Larry Brooks: Marc Staal wants to stay in New York

[Levitate]

Can't dispute the facts.

However I will say that, IMO, his declining foot speed and inability to handle the puck was exposed at times during the season and in the final two rounds versus LA and Montreal. I also believe Stralman carried the pairing, and that Staal won't look good this year paired with Boyle.

On our team with our cap structure, we could do much more with that 5.5-6 million for 6-7 years than paying an aging Staal that amount to play LD on our second pair.

Staal is NOT the player he once was and, unfortunately, likely never will be.

I dont' think his foot speed is declining at all, he's never been particularly agile or fast. He's just quite big and has a big reach and when he's playing a good game, he positions himself well and gives himself time to make plays where he doesn't have to rely on speed. I think it's just gotten harder with his messed up eye, which of course is an issue.

He needs to show some of the old Staal this year

 

[offdacrossbar]

this is a tough call. emotion aside, he needs to sign elsewhere.

marc staal is not the same player he was prior to the injury. yes, hes still a very good defender but hes no longer a #1. mcd is our # 1 and he has a great 6 yr deal. we committed money and term to both he and girardi- who has been a healthy and consistent, albeit average on many nights, performer over his career here. he got paid and will prob retire a nyr. good for him. big difference between danny and marc though.

we cannot afford to throw 30 mil and a ntc to marc staal and be able to sign our core players long term. we just cant. and more importantly, staals play is trending in the wrong direction and when added to his injury, doesnt bode well for a 5 yr deal. it would be bad cap management to lock him up long term.

keep staal for this seasons run then retool. trading him for value will be tough, let him walk and sign his cap killing deal with carolina. frees up 30 mil for a centerman.

brady skjei is next in line and john moore is there as well along with conor allen. well be fine with out 30 mil tied up on a player whos play is trending the wrong way and has concussion concerns and eye issues.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

This myth needs to stop. Staal's not anywhere close that good. Just off the top of my head, do you think he's better than these guys?

Subban
Doughty
Vlasic
Karlsson
Chara
Pietrangelo
Keith
Weber
Hedman
Ekman-Larsson
Suter

Is he better than:

MacDonald
Schenn
Coburn
Streit
Hamonic
Fayne
J Schultz
Kronwall
J Johnson
Wisniewski
Greene
Myers
Goligoski
Giordano
Hamuis
Bieksa
Campbell
Sekera
Niskanen
E Johnson

 

[Raspewtin]

Is he better than:

MacDonald
Schenn
Coburn
Streit
Hamonic
Fayne
J Schultz
Kronwall
J Johnson
Wisniewski
Greene
Myers
Goligoski
Giordano
Hamuis
Bieksa
Campbell
Sekera
Niskanen
E Johnson

The bolded are definitely better players.

 

[Doctyl]

I wouldn't say Coburn is definitely better than Staal at all

 

[NYR425]

The bolded are definitely better players.

No way that any of Greene, Coburn, Hamuis and Sekera are better...

 

[Raspewtin]

No way that any of Greene, Coburn, Hamuis and Sekera are better...

Well then you just haven't watched them enough.

Hamhuis probably wasn't better last season, but over his whole career he's been better.

Greene is better and has been for a few years.

Coburn is really underrated. I'd say they're really close.

Sekera last season was definitely better than Staal. If he keeps it up, he's better easily.

 

[TheTakedown]

This myth needs to stop. Staal's not anywhere close that good. Just off the top of my head, do you think he's better than these guys?

Subban
Doughty
Vlasic
Karlsson
Chara
Pietrangelo
Keith
Weber
Hedman
Ekman-Larsson
Suter
McDonagh

First off you forgot McDonagh...

