NHL suspends season due to COVID-19 pandemic part two

[TheDebater]

Ontario just did the same, there is a link in the other OT thread.

Also:

Hong Kong appeared to have the coronavirus under control, then it let its guard down - CNN

Apparently, China is not doing so well anymore after reports came out that they had things under control and cases were down. Hong Kong is going back in to lockdown.

 

[Daffy]

Well CHL playoffs and Memorial Cup are now cancelled. Expect the NHL and NBA to follow suit within the month I would think.

 

[Xspyrit]

This is how it should have been done. Isolate those most at risk and slowly re-open things.

Which would have been a complete disaster. In comparison, what is happening now is a badminton game

It's all about controlling the curb. Once it's done, you can start to apply solutions. Of course, if more idiots stopped "partying" right away, it would go faster but hey, it's the human race we're dealing with here

 

[JD1]

Maybe some of the trillions of dollars Trump cut from the federal budget by cutting taxes for corporations and billionaires could be used for this?

One of the primary criticisms of Trump's administration is actually spending increases. He didn't cut money from the budget as a result of tax changes. He spent more. Lots more.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wa...ent-increase-during-trump-era/?outputType=amp

Trump himself is a moron in many ways but cutting spending isn't one of them. I would though say that one of the ways in which he is a moron is implementing big spending increases and tax cuts at the same time, driving their deficit way up. During a time of economic growth.

It's odd they had a democrat government focussed on budget replaced by a republican government that blew the budget situation to hell. That's the opposite situation here with Harper and Trudeau.

 

[Pierre from Orleans]

Which would have been a complete disaster. In comparison, what is happening now is a badminton game

It's all about controlling the curb. Once it's done, you can start to apply solutions. Of course, if more idiots stopped "partying" right away, it would go faster but hey, it's the human race we're dealing with here

Isn't Italy "controlling the curb" right now? Aren't their daily cases rising?

I wouldnt fully trust the numbers out of China either.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

Isn't Italy "controlling the curb" right now? Aren't their daily cases rising?

I wouldnt fully trust the numbers out of China either.

Well no, the idea of flattening the curve is to keep it within a range that their healthcare system can keep up with. Now they're having to choose which patients will get to live and die based on limited resources instituting wartime medicine. Spain is going through the same thing now, the UK and US will be there in about a week but because their response has been so poor and so slow it will last a lot longer and way more people are going to die because the numbers will explode far beyond what we've seen in Italy.

And Trump today is entertaining the idea of laxing the social distancing and getting people back out to work and to buy shit. Its going to get pretty insane down there in the next few weeks. The combination of the worst person on the planet leading the way, horrible healthcare, poor workers rights, and a scary amount of people living near the poverty line is going to contribute to some craziness. I can't even begin to imagine what will happen during a pandemic when the natural disasters start hitting them at the same time. Hurricane season is just around the bend, wild fires, and the midwest is prepping for flooding over the coming weeks.

Italy has gone 2 days now with no new cases. So things are looking up. The lockdown is proving effective.

 

[Dingle]

Well no, the idea of flattening the curve is to keep it within a range that their healthcare system can keep up with. Now they're having to choose which patients will get to live and die based on limited resources instituting wartime medicine. Spain is going through the same thing now, the UK and US will be there in about a week but because their response has been so poor and so slow it will last a lot longer and way more people are going to die because the numbers will explode far beyond what we've seen in Italy.

And Trump today is entertaining the idea of laxing the social distancing and getting people back out to work and to buy shit. Its going to get pretty insane down there in the next few weeks. The combination of the worst person on the planet leading the way, horrible healthcare, poor workers rights, and a scary amount of people living near the poverty line is going to contribute to some craziness. I can't even begin to imagine what will happen during a pandemic when the natural disasters start hitting them at the same time. Hurricane season is just around the bend, wild fires, and the midwest is prepping for flooding over the coming weeks.

there are 330 million of them. About 100 million live within 500 km of us. Say their system floods and becomes non functional..where do you think they will turn????

we better hope the Americans control this. or we will have an issue on our hands. not just our own virus battle, but a large part of theirs.

