Post-Game Talk: Maple Leafs win big! Matthews is the hero

[notDatsyuk]

Means sweet f*** all how many 5-3's we got a decade ago. We have consistently been at the bottom of the league in PP the last 5 years with this group.

The last five seasons we were 4th, 29th, 11th, first, and 8th in those opportunities. Tied for eighth overall. Even including this season, we're tied for 13th.

But you're right to an extent - "this group" doesn't play the type of PP hockey that creates a lot of second penalties.

 

[LaPlante94]

While I agree that the goaltending during that really hot stretch was very good and the offense was pretty good too, we can't deny that the defense really stepped it up as well. During a good stretch of that time Gio and Holl were playing the most minutes with Liljegren and Sandin among others playing 2nd pairing minutes and whoever they threw in on the bottom pairing also looked solid.

Then Timmins arrived and also looked good and was chipping in with offense and the Leafs were winning one goal games as well as games where they were putting up a bunch of goals. Pretty much the whole team was clicking together and our defense really hasn't looked that good in a very long time when every pairing looked solid and could play decent defense.

When Rielly came back the balance on defense was back out of wack because you were now back to trying to fit a guy on defense that you're going to play 20+ mins a game with suspect defensive play and we're back to fixing a problem that seemingly can't be fixed. I like Rielly and I want him to succeed which is why it sucks to criticise him, but its been years now and its always been the same where the Leafs keep feeding him minutes that he perhaps shouldn't be getting based on his defensive play.

Give Rielly a few less minutes in the 2nd pairing and give someone else a chance at top pairing minutes and see how it works out because we've seen for many years now that Rielly playing the most and toughest minutes won't be a good outcome for the Leafs more games than not and I'd be happy to be proven wrong by him.

We started that hot streak with Rielly in the lineup. Literally went 7-0-3 in the month of November before he went down for a month. Now even looking at the teams we played in his absence I'm a little shocked to see that the teams we beat were not very good or just average teams. I'd say the wins over the Devils, Wild, Stars and Lightning were good wins but the rest were not very good teams.

Still won though so that's all that matters, but look at our record without Matthews. Why is that? Do we play him less? Maybe when we're missing key pieces we just actually play more conservative and don't take/make as many high risk plays and capitalize on other teams mistakes like most teams do to us. Those high risk plays at the blueline we like to do cause a lot of breakaways or 2 on 1s just for us to blame Rielly for trusting his teammates like he should. Or our forwards forget they have to cover when the D join the rush or pinch down the boards to keep the play in the o zone which seems to be a big part of Keefes system. This didn't seem to be as big of an issue with Babcock coaching here. Why is that?

 

[GrizzGreen]

But you're right to an extent - "this group" doesn't play the type of PP hockey that creates a lot of second penalties.

I think this is a underlying cause people dont look to. The perimeter play and looking for the right shots rather than crashing the net certainly cuts down on opportunities to draw penalties in tight.

 

[PROUD PAPA]

We started that hot streak with Rielly in the lineup. Literally went 7-0-3 in the month of November before he went down for a month. Now even looking at the teams we played in his absence I'm a little shocked to see that the teams we beat were not very good or just average teams. I'd say the wins over the Devils, Wild, Stars and Lightning were good wins but the rest were not very good teams.

Still won though so that's all that matters, but look at our record without Matthews. Why is that? Do we play him less? Maybe when we're missing key pieces we just actually play more conservative and don't take/make as many high risk plays and capitalize on other teams mistakes like most teams do to us. Those high risk plays at the blueline we like to do cause a lot of breakaways or 2 on 1s just for us to blame Rielly for trusting his teammates like he should. Or our forwards forget they have to cover when the D join the rush or pinch down the boards to keep the play in the o zone which seems to be a big part of Keefes system. This didn't seem to be as big of an issue with Babcock coaching here. Why is that?

The obvious shouldn't need to be explained but credit to you for doing so anyway.