Second, If we're going go in that direction, then lets look a the facts of those players and their respective teams.

a) Is Doughty "elite" defensively? Is PK Subban a world-breaker in his own zone? No, Doughty is a well rounded, all-around defenseman, but his specialty is OFFENSE... Do you not remember everyone here saying McD was better defensively while Doughty was better Offensively during the playoffs?

b) Not all of those guys play the left side, which still makes him a #1 Pairing Defenseman on LA (Doughty), Ottawa (Karlsson), St. Louis (Pietrangelo), Montreal (Subban), Nashville (Weber)...

c) all of those guys are on massive contracts due to the OFFENSE created from the blueline... however the mistake here is focusing on the offensive side of a defenseman, which is naturally (by way of it's name) a DEFENSE-FIRST position. I'm not saying that Staal shouldn't be putting up points, but to say he's "better" than these other players is not quite accurate because only a handful of those players you listed are primarily shut-down defenseman... (which I'll address in e)

d) What about age? Staal is only 27, and now entering his prime. Not exactly Dan Boyle part II, right?

e) to answer your question directly:
i. in terms of offensive production, he only realistically beats Chara (at 5v5), mostly because he does not play power play time.
ii. In terms of defensive play, I'd say the only guys ahead of him on that list are Weber, Suter, Chara, Vlasic, McDonagh, and Keith (in no particular order). The list of who he is better than is VERY long...

f) in regards to the salary cap, Staal's cap hit is currently 4.875M... is commiting an extra $2M for depth of the LD position really that impeding to the team?

 

[Thirty One]

The bolded are definitely better players.

Erik Johnson....

 

[Raspewtin]

Erik Johnson....

Why's Johnson worse?

Legitimately curious

 

[Off Sides]

I'd go

Is he better than:

MacDonald yes
Schenn yes
Coburn equal
Streit no
Hamonic equal
Fayne equal
J Schultz yes
Kronwall no
J Johnson close but no
Wisniewski not offensively
Greene no
Myers yes
Goligoski yes
Giordano no
Hamuis right now yes
Bieksa no
Campbell age thing, but no
Sekera no
Niskanen no
E Johnson yes

 

[silverfish]

There exists no world where Andrej Sekera is better than Marc Staal

 

[Thirty One]

Why's Johnson worse?

Legitimately curious

Because he doesn't understand defense at all.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

There exists no world where Andrej Sekera is better than Marc Staal

maybe not a world, but a time period (last year)

 

[silverfish]

maybe not a world, but a time period (last year)

Is this the same Andrej Sekera who consistently found himself in Lindy Ruff's doghouse with the Sabres? Just because he put up sexy numbers with bloated PP time doesn't make him a better defenseman than Staal. I don't think he is.

Let's see if he can keep it up for more than one good season at the ripe age of 27. Meanwhile, Staal's been a top-4 staple on a playoff contending team for the past 7 seasons.

 

[haveandare]

this is a tough call. emotion aside, he needs to sign elsewhere.

marc staal is not the same player he was prior to the injury. yes, hes still a very good defender but hes no longer a #1. mcd is our # 1 and he has a great 6 yr deal. we committed money and term to both he and girardi- who has been a healthy and consistent, albeit average on many nights, performer over his career here. he got paid and will prob retire a nyr. good for him. big difference between danny and marc though.

we cannot afford to throw 30 mil and a ntc to marc staal and be able to sign our core players long term. we just cant. and more importantly, staals play is trending in the wrong direction and when added to his injury, doesnt bode well for a 5 yr deal. it would be bad cap management to lock him up long term.

keep staal for this seasons run then retool. trading him for value will be tough, let him walk and sign his cap killing deal with carolina. frees up 30 mil for a centerman.

brady skjei is next in line and john moore is there as well along with conor allen. well be fine with out 30 mil tied up on a player whos play is trending the wrong way and has concussion concerns and eye issues.

I don't really disagree with any of the logic except that Sjkei, Moore and/or Allen can take his minutes. I think that is extremely optimistic. Sjkei hasn't played a minute of pro hockey. Moore is a good third pairing guy when he's next to a shutdown partner. Allen didn't look ready for third pairing minutes, let alone second.

 

[redwhiteandblue]

I'd go

Is he better than:

MacDonald yes
Schenn yes
Coburn equal
Streit no
Hamonic equal
Fayne equal
J Schultz yes
Kronwall no
J Johnson close but no
Wisniewski not offensively
Greene no
Myers yes
Goligoski yes
Giordano no
Hamuis right now yes
Bieksa no
Campbell age thing, but no
Sekera no
Niskanen no
E Johnson yes

This is horrible. I stopped reading after Coburn in Streit. Offensive prowess =/= a good defenseman. In fact it can be just the opposite. Look at that slob Mike Green, he's so poor defensively its like having a fourth forward on the ice as a liability.

