Speculation: New Jersey Offseason IX - The Summer of Shero Edition

[Group Chat Legend*]

Who did we sign today?

Was told it was a ND defenseman

 

[Alex NJD]

Is the Expansion Draft before or after Free Agency next year?

 

[Group Chat Legend*]

Is the Expansion Draft before or after Free Agency next year?

IIRC, it is before the prospect draft. So before free agency.

 

[EnglishDevil]

Is the Expansion Draft before or after Free Agency next year?

It'll be before, so Vegas has a chance to participate in free agency with somewhat of a roster already constructed.

 

[Emperoreddy]

It'll be before, so Vegas has a chance to participate in free agency with somewhat of a roster already constructed.

Does Vegas participate in the regular draft next season or the season after?

 

[FooteBahl]

Can someone explain to me the cap benefits/problems with these multiple year signing bonuses? I know parise and his bf's contracts had large upfront bonuses, but I can't remember how it affects the cap.

 

[SeidoN]

Does Vegas participate in the regular draft next season or the season after?

they will be in the 17 draft

they will automatically have the draft lottery odds of the 3rd worst team.

 

[Triumph]

Can someone explain to me the cap benefits/problems with these multiple year signing bonuses? I know parise and his bf's contracts had large upfront bonuses, but I can't remember how it affects the cap.

It does not affect the salary cap at all when the contract is in effect. Any 'signing bonus' money is counted the same way that regular salary is counted.

It does three things:

A: It allows a player to get paid a substantial amount of money even in the case of a lockout. A player involved in a half-season lockout will have his salary reduced by half, but a player with a signing bonus will earn his signing bonus regardless. A player making $4M in salary will make $2M in that case, but a player who has a signing bonus of $2M and a salary of $2M will make $3M.

B: It makes a player easier to trade to a money-conscious team. A team like the Leafs can pay a July 1 bonus then trade the guy on July 2 - he will still carry the same cap hit but will end up costing less money to the new team.

C: A team saves very little money/cap room on a buyout the more money is in bonuses. This is more complicated, and I'm too lazy to look up exactly how it works, but bonuses don't get 'bought out' - they must be paid out.

 

[FooteBahl]

It does not affect the salary cap at all when the contract is in effect. Any 'signing bonus' money is counted the same way that regular salary is counted.

It does three things:

A: It allows a player to get paid a substantial amount of money even in the case of a lockout. A player involved in a half-season lockout will have his salary reduced by half, but a player with a signing bonus will earn his signing bonus regardless. A player making $4M in salary will make $2M in that case, but a player who has a signing bonus of $2M and a salary of $2M will make $3M.

B: It makes a player easier to trade to a money-conscious team. A team like the Leafs can pay a July 1 bonus then trade the guy on July 2 - he will still carry the same cap hit but will end up costing less money to the new team.

C: A team saves very little money/cap room on a buyout the more money is in bonuses. This is more complicated, and I'm too lazy to look up exactly how it works, but bonuses don't get 'bought out' - they must be paid out.

Awesome. Thank you

 

[Darkauron]

It does not affect the salary cap at all when the contract is in effect. Any 'signing bonus' money is counted the same way that regular salary is counted.

It does three things:

A: It allows a player to get paid a substantial amount of money even in the case of a lockout. A player involved in a half-season lockout will have his salary reduced by half, but a player with a signing bonus will earn his signing bonus regardless. A player making $4M in salary will make $2M in that case, but a player who has a signing bonus of $2M and a salary of $2M will make $3M.

B: It makes a player easier to trade to a money-conscious team. A team like the Leafs can pay a July 1 bonus then trade the guy on July 2 - he will still carry the same cap hit but will end up costing less money to the new team.

C: A team saves very little money/cap room on a buyout the more money is in bonuses. This is more complicated, and I'm too lazy to look up exactly how it works, but bonuses don't get 'bought out' - they must be paid out.

There is no way that this stays come the next CBA. That is ridiculous.

 

[Ripshot 43]

There is no way that this stays come the next CBA. That is ridiculous.

And then we have a strike again. Hooray!!