 

[Dingle]

Isn't Italy "controlling the curb" right now? Aren't their daily cases rising?

I wouldn't fully trust the numbers out of China either.

The kids next door were playing with friends about 2 hours ago..maybe we need to understand social distancing a tad better.

You don't flatten curves by doing what we are doing..if you are on a diet, you don't go to a café for a coffee and cake, right?

Until people get it, that isolation literally means isolation..then the numbers will continue to grow. I have left my home precisely 4 times the last 3 weeks...One of which was an unavoidable hospital trip, my significant other has cancer. The 3 other trips were for food. What I got will last a good 2 weeks...so it will mean 4 trips out in 5 weeks.

I have washed by hand enough times, my skin is darn near warn off. I have wiped everything down with detergent..I wear gloves when I shop. I leave my jacket in the garage, as well as my gloves.

what is it that people fail to understand? An f'ng nail salon was still open...How many women (and men) are getting hair dressers to come to the house? How many are still going to pharmacies just to load up on cosmetic products..because God knows, our roots showing is so much worse than our loved ones dying.

snow bird returning from Florida are still going shopping and going around...even though they have a directive to isolate for 14 days.. small bars/pubs are opening and then defending their actions by saying, a private party!!!!!

f'ng grocery stores are not smart enough to hand cashiers masks and gloves.. At the store, what do I see, one old coot, decided he needed to squeeze every bread bag, just to feel for freshness. So if the f***er had anything, he left it on about a dozen bread bags.

what we have is not a flat curve, but flatheads

 

[Ice-Tray]

there are 330 million of them. About 100 million live within 500 km of us. Say their system floods and becomes non functional..where do you think they will turn????

we better hope the Americans control this. or we will have an issue on our hands. not just our own virus battle, but a large part of theirs.

That’s not really realistic though. We’re not talking about charging north as individuals raiding for food.

We’re talking about sick people stumbling north to scrounge up ventilators and medical staff to help them use them for a few weeks.

No, we aren’t at risk of the great invasion, especially since the states right along the border are very similar to us.

 

[Stylizer1]

NO FREEDOMS WILL SUFFER.

No, we are not going to Hell in a Hand basket.

Read your history, after periods of hardship and stress, humanity typically resorts to democracy and greater freedoms.

While WWII was still going, the Brits voted Churchill out and voted Attlee in...The Americans re-upped Truman in 1948 and rejected men like Douglas MacArthur. And so on...

In the aftermath of this..by mid summer to years end..you will see a far greater liberal society, that is much more democratic and much more effective.

These are difficult time, needing difficult actions..yes, short term, some harsh laws are needed. All that is happening is, we have dumb people out there in droves..And that small portion is causing a need for harsher action..Guess what, society functions that way..the city of Ottawa has ~5000 cops...why, because a few hundred to a few thousands idiots force us to need them.. 1 million residents, a few hundred idiots...cause 5000 policeman..

How many morons are hoarding supplies..sadly, they impact all of us..How many morons are disobeying quarantine requests...How many morons are misbehaving in general?

The sad reality is a few idiots, lead to a few thousand people needed to coral them and induce harm in a few million.

 

[Stylizer1]

Millions of the poorest voted for Trump. Cut taxes for billionaires, they say he's an angel protecting them from socialism. Not sure what they expect, you could offer to pay their rent on the condition that Trump has to go, they would still choose Trump.

Fake News.

 

[Sens]

 

[Dingle]

That’s not really realistic though. We’re not talking about charging north as individuals raiding for food.

We’re talking about sick people stumbling north to scrounge up ventilators and medical staff to help them use them for a few weeks.

No, we aren’t at risk of the great invasion, especially since the states right along the border are very similar to us.

let's hope. NY could see about 200,000 infected in 2 weeks or so. if a mere 10% need care. It will overwhelmed them..you are right, the sick are not about to head North, but say a Father taking his child north to save him...a grand-kid driving his grandma, or a son driving his mom.