 

[notDatsyuk]

That doesn't change how problematic the current stat is. In fact, it makes it even worse. The fact that we got an abundance of 5 on 3s when we were bad and had worse players on our PPs and it dries up once we have one of the most dominant PPs in the league should raise some eyebrows.

How bad were we two years ago when we led the league in 5-on-3s, or last year when we were 8th?

The way we play, mostly on the perimeter with little active drive to the net, may be the biggest reason this year.

 

[Martin Skoula]

How bad were we two years ago when we led the league in 5-on-3s, or last year when we were 8th?

The way we play, mostly on the perimeter with little active drive to the net, may be the biggest reason this year.

The closer to the net you are the more the refs let the D get away with anything. Do a regular net clearing cross check in open ice by the blue line and it gets called every time.

We have slow give and go entries now instead of Nylander flying down the wing and doing his buttonhook pass to the trailer, the slower and more stationary we are the less risks the D has to take. Most 2nd penalties are going to be a hook or trip from a tired PKer that picked the wrong side of a coin flip read on someone faster than them.

 

[Dekes For Days]

How bad were we two years ago when we led the league in 5-on-3s, or last year when we were 8th?
The way we play, mostly on the perimeter with little active drive to the net, may be the biggest reason this year.

The fact that it's fluctuating like that actually contradicts your claim that it's systems-based, and we are not a perimeter team on the PP. In fact, quite the opposite. We are among the teams to use points shots the least on the PP; instead driving the net, getting slot chances, crease chances, cross-ice chances, etc.
We should have more than one 5 on 3, and there should not be a range of 1 to 16 chances in this league.

 

[notDatsyuk]

The fact that it's fluctuating like that actually contradicts your claim that it's systems-based, and we are not a perimeter team on the PP. In fact, quite the opposite. We are among the teams to use points shots the least on the PP; instead driving the net, getting slot chances, crease chances, cross-ice chances, etc.
We should have more than one 5 on 3, and there should not be a range of 1 to 16 chances in this league.

Seriously? JT stands in the slot and Matthews, Mitch, Willy, and Rielly pass it around the outside (and occasionally through the slot) until they take a shot.
Nothing to cause a defender to take a penalty.

Normal fluctuations in a very small sample size? What a shock.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Seriously? JT stands in the slot and Matthews, Mitch, Willy, and Rielly pass it around the outside (and occasionally through the slot) until they take a shot.

Our PP gets a ton of close up/slot/cross-seam/high danger chances, and is one of the best PPs in the league, generating some of the most chances in the league. To pretend like that doesn't ever involve taking abuse from opponents is beyond ridiculous. Our PP runs pretty similarly to teams that are high on the list, and by your own admission, this exact same PP and system has been high on the list before. This isn't a system issue.

Normal fluctuations in a very small sample size? What a shock.

Those fluctuations and that range isn't normal.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Our PP gets a ton of close up/slot/cross-seam/high danger chances, and is one of the best PPs in the league, generating some of the most chances in the league. To pretend like that doesn't ever involve taking abuse from opponents is beyond ridiculous. Our PP runs pretty similarly to teams that are high on the list, and by your own admission, this exact same PP and system has been high on the list before. This isn't a system issue.

Those fluctuations and that range isn't normal.

14 other times in 14 seasons a team has had zero, one, or two 5-on-3s.

Your takes are ridiculous. End of wasting my time.

 

[Dekes For Days]

14 other times in 14 seasons a team has had zero, one, or two 3-on-5s.

That's a weird way of saying that we're on track to become the first team in recorded history to play a non-shortened season and have less than two 5 on 3s.
I believe they said on the broadcast we also set a record for longest stretch without a 5 on 3? And yet here you are, trying to misrepresent it as just another Tuesday.
Also, even if other teams had experienced something similar, that wouldn't mean there isn't a problem.

 

[Hoglund4MvP]

Really need O'Reilly back.

Our best player show up we win most of the time. There's nothing much to really say about this game. I already knew we won once Matthews got his second goal. Rest of the team is a bunch of who cares. Need O'Reilly for when one of the best players has a bad game that's really the only chance we will see change in playoffs.