Confirmed Trade: [NYR/OTT] Mika Zibanejad & 2018 2nd round pick for Derick Brassard & 2018 7th rounder

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Korpse

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In 4 years, Ottawa will regret this dearly.

Maybe, maybe not. In 4 years I think they expect one of White/Brown to be ready for a top 6 role. Brassard is a cheap stop gap that makes them better at the moment. I believe Ottawa is planning on investing in Turris long term as their #1C. Zibanejad could succeed in New York and this trade still benefit Ottawa.
 
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MikeyMike01

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Not sure why more people cant share this opinion... Its really not hard at all to come to this conclusion. Its a lot more difficult to say that one side did better than the other, considering there are a huge amount of variables in play here.

Every single person I've spoken with in real life, true die hard hockey fans, felt like this was a great move for both teams.

Yet by reading through this thread you would believe that the Sens just got taken to the cleaner and hung out to dry. Its getting harder all the time to take this place seriously, everyone has the "AINEC" mentality, which takes away from credibility here.

Im actually convinced that most people in here saying that the rangers won believe that Zibby is already a better player than Brassard, or that its about even. I think they are going to quickly realize how horribly, horribly wrong that statement is when next season starts.

It was a very even trade for two teams that are at two very different stages of a rebuild. If people want to crap on Ottawa, so be it. Anyone with half a brain knows that they just took nice a step forward towards being playoff bound team.

This is the best post of all time AINEC
 

blueberrie

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Mar 23, 2010
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I just don't understand the Sens overall vision with this. It's a blatent win now move, for a non-playoff team. They finish 12th last and start to gear up for a cup run? I know Karlsson is in his prime, but they aren't a Brassard away from doing damage.

It's entirely possible for Zibanejad to become a Brassard level player in as little as 2 years. Let alone add a high pick.

You know its bad when Sens fans are defending it by saying that it was to make room for their 18 yo 11th overall pick.
 

Off Sides

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Sep 8, 2008
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Expectations wasn't what was frustrating about Zibanejad. We all accepted years ago, when he was drafted, that he was extremely raw and would take awhile to breakout. We compared him to Koivu in that sense. Sens fans have been pretty happy with his stats throughout his career. On paper we've been happy.

Its his conditioning, look of disinterest, inability to mesh with others and disappearance to start every season that was frustrating. He's been a low energy, low impact player overall. He puts up point but thats all he brings. Below average defensively and not the smartest decision maker with the puck. Two seasons ago he came into camp with added muscle... but was actually out of shape and lost noticeable amount of speed and acceleration. Not to say he's slow. He plays like a winger but gets worse on the wing. He also lacks vision and play making ability that 1st liners have. He's not 'dumb' but IQ is not a strength.

Luckily for the Rangers, his strengths are a perfect match for Zuccarello. Stick Zibanejad on the PP point for the entire season and let him get a ton of sheltered offensive minutes with Zuccarello, and he'll score atleast 25 goals. He's got a serious powerful shot and will go to the net. Wrist, snap and slap are all powerful but lack accuracy. Release speed could be better. Despite his annoyances, a lot of Sens fans didn't want him traded because he's got a high ceiling.

I think this is another good post, mostly because in my limiting viewing of the player that is how I saw him as well.

I really believe Ottawa is going to be happy with Brassard. All the things people are hoping Zibanejad can add, mostly be more of an impact player, Brassard found in his last two seasons. The goal total from last year represent his shooting ability more so than the under 20 per seasons he was putting up.

I may be one of the few Rangers fans who is a little dubious of this deal. The Rangers need youth and picks, so it makes sense from that perspective, I just am not sold on Zibanejad becoming a higher impact player but I also am not totally dismissing that it's possible. Miller for example this past season showed he can make more of an impact. Kreider shows it mostly in the post season. Hayes showed more of it two seasons ago and I think Zibanejad is more naturally talented than any of those players. We'll see I suppose.
 

Benjamin

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I just don't understand the Sens overall vision with this. It's a blatent win now move, for a non-playoff team. They finish 12th last and start to gear up for a cup run? I know Karlsson is in his prime, but they aren't a Brassard away from doing damage.

It's entirely possible for Zibanejad to become a Brassard level player in as little as 2 years. Let alone add a high pick.

You know its bad when Sens fans are defending it by saying that it was to make room for their 18 yo 11th overall pick.

:rolleyes:

Come on.
 

KPower

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Melnyk just desperate to make playoffs and make a few bucks.

He has no intention of building a winner.
 

projexns

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Uh, did you read what I wrote?

No, not at all - I was well aware of them, but didn't feel the need to actually post and format the numbers since I thought what I was saying was clear enough. Which it was: but for the +/- (on a non-playoff team), he was pretty much the same on the road and at home. As opposed to Brassard who was a completely different player on the road. And again, one is a KID, whereas the other is a VETERAN.

But, if you want me to, I'll go ahead and add these to my post. Happy?

Yes I did read what you wrote, I just don't think you've made much of a point. You criticized Brassard's numbers of which Zibenajad's were even worse and then afterwards provided excuses and justifications which I'm not buying.

In my mind, all goals scored on the ice count, but an awful lot of people only seem to count the goals they score but ignore the goals that are scored against them, and I'll never understand why.

Brassard was not on the ice for a lot of goals for on the road, but he was also not on the ice for a lot of goals against either. The small minus was more than made up for with his power-play production to produce a small positive of on-ice goal-differential while on the road.

Zibanejad on the other hand had a significant even-strength deficit to overcome, and he has not demonstrated an ability to be a productive player with the man-advantage to overcome that deficit.