 

[Off Sides]

This is horrible. I stopped reading after Coburn in Streit. Offensive prowess =/= a good defenseman. In fact it can be just the opposite. Look at that slob Mike Green, he's so poor defensively its like having a fourth forward on the ice as a liability.

Your in depth analysis and opinion is dually noted and appreciated.

 

[zuckera1]

Guys...I think you're all missing something here when you're comparing him to what other teams have defensively.

Just because most teams don't have the luxury of a guy like Staal on their second pairing doesn't mean it makes sense for the NY RANGERS to pay Staal 6 million to play 2LD for 6-7 years given his injury risk and how his play is trending.

It may make sense for a team like Carolina to pay Staal 6-6.5 to be on their first pair. It doesn't make sense for us, given OUR cap situation and our organizational depth at LD.

 

[haveandare]

I'd go

Is he better than:

MacDonald yes
Schenn yes
Coburn equal
Streit no
Hamonic equal
Fayne equal
J Schultz yes
Kronwall no
J Johnson close but no
Wisniewski not offensively
Greene no
Myers yes
Goligoski yes
Giordano no
Hamuis right now yes
Bieksa no
Campbell age thing, but no
Sekera no
Niskanen no
E Johnson yes

How is Philly's d so bad when they have one d-man better than Staal and one who is about equal? One could argue that the Rangers have McD who is better than Staal, and Girardi who is about the same.

Sure, the goalie difference is big, but NYR were 4th in the league in GA last year while Philly was 20.

Streit and Coburn are being overrated quite a bit IMO. Streit is probably "better" than Staal right now, but not by much when you consider both sides of the puck. Coburn is not as good as Staal to me.

 

[Off Sides]

How is Philly's d so bad when they have one d-man better than Staal and one who is about equal? One could argue that the Rangers have McD who is better than Staal, and Girardi who is about the same.

Sure, the goalie difference is big, but NYR were 4th in the league in GA last year while Philly was 20.

Streit and Coburn are being overrated quite a bit IMO.

The difference in my opinion is Grossmann, Schenn, Meszaros, and MacDonald not being as good as Staal, Stralman, Klein and Moore

I think Streit is a better player than Staal, He may not have the defensive accoutrements but he moves the puck much better and is by far the superior offensive player.

I think Coburn, while slow is an equal defender to Staal who is not exactly that fleet of foot either.

Would it make everyone feel better if I said I'd give Staal the slight edge over Coburn?

 

[RangerBoy]

The Canadian dollar is trading below 90 cents and it's projected to trade at 85 cents next year. For a league which generates 25%-30% from the seven Canadian teams, that will hurt the NHL and the bottom line. The NHL converts the loonie into US dollars. Since the 2004 lockout, the loonie has gone up and remained at par or close to par. It declined during the financial crisis in 08-09. How much will the cap increase for next season? The Rangers have some players up for new contracts again next summer. The Rangers find themselves in another contract situation with one of their main players. Again.

 

[True Blue]

This myth needs to stop. Staal's not anywhere close that good. Just off the top of my head, do you think he's better than these guys?

Subban
Doughty
Vlasic
Karlsson
Chara
Pietrangelo
Keith
Weber
Hedman
Ekman-Larsson
Suter

While some of the individuals can be debated, what cannot be debated is that is a list of 11. That leaves 49 others that should be better in order for Staal not to be considered a top pairing defenseman.

 

[True Blue]

brady skjei is next in line and john moore is there as well along with conor allen.

None of these players are on Staal's level. We should be so luck if one even comes close. None of them have proven anything.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Well then you just haven't watched them enough.

Hamhuis probably wasn't better last season, but over his whole career he's been better.

Greene is better and has been for a few years.

Coburn is really underrated. I'd say they're really close.

Sekera last season was definitely better than Staal. If he keeps it up, he's better easily.

I am meh on the top 3. Sekera however, I agree 100% on.