Look at the way Stamkos had his contract structured. 7.5 million in a bonus every year at the beginning of the season. Then 1 million cut up throughout the year. It's almost as if a lot of these players are prepping for another lost year.

 

[Cheddabombs]

It does not affect the salary cap at all when the contract is in effect. Any 'signing bonus' money is counted the same way that regular salary is counted.

It does three things:

A: It allows a player to get paid a substantial amount of money even in the case of a lockout. A player involved in a half-season lockout will have his salary reduced by half, but a player with a signing bonus will earn his signing bonus regardless. A player making $4M in salary will make $2M in that case, but a player who has a signing bonus of $2M and a salary of $2M will make $3M.

B: It makes a player easier to trade to a money-conscious team. A team like the Leafs can pay a July 1 bonus then trade the guy on July 2 - he will still carry the same cap hit but will end up costing less money to the new team.

C: A team saves very little money/cap room on a buyout the more money is in bonuses. This is more complicated, and I'm too lazy to look up exactly how it works, but bonuses don't get 'bought out' - they must be paid out.

IIRC it's also for tax benefits for the player. I'm heard that Stamkos' new contract only pays him $1M in salary and the rest of the $7.5 in signing bonuses, and he gets hit with a much smaller tax % in the latter.

 

[thethinglonger]

It was really interesting hearing Shero go into detail about the Larsson trade...essentially mentioning that Larsson was a long-term plan to build around, which leads me to assume that we'll take a defenseman with our first round pick next draft (assuming we don't move it). Maybe it's the optimistic side of me, but I still think Shero has one or two more trades in mind, especially as camp approaches. No idea what to expect though.

 

[RSeen]

It was really interesting hearing Shero go into detail about the Larsson trade...essentially mentioning that Larsson was a long-term plan to build around, which leads me to assume that we'll take a defenseman with our first round pick next draft (assuming we don't move it). Maybe it's the optimistic side of me, but I still think Shero has one or two more trades in mind, especially as camp approaches. No idea what to expect though.

Whatever 1st rounder we take most likely won't be ready for 3 seasons. Will they be an impact player then? Probably will take 4-5 seasons depending on the player. I can't imagine he would be referring to something like that. He is going to have to acquire some Dmen. The rebuild is almost over (amazing what 1 trade can do, in terms of speeding up the rebuild), we don't have the time to wait for a 1st next year to develop down the road. Acquiring a Dman makes more sense. If we could somehow get Shattenkirk as a free agent next season, that would be great IMO, price would be massive though.

 

[Emperoreddy]

I think once we get the season underway and start to get an idea where a bunch of our young guys are at, we can make a solid assessment of what parts we need next and what assets are expendable to get it.

If some of our forwards protect to where we hope they will it might become much more feasible to trade next year's first.

 

[MichaelJ]

Whatever 1st rounder we take most likely won't be ready for 3 seasons. Will they be an impact player then? Probably will take 4-5 seasons depending on the player. I can't imagine he would be referring to something like that. He is going to have to acquire some Dmen. The rebuild is almost over (amazing what 1 trade can do, in terms of speeding up the rebuild), we don't have the time to wait for a 1st next year to develop down the road. Acquiring a Dman makes more sense. If we could somehow get Shattenkirk as a free agent next season, that would be great IMO, price would be massive though.

If drafting for defense is legitimately the plan for the first round pick next year, I'd rather just trade it as part of a package for a young defender with NHL experience. This team will be in a win-now mode sooner rather than later.

 

[JimEIV]

It was really interesting hearing Shero go into detail about the Larsson trade...essentially mentioning that Larsson was a long-term plan to build around, which leads me to assume that we'll take a defenseman with our first round pick next draft (assuming we don't move it). Maybe it's the optimistic side of me, but I still think Shero has one or two more trades in mind, especially as camp approaches. No idea what to expect though.

I think you have to take what executives say with a grain of salt. They'll never let you know their true intentions.

I have a hard time believing Larsson was a player Shero was interested in "building around"...watch every move he's made since he's been in charge and there is an emphasis on skating. Larsson was literally the worst skater of our 6 regulars last season. And when you think of what is out there on the right side with Severson, Jacobs, Mozik and Santini, Larsson is still probably the worst skater.