Did you forget the Syrians, Iraqi's and Kurds heading north. Some on dinghies trying to cross the Mediterranean. Have you forgotten the Africans doing the same. How about the Vietnamese..the Cubans. The poor Syrians walked almost 2000 km to get to Germany.

we better hope that they control the spread and react quickly.

what happens when NYC residents head north to smaller towns..and then if the smaller town residents head more North????? Now Michigan and its poverty..Detroit is due north of Windsor.....

 

[TheDebater]

The kids next door were playing with friends about 2 hours ago..maybe we need to understand social distancing a tad better.

You don't flatten curves by doing what we are doing..if you are on a diet, you don't go to a café for a coffee and cake, right?

Until people get it, that isolation literally means isolation..then the numbers will continue to grow. I have left my home precisely 4 times the last 3 weeks...One of which was an unavoidable hospital trip, my significant other has cancer. The 3 other trips were for food. What I got will last a good 2 weeks...so it will mean 4 trips out in 5 weeks.

I have washed by hand enough times, my skin is darn near warn off. I have wiped everything down with detergent..I wear gloves when I shop. I leave my jacket in the garage, as well as my gloves.

what is it that people fail to understand? An f'ng nail salon was still open...How many women (and men) are getting hair dressers to come to the house? How many are still going to pharmacies just to load up on cosmetic products..because God knows, our roots showing is so much worse than our loved ones dying.

snow bird returning from Florida are still going shopping and going around...even though they have a directive to isolate for 14 days.. small bars/pubs are opening and then defending their actions by saying, a private party!!!!!

f'ng grocery stores are not smart enough to hand cashiers masks and gloves.. At the store, what do I see, one old coot, decided he needed to squeeze every bread bag, just to feel for freshness. So if the f***er had anything, he left it on about a dozen bread bags.

what we have is not a flat curve, but flatheads

If you are not going outside your house, there is really no need to constantly wash your hands until your skin wears off. The virus is either inside your home or not, I think you can give yourself a break in that regard.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

If you are not going outside your house, there is really no need to constantly wash your hands until your skin wears off. The virus is either inside your home or not, I think you can give yourself a break in that regard.

Did you miss the bit about their SO having cancer? Probably trying to be cautious around them in case they're an asymptomatic carrier.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

Money money money, that is literally all people these days can ever think of. People survived and lived peaceful lives for thousands of years prior to this 100 year technological boom.

Technology is fun and convenient, but we have been spoiled to think that we need a Tim Horton's on every corner of every city...

That's the one thing I don't get. Now, I'm not an economist here, or a stock trader or know diddly squat about world economics.

The one thing I see, is how virtually all of it is fake. Digital and paper currency and be made on a near infinite basis. Every country on the planet has massive debt, but also lends a massive amount to other countries. Everything is so jumbled up and weird....A owes B, who owes C, who owes D, who owes A. Country A can't let B, C or D falter because of trades and debts, and ditto for countries B, C, and D regarding each other. Everyone owes everyone, and everyone is owed from everyone. At this point, you could cancel everything out and start fresh and no one on the planet (asides from bookkeepers) would know the difference.

We could cancel all debt and bills currently owed on the planet right now for everyone, and we'd likely be in a much better state going forward than to play this 'we got to get the economy moving again and risk half the population' idea floating around. Hell, money only exists because we choose to give it value.

 

[Knave]

I think ultimately what this comes down to is just like how many countries also have an oil stockpile after the oil shocks in the 1970s... we (Ontario and Canada) need to start maintaining stockpiles of items like facemasks (or filters on them) and other critical medical equipment. I know they have N95 masks stockpiled since SARS but it needs to go beyond just masks and they need to do quality checks to ensure they're still usable after 1, 5, 10 years or whatever and stored properly so they last.

