Managerial merry go round part II

[booyakasha]

Arteta + Cazorla = golden age of Arsenal.

...Arsenal director Raul Sanllehi, head of recruitment Sven Mislintat, complete gutting of the back room....etc.

what Arsenal needs is to give the next man is patiance, and stability, and will only need to concentrate on the football, not the business.

 

[KJS14]

...Arsenal director Raul Sanllehi, head of recruitment Sven Mislintat, complete gutting of the back room....etc.

what Arsenal needs is to give the next man is patiance, and stability, and will only need to concentrate on the football, not the business.

I'm still not confident in Arteta as a first time manager, but like cgf said, I'd rather take a chance on him than someone like Ancelotti.

 

[Bon Esprit]

RB Leipzig and Hasenhüttl part ways multiple sources say.

 

[Savant]

Moyes out at West Ham and Alladyce out at Everton. Looking forward to them switching jobs next season.

 

[cgf]

After how much shit I gave Eintracht for employing Kovac long enough for Hoeneß to lose his mind completely, I have to tip my cap to them for this hire. I really liked the way Young Boys played under Hütter and was curious to see him move to a bigger league...he was actually lowkey the guy I wanted BMG to replace Hecking with when I was forcing myself to be realistic, and I was disappointed that Werder couldn't lure him to germany a year ago.

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

How can you bring in an inexperience coach at a club like Arsenal is beyond me. This ain't time to start trying shit out with someone that was a brutal captain and a mediocre player for Arsenal.

To me, if this goes down, it's just another bonehead decision made by a board that has no vision and will do whatever they can to save a buck.

I was really happy that my team was heading in another direction, just like when my Devils moved on from Lou Lamoriello, but they went after someone with experience instead of a rookie ex player. I would've been pissed if they would've hired Brodeur, for example.

Arsenal are turning into a joke is what it is.

 

[Chimaera]

I mean, you have to see how it plays out.

But once again, do you really think a first year manager, with no clout is going to be able to say, "look, you better provide me funds or else", or "I need this player, and not that player".

Arteta is just happy to have the job. He's not going to be able to go and demand things.

I'm sure he got a promise of some sort of backing, if that's the way they go, but I can't see this move as a good one. Odds and track record are certainly against it.

 

[Chimaera]

Are you dumb? You and your ilk are already proclaiming to be the only challengers to City next season while barely finishing 4th yet Arsenal is in midtable hell even though they had the 2nd best home record and only finished 6th due to an abysmal away record.

You have no proof they won't spend either.

They finished 6th because their roster is mediocre, they have a manager who has lost it years ago, and they can't compete with the clubs around them. Their record against the top 6 challengers is poor, and they don't have the squad to compete on all fronts anymore.

As for your consistent insults/personal attacks, you basically just troll around these parts. You can feel what you want, and say what you want, but the slights aren't needed. I'm going to put you on ignore, and I would encourage you to do the same for me.

 

[KJS14]

I doubt Arteta will have much responsibility for the transfers anyways. Mislintat, Sanllehi, and Gazidis will likely have most of the say on the players coming in. Arteta will be more of a coach than a full-on manager to start, which according to Pep, Wenger, and others he seems to have some promise.

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

I doubt Arteta will have much responsibility for the transfers anyways. Mislintat, Sanllehi, and Gazidis will likely have most of the say on the players coming in. Arteta will be more of a coach than a full-on manager to start, which according to Pep, Wenger, and others he seems to have some promise.

That's great and all but I don't understand how you can coach a team you didn't really put together yourself. If he does have a vision of what type of game his team should be playing, and he should, he should have his say in what type of players we sign.

He'll be the boards puppet and I can't see him ripping anyone in that lockeroom if things get heated. You need to earn your stripes in order to rip into your star players and that's basically the main reason why I think this will turn out real bad, real soon.

I can't see Arteta telling Ozil that he needs to give a better effort, on a more consistent basis. This is not a club where a coach get's to remove his training wheels, let alone get his first kick at the can.

 

[cgf]

Who cares that he’s inexperienced if he’s good? Nagelsmann is younger than Neuer, Khedira & Gomez, having just turned 30 last summer, and he’s been the best coach in Germany for two & a half seasons already

I’m not an Arsenal fan, but in general I’s rather gamble on someone promising but unproven like Arteta, than recycle someone who’s proven to not be that good like Ancelotti.

 

[cgf]

That's great and all but I don't understand how you can coach a team you didn't really put together yourself.

Coaches do that in literally every league except for the EPL...

 

[Chimaera]

He still will have some input in who to buy and who goes into his squad.

I agree that getting a promising manager is best, but it's not like they couldn't have gotten someone with some managerial experience.

Maybe Arteta is the guy. But my problem with that is I would rather have someone who has pulled something off as the man in charge somewhere, than someone who has been a fine number two. Arsenal is too big to be the laboratory for whether or not Arteta can cut it. It's also not like he's a 'club legend' or something.

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

Who cares that he’s inexperienced if he’s good? Nagelsmann is younger than Neuer, Khedira & Gomez, having just turned 30 last summer, and he’s been the best coach in Germany for two & a half seasons already

I’m not an Arsenal fan, but in general I’s rather gamble on someone promising but unproven like Arteta, than recycle someone who’s proven to not be that good like Ancelotti.

But Arteta isn't proven and who knows if he's good... he never managed anything in his life.

Anyways, having a ex player on his first coaching stint, for a "major club" just sounds like a disaster waiting to happen.

 

[cgf]

Who should they have gotten? They missed out on Tuchel, Nagelsmann is waiting for the Bayern job, Favre would never coach in London, and Sarri seems like he’s staying put as well.