You watched the draft and saw the emphasis on speed, you've seen the free agent signings and waiver claims all based on speed/skating and you've seen Larsson traded for Hall and you actually believe that Larsson was a player Shero was interested in building around?

I personally think Shero was chomping at the bit to make a move like this.

 

[R8Devs]

or you see that Shero signed Larsson to a 6 year deal as one of his first moves and wouldn't trade him until Edmonton put Hall on the table.

I don’t think Hall was on the table until recently, as everything else they’d tried to pry Larsson loose with failed.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/30-thoughts-couldnt-edmonton-montreal-make-deal/

 

[MadDevil]

Just because Larsson was moved doesn't mean Shero didn't think he was part of the future. He had a rare opportunity to add one of the better young forwards in the league, a guy who is very good at even strength (where we sucked), and can fly like the wind (and we are building a fast team). It was an opportunity too good to pass up.

 

[RSeen]

If drafting for defense is legitimately the plan for the first round pick next year, I'd rather just trade it as part of a package for a young defender with NHL experience. This team will be in a win-now mode sooner rather than later.

Also, Greene will decline at some point. He is what 34 now? How much time does he have as a top pair Dman left? Maybe 2-3 seasons. We definitely need to make additions on D, by this time next year depending on the development of Zacha, JQ, McLeod, we could likely have a surplus of offense. Hopefully Boucher and Blandisi have good seasons and up their value. Shattenkirk would be a nice addition but 25 teams will be going after him.

 

[Triumph]

Greene is very good, but he is replacable. He is not a reason to start sacrificing the future.

 

[MichaelJ]

Also, Greene will decline at some point. He is what 34 now? How much time does he have as a top pair Dman left? Maybe 2-3 seasons. We definitely need to make additions on D, by this time next year depending on the development of Zacha, JQ, McLeod, we could likely have a surplus of offense. Hopefully Boucher and Blandisi have good seasons and up their value. Shattenkirk would be a nice addition but 25 teams will be going after him.

I'm hoping Bennett or DSP do the same this year and increase their trade value.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Greene is very good, but he is replacable. He is not a reason to start sacrificing the future.

this is nonsense

how is he "replaceable?" who are you replacing him with?

 

[Tretyak 20]

If drafting for defense is legitimately the plan for the first round pick next year, I'd rather just trade it as part of a package for a young defender with NHL experience. This team will be in a win-now mode sooner rather than later.

This is where the Hall trade really hurts us. Hopefully Ray can find a young 1st pairing D to build around through trade - I would be willing to trade our 1st, a 2nd and Boucher/Merrill for the right player. Either that our just go best D available with our 1st and 2nd rounders in the draft. Then you'll have to wait for them to develop, though.

 

[NJDevils17]

Zero chance we don't draft BPA. If we have a forward ranked ahead we're going to pick him much to the chagrin of fans likely. These guys are 3-4 years from making and impact. That's why you always draft BPA. There is so much that can change in a year or two years. Shero took over and the line-up was:

Henrique-Gomez-Bernier
Cammalleri-Zajac-Tootoo
Zubrus-Elias-Gionta
Ruutu-Josefson-Ryder

Prospects: Boucher, Quenneville, Santini, Blandisi, Coleman, Jacobs, Kujawinski, Wood, Helgeson, Pietila

And we've added:
Hall-Henrique-Bennett
Cammalleri-Zajac-Palmieri
Boucher-Zacha-DSP
Kalinin-Fiddler-Lappin

Propsects: Zacha, McLeod, Santini, Quenneville, Speers, Blandisi, Blackwood, Wood, Bastian, Jacobs, Pietila


This all happened in one year. The team is totally transformed and now we need defense. Hall and Palmieri are top 3 players, Bennett, and DSP are middle 6 guys and all these guys were brought in via trade. There's no reason we can't do similar things with defense. Drafting for need is how you get into issues. Always BPA.

This is one of the huge reasons I'm for trading the pick as well.