard being a lock to be a 50-60 pt center, while Zibanejad's season projection ranges from 40-70pts. Ottawa didn't want to get the 40 pt version who'd need a raise in the 5mil range anyways. Worse, a 70pt centre they can't afford to keep and have to trade for scraps.

While i would refer to Brassard as a 60 point center, his 2 best seasons are 60/58 points and his next best is 47. Hardly a lock to be a 60 point player. Pretty sure they just can't afford Zibane cause the owner is a cheap/greedy fool.

 

[These Are The Days]

I don't see how this is a win for the Rangers. Zibanejad tallies up the numbers of a star player but every time I've watched him he has not impressed me at all. I don't think he's going to succeed in New York as much as Brassard will in Ottawa.

It'll be a few minutes into the 2nd period and the kid will be skating around like a dog trying to remember where he buried his bone in the back yard. I've literally wondered out loud, "What the hell is Zibanejad doing?"

 

[SpezDispenser]

While i would refer to Brassard as a 60 point center, his 2 best seasons are 60/58 points and his next best is 47. Hardly a lock to be a 60 point player. Pretty sure they just can't afford Zibane cause the owner is a cheap/greedy fool.

Had nothing to do with affording zibanejad, come on....

 

[MikeK]

I don't see how this is a win for the Rangers. Zibanejad tallies up the numbers of a star player but every time I've watched him he has not impressed me at all. I don't think he's going to succeed in New York as much as Brassard will in Ottawa.

It'll be a few minutes into the 2nd period and the kid will be skating around like a dog trying to remember where he buried his bone in the back yard. I've literally wondered out loud, "What the hell is Zibanejad doing?"

That's some really big assumptions you got going on there. We can do that with every trade. All we can do is break down how it looks on paper until we see how it plays out on the ice. On paper the NYR won this trade because they walk away with a 2nd round pick out of it from a team that likely will be middle of the pack if lucky.

 

[Sensinitis]

I think Brassard can score up to 65 points with the Sens playing on a line with one of Hoffman/MacArthur and one of Stone/Ryan and playing 1st PP. He'll be with Karlsson half his shifts as well.

 

[SenzZen]

Had nothing to do with affording zibanejad, come on....

First he blamed Murray, and now he's after Uncle Euge...

 

[Asquaredx2]

For me, the one true frustrating thing about Z is he doesn't carry the puck. If he starts to do that he could be an absolute bull. But he seems to lack the confidence several years into his career. It may seem like a weird criticism, but watch for him to constantly dump the puck or pass it off even when it's not the right play. It kills a lot of potential plays.

Just through his sheer talent and physical gifts, I think he'll always be fairly productive. But for him to truly impose himself on a game, he needs to get past that mental block. For the Sens, I suspect the hope is that Brassard will fit better into their system given he is more in the mould of Turris and Pageau. But that will be up to Boucher.

 

[darko]

I have to laugh at people trying to award a 'winner' on Day 1 of a trade. Both teamas got what they wanted. Ottawa added Phaneuf last year. They added Brassard to Turris. They have Ryan and Hoffman and they have good young players on the way. It's a good move for them.

The Rangers wanted to get younger and add a RH shot. Zib helps in that arena. Seems like a good trade for both clubs

This.

 

[BrawlFan]

This has less to do with Zibby vs Brassard talent but more on getting Ryan going I am guessing.

Zibby will be the better player, everyone knows that, but if you compare Turris vs Zibby you would see most Sens fans love Turris and are polarized on Zibby. Points wise they are close so why? It's because Zibby does many frustrating things in a game. He dumps it in when he should carry, he passes when he should shoot, he loses the puck when he could easily protect it, he flys by when he could rub a guy out, he isn't in the dirty areas when we play more gritty, ..... but he can still put up points, sure, but last year he got bypassed by a 4th round pick from his own draft year when that 4th rounder was playing with Zack Smith (career high 11 goals prior to last year) on his left wing. That's what we mean by frustrating. He doesn't play well with good players he doesn't play well with bad players. He puts up points from time to time but will always leave you wanting.

I'll compare his career high to a Kovalev-lite in terms of showing up game to game against putting up a hat trick the game he decides to show up too.

I would have preferred to keep Zibby but I'm happy with Brassard. By the time Ottawa will see the real Zibby (if it happens) they will either have seen a couple years of decent Brassard hockey and getting ready for Logan Brown/Colin White which will help; or they will be the blackhole of success they currently are and will have a high enough pick to replace DJ Zbad.

I like the gamble.

 

[BrawlFan]

It probably comes from Brassard being a lock to be a 50-60 pt center, while Zibanejad's season projection ranges from 40-70pts. Ottawa didn't want to get the 40 pt version who'd need a raise in the 5mil range anyways. Worse, a 70pt centre they can't afford to keep and have to trade for scraps.

a 70 pt player is never a bad thing. even if you trade him he's worth a ton more. Its the risk he never goes higher than 55 point player who is polarizing, what do you pay him? I honestly don't know what his salary would be this year if he was an RFA after 51 points. He isn't worth 5M this year but what would you pay him

 

[TT1]

Brassard fits with the Sens so much better than Zib. We gain a much needed left handed center, as well as our only playmaking pivot (Stone was our only playmaker in the top 6, Turris/Hoffman/Ryan/Zib/Mac are all shoot first guys).

You guys will love Zib, but he will also frustrate you to no end. He is a downgrade, but he fits your teams outlook, and will hopefully improve for another season or two.

Do you guys have a playmaking winger? I think Zucc will mesh well with him, similar to Bobby and Brassard.

Bobby doesnt mesh well with anyone, he needs to pack his bags and gtfo.

 

[JohnnyO]

Lack depth to be a contender. Could be a dark horse, could be a bubble team.

I think it's a good trade that helps the team budget wise, but also makes them a better team on the ice. Zibby wasn't fitting in, so no issues getting a pass first center who should make his linemates even more dangerous.



This gives them a solid top 6 group with 6 legitimate top 6 forwards in Ryan, Hoffman, MacA, Stone, Brassard and Turris. They also have a good but not great goalie and a solid top 4D group. Depending on how they spread out the top 6 talent and who steps up, it's quite possible that they have the talent to roll 3 offensive lines who can produce, or load up on two of them with a decent 3rd line.

That's not a contending team, but I'd be surprised if they did not make the playoffs next season. Given that they're in the Atlantic, it's possible that they could go a round or two depending on how the bounces go.

Thanks, hopefully we have some Canadian teams in the playoffs next year.

 

[BrawlFan]

Bobby doesnt mesh well with anyone, he needs to pack his bags and gtfo.

he meshed well with Turris and Mac but Stone meshes so well with Turris its hard to break them up. Now with Brassard in the mix, who meshed really well with Stone at the WC, you can stick Turris with Ryan again. If MacArthur is healthy that's a line that was strong a couple years ago.

Brassard and Stone with Hoffman would be a hell of a line too.

Two decent scoring lines, less pressure on Ryan to carry a line. I like it.

 

[Poignant Discussion*]

Thats HF's mentality, if posters here were to build a team it would look like the Edmonton Oilers. They'd be content with having good young players while missing the playoffs every year.



Brassard is solid defensively, thats what i meant by not being a 1 dimensional player.

When a fan of the team he just came from says something different, I'm going to have to side with them. Heck most of the Sen fans still think EK is good defensively