Doug Ford mentioned in his press conference the US was refusing to export certain things (I forget what) - that all needs to be made in Canada or at bare minimum stockpiled so we have at several month's worth of supply.

 

[Mingus Dew]

That's the one thing I don't get. Now, I'm not an economist here, or a stock trader or know diddly squat about world economics.

The one thing I see, is how virtually all of it is fake. Digital and paper currency and be made on a near infinite basis. Every country on the planet has massive debt, but also lends a massive amount to other countries. Everything is so jumbled up and weird....A owes B, who owes C, who owes D, who owes A. Country A can't let B, C or D falter because of trades and debts, and ditto for countries B, C, and D regarding each other. Everyone owes everyone, and everyone is owed from everyone. At this point, you could cancel everything out and start fresh and no one on the planet (asides from bookkeepers) would know the difference.

We could cancel all debt and bills currently owed on the planet right now for everyone, and we'd likely be in a much better state going forward than to play this 'we got to get the economy moving again and risk half the population' idea floating around. Hell, money only exists because we choose to give it value.

I know you know it’s not that simple. Sure the global financial system is largely a shell game but it’s an important shell game that serves a purpose. I’m not an economist either which is why I’m not going to make sweeping proclamations about the utopian value of dismantling world debt and equity markets.

 

[RedWhiteBlackGold]

How come we never hear about Russia? Despite the friendship or lack of, they never seem to be in the update of things.

 

[Dingle]

I think ultimately what this comes down to is just like how many countries also have an oil stockpile after the oil shocks in the 1970s... we (Ontario and Canada) need to start maintaining stockpiles of items like facemasks (or filters on them) and other critical medical equipment. I know they have N95 masks stockpiled since SARS but it needs to go beyond just masks and they need to do quality checks to ensure they're still usable after 1, 5, 10 years or whatever and stored properly so they last.

Doug Ford mentioned in his press conference the US was refusing to export certain things (I forget what) - that all needs to be made in Canada or at bare minimum stockpiled so we have at several month's worth of supply.

The sad reality is always the same..we forget..After this, the government will implement all sorts of changes. Stockpiling, changes here changes there..an agency to deal with future issues, etc.

Then several years go by and we have no issues..we start screaming, cut taxes..we forget and some politician comes by and gets rid of all of this...pretty much what Trump did to all the stuff Obama set up after the H1N1 of 2009 and the Ebola a few years later.

Some politician will come by, see a few million dollars a year in costs and be our hero..gets rid of all of this and beats his chest in victory, because he reduced waste!!!!! We will love him for it, because we will save $200 and use it on something like say; a pair of tickets to a game!!!!

then the obvious happens..the next incident and we go screaming.

The H1N1 was 2009..The Ebola was 2014-2016....we learned nothing...and undid all the precautions we implemented.

Doug Ford came into office preoccupied by a buck a beer..now he is Mother Teresa

 

[swiftwin]

TBH, this is a huge peeve of mine. Driving is treated like a joke, when in reality, it's a dangerous activity. We need to be waaay harsher on negligent drivers. Cause an accident? Lose your license for a year. Kill someone? Go to jail.

 

[Ice-Tray]

let's hope. NY could see about 200,000 infected in 2 weeks or so. if a mere 10% need care. It will overwhelmed them..you are right, the sick are not about to head North, but say a Father taking his child north to save him...a grand-kid driving his grandma, or a son driving his mom.

Did you forget the Syrians, Iraqi's and Kurds heading north. Some on dinghies trying to cross the Mediterranean. Have you forgotten the Africans doing the same. How about the Vietnamese..the Cubans. The poor Syrians walked almost 2000 km to get to Germany.

we better hope that they control the spread and react quickly.

what happens when NYC residents head north to smaller towns..and then if the smaller town residents head more North????? Now Michigan and its poverty..Detroit is due north of Windsor.....

it won’t happen, but it could make a good movie.

They wouldn’t make it passed the border with granny and the kids.