This would be my primary concern with this player. He's going to have to supplement his ES production with some PP numbers to become the player you hope he becomes.

And if he does, great! Then you get to pay him Brassard money. However much better than Brassard he becomes, that's how much more money you'll pay him.

The Rangers might've won the "asset management" duel, but this tells me that a team that made three deep playoff runs is thinking that it's window is closing. They gave up the better player now in exchange for the 30% chance that the 2nd-round draft pick in 2018 will become a player for them by 2022 or 2023.

My preferences lean towards taking the better player unless there are extreme extenuating circumstances.

Ottawa doesn't need "asset management." They have young players coming out of their arse, and they've drafted two more blue-chip centers in the past two years in Logan Brown and Colin and White and have another 2015 1st-rounder invested in a blue-liner.

What they do need is to return to the playoffs. They made the 2nd-round as recently as 2013 but veteran leadership like Alfredsson and Spezza upfront and Gonchar and Phillips on the back-end are gone and needed to be replaced. That's what acquisitions like Phaneuf and Chris Kelly and Brassard are about.

And they were a playoff team two seasons ago. One of the reasons they came up short in 2015-16 is because Zibs didn't bring it every night and take his game to the next level.

Maybe he'll do that in New York, and maybe having a play-making winger like Zuccarello will bring it out of him. But that risk has now been shifted to New York while the Senators get the more proven track-record of Brassard (and he might even finish his career here given that he's from the area.)
 
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Korpse

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Melnyk just desperate to make playoffs and make a few bucks.

He has no intention of building a winner.

Will you ever post anything of substance. These little shots are kind of old now. Challenge yourself.
 

Korpse

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I just don't understand the Sens overall vision with this. It's a blatent win now move, for a non-playoff team. They finish 12th last and start to gear up for a cup run? I know Karlsson is in his prime, but they aren't a Brassard away from doing damage.

It's entirely possible for Zibanejad to become a Brassard level player in as little as 2 years. Let alone add a high pick.

You know its bad when Sens fans are defending it by saying that it was to make room for their 18 yo 11th overall pick.

I don't think anyone is saying the move was made to make room for Brown. Though sacrificying young talent is easier when you have a couple of good looking centre prospects coming up the pipeline. Just like Ottawa could trade Silfverberg because they had Stone coming in behind him.
 

metalan2

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May 30, 2008
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Brassard was the Rangers top center.


Still Zibanajed is way younger and has started producing at a similar rate. Rangers now building for the future with a focus on the now. Good move for them and they really need to get younger.
 

harrisb

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Oct 6, 2009
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I just don't understand the Sens overall vision with this. It's a blatent win now move, for a non-playoff team. They finish 12th last and start to gear up for a cup run? I know Karlsson is in his prime, but they aren't a Brassard away from doing damage.

It's entirely possible for Zibanejad to become a Brassard level player in as little as 2 years. Let alone add a high pick.

You know its bad when Sens fans are defending it by saying that it was to make room for their 18 yo 11th overall pick.

Is Ottawa a playoff team when you account for ALL of the additions and subtractions this year?

Out:
Cowen, Weircoch, Greening, Michalek, Philips, ZBad

In:
Phaneuf, Turris, Macarthur, Brassard, Kelly

Based on our injuries last year this is essentially what it amounts to. We finished 12th without the "In" players, you tell me how much better the incoming guys are than those that left. Hint: some of the out guys will never play in the NHL again which the others are all top 6 forwards and top 4 D (Kelly the exception but is a PK machine and he's only here to shut teams down)
 

swiftwin

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Zibanejad is younger, therefore is automatically going to improve in the future, right? That's how it works in NHL 16, so surely that's exactly how it works in real life too, right?
 
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topshelf15

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May 5, 2009
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Is Ottawa a playoff team when you account for ALL of the additions and subtractions this year?

Out:
Cowen, Weircoch, Greening, Michalek, Philips, ZBad

In:
Phaneuf, Turris, Macarthur, Brassard, Kelly

Based on our injuries last year this is essentially what it amounts to. We finished 12th without the "In" players, you tell me how much better the incoming guys are than those that left. Hint: some of the out guys will never play in the NHL again which the others are all top 6 forwards and top 4 D
Bingo ,3 of them were heralded as cant miss prospects .By our fans and most here ,yet people still view a 2nd rounder or any draft as some sort of absolute to be better.We look like a far better team than we were last season ,so we have done what we set out to do like everybody else has done in the offseason .But off course with all the hot air coming from the big blue propaganda machine we are worse :laugh:
 

Gardner McKay

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Zib is going from a better offense on a young rising team to a worse offense and a team on the decline

he will be the half 1C the Rangers have had this entire time in Stepan and Brassard - he wont be a true 1C

dont get me wrong the Rangers won the trade because they got younger and a pick. but he wont be a true 1C for them

Really? You wan't to back that up with any facts? Of course not. It is much easier to make a false blanket statement. We were actually ranked ahead of Ottawa last year on offense.

Team on the decline? We had one bad year. Our core is young. Stepan, Kreider, Miller, Hayes, Buchnevich, McDonagh... We have I think 3 guys over 30. Yes. We are SOOO old and declining.
 

playasRus

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Bingo ,3 of them were heralded as cant miss prospects .By our fans and most here ,yet people still view a 2nd rounder or any draft as some sort of absolute to be better.We look like a far better team than we were last season ,so we have done what we set out to do like everybody else has done in the offseason

To be fair, Zibanejad still projects to be at worst a 2C. I still believe he's got some untapped potential but it's just speculative, just like we think one of Brown/White might break out in the next two years.
 
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