If they were to attack they still won’t force long term care. It’s not like we’re hoarding a vaccine that they can just grab and use.

 

[Dingle]

it won’t happen, but it could make a good movie.

They wouldn’t make it passed the border with granny and the kids.

If they were to attack they still won’t force long term care. It’s not like we’re hoarding a vaccine that they can just grab and use.

it is not about attacking us. Say a few hundred people driving up with sick family members with them..what do we do, turn them away???

so a 100 or so crossing from east coast to west coast. each seeing 100 cars..that is 10000 people..the bulk of whom may be infected. almost surely a large number are critical..it is after all why they came up..Those that brought them, will almost inevitably get infected..

Now what?????? morally, we cannot turn them away... imagine 10000 people...3000-4000 loading our hospitals...Canada has 3000 ICU's

what happens if it is 100 cars, for 100 days at 100 crossing...1 million people...where do we begin?

~ 100,000,000 of them within 500 - 700 km's... If the bad scenario of 70% infected..70,000,000 .....at as low as 10% needing hospitals...7,000,000 ....Can they handle that? I doubt it...where will the overflow go? It cannot head south.. There is another 100,000,000 living in the 700-1400 km down..

This is a damn holding water..We are in deep shit if it breaks.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

it is not about attacking us. Say a few hundred people driving up with sick family members with them..what do we do, turn them away???

so a 100 or so crossing from east coast to west coast. each seeing 100 cars..that is 10000 people..the bulk of whom may be infected. almost surely a large number are critical..it is after all why they came up..Those that brought them, will almost inevitably get infected..

Now what?????? morally, we cannot turn them away... imagine 10000 people...3000-4000 loading our hospitals...Canada has 3000 ICU's

what happens if it is 100 cars, for 100 days at 100 crossing...1 million people...where do we begin?

~ 100,000,000 of them within 500 - 700 km's... If the bad scenario of 70% infected..70,000,000 .....at as low as 10% needing hospitals...7,000,000 ....Can they handle that? I doubt it...where will the overflow go? It cannot head south.. There is another 100,000,000 living in the 700-1400 km down..

This is a damn holding water..We are in deep shit if it breaks.

That's like the scenario in every zombie and apocalyptic movie out there. You know as soon as you open the door to that new character(s), half the folks in the film are going to die because of it.

 

[Ice-Tray]

it is not about attacking us. Say a few hundred people driving up with sick family members with them..what do we do, turn them away???

so a 100 or so crossing from east coast to west coast. each seeing 100 cars..that is 10000 people..the bulk of whom may be infected. almost surely a large number are critical..it is after all why they came up..Those that brought them, will almost inevitably get infected..

Now what?????? morally, we cannot turn them away... imagine 10000 people...3000-4000 loading our hospitals...Canada has 3000 ICU's

what happens if it is 100 cars, for 100 days at 100 crossing...1 million people...where do we begin?

~ 100,000,000 of them within 500 - 700 km's... If the bad scenario of 70% infected..70,000,000 .....at as low as 10% needing hospitals...7,000,000 ....Can they handle that? I doubt it...where will the overflow go? It cannot head south.. There is another 100,000,000 living in the 700-1400 km down..

This is a damn holding water..We are in deep shit if it breaks.

Dingle, try and relax, this will not happen, even entertaining the notion, it makes zero sense for infected people to come up to another infected country.

Yes, we turn them back. We would turn them back right now.

If you are infected and Canadian you are not even allowed to travel home. There is zero chance that we would let them cross the border. We have already closed the door officially to ALL asylum seekers, let alone infected family groups.

The point is, why in the world would they come up here? We have the virus as well. They wouldn’t be able to get care up here at all, and they wouldn’t be able to take it even if they wanted to.

The best chance Americans have to get care that they need, is in their home state. There is absolute nothing up here for them in your scenario, unless they wanted to purposely try and infect Canadians.

It’s just not a reasonable situation to get worked up about, and personally I think we have enough realistic scenarios domestically to be concerned about.