They don’t have a great proven option, so they’re going to have to compromise on proveness or quality. And in that situation why would you ever compromise on quality instead of proveness? If not Arteta they’d be gambling on someone else or settling for some who’s worse than what they needed

 

[cgf]

But Arteta isn't proven and who knows if he's good... he never managed anything in his life.

Anyways, having a ex player on his first coaching stint, for a "major club" just sounds like a disaster waiting to happen.

Exactly, Arteta is not proven, so why wouldn’t you want him instead of someone who’s proven to not be good enough?

And plenty of excellent managers thrived in their first jobs, so that complaint doesn’t do much for me

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

Exactly, Arteta is not proven, so why wouldn’t you want him instead of someone who’s proven to not be good enough?

And plenty of excellent managers thrived in their first jobs, so that complaint doesn’t do much for me

Arsenal isn't a club where you give an unproven manager his first gig ever.

I can understand if that unproven coach was a legend of the club and demanded the respect of everyone in that lockeroom the second he puts foot in the stadium but Arteta isn't that player and he was a mediocre captain when he was here.

Anyways, he might be the solution but I doubt it very much.

 

[KJS14]

A lot of players at the club have previously said they hold/held a lot of respect for Arteta, so I don't see an issue in him "not being able to rip someone in the locker room. " If they wanted someone to rip on Ozil for no reason (because his criticism is generally wrong and he's a scapegoat), they would have made a dumb hiring like Allardyce. I'm not 100% convinced by Arteta, but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt until we actually see his performance.

Not sure how he was ever a mediocre captain (which several of you have said) when many players have a lot of respect for him. You don't have to be a great player to be a good captain, or manager for that matter.

 

[cgf]

Yeah I don’t get that point. Yes, he’ll have to be a successful man manager to be a successful manager. Even a hyper tactician like Nagelsmann acknowledges that that’s 70% of coaching. So yes, Arteta will need to be able to get his players to buy in...just like any other coach...

And what is this “Arsenal isn’t a club who...” bullshit? Arsenal are a club who haven’t been contenders for the league in damn near a decade and who need to be bold if they’re to avoid falling further behind. Nothing would cement their position as the least of the big 6 faster than a tepid hire like Ancelotti

 

[Chimaera]

Who should they have gotten? They missed out on Tuchel, Nagelsmann is waiting for the Bayern job, Favre would never coach in London, and Sarri seems like he’s staying put as well.

They don’t have a great proven option, so they’re going to have to compromise on proveness or quality. And in that situation why would you ever compromise on quality instead of proveness? If not Arteta they’d be gambling on someone else or settling for some who’s worse than what they needed

If those three were the best options, and none were willing to come to Arsenal at this point, maybe you appoint a guy who is a clear transitional figure. Get someone who can steward the team through their obvious rebuild needed, and then when your young upstart manager is available, you go get him.

I just have to wonder how much they're actually offering to some of the young options that are out there. I have to wonder whether the job is really that attractive.

I'm not up to date on who the flavor of the month is, or who particularly should be the manager of the day, but you have to think there's someone who they could have gotten if there were enough zeros on the page to hire them.

 

[Chimaera]

note, I concede the point that Arsenal are probably operating with the Sporting Director picking the players, and the manager operating more like a coach method, so Arteta might not screw things up that poorly, but I just wonder if taking a chance on him is the way to go.

At least Viera would have been a club legend and has some experience doing the whole bit.

 

[Savant]

note, I concede the point that Arsenal are probably operating with the Sporting Director picking the players, and the manager operating more like a coach method, so Arteta might not screw things up that poorly, but I just wonder if taking a chance on him is the way to go.

At least Viera would have been a club legend and has some experience doing the whole bit.

Arsenal called Vieira and Vieira said he thought they were putting him through the ringer. He didnt like that

 

[cgf]

note, I concede the point that Arsenal are probably operating with the Sporting Director picking the players, and the manager operating more like a coach method, so Arteta might not screw things up that poorly, but I just wonder if taking a chance on him is the way to go.

At least Viera would have been a club legend and has some experience doing the whole bit.

Why do people bring that up as if it matters at all? If a coach has good management skills then his playing career could have ended as a youth. If he doesn't, then he could be a multiple BdO winner & still lose the room. Arteta seems to have players' respect, and he's getting as great a tactical education as any first-time coach could ask for. So where does this assumption that he'll struggle any more than a proven caretaker would, come from? Arsenal needs to turn things around quickly or fall far behind the other top teams. Putzing around for a few years before making any real strides doesn't serve them at all.

 

[cgf]

Arsenal called Vieira and Vieira said he thought they were putting him through the ringer. He didnt like that

That's always a good sign for a novice coach, not liking anyone questioning you or making you work for an opportunity...

...sounds like they lucked out on that one.

 

[Chimaera]

I don't think his saying they put him through the ringer is a bad thing. He probably knows more than anyone else that he was just a token interview. Vieira being part of Arsenal's history does mean something. Sure, Arteta played for them, but he doesn't have the same respect or established credibility with supporters. If you're going to go for someone who is inexperienced (and they both are) then you're much better going with someone who might be able to get a bit more rope from the supporters before they're calling for their removal. There also is something to be said about the passion and knowing what the club means. Arteta knows a bit, and I think he'll treat it with some respect, but he doesn't have the same credibility.

If Klopp was to leave, I wouldn't want Steven Gerrard to be the manager of LFC. But at the same time, if it was Steven Gerrard or someone else who was inexperienced and basically had no management history, I would take Gerrard in a heartbeat. He knows what the club stands for, and while he might not be the best guy for the job, he also would do anything for this club. Being a legend, and knowing how close he's tied to it, I would at least be willing to give him a bit more of a chance.


And note, while I don't want to turn it into that debate, I do know there is still some stigma against some players ending up as managers. I don't think them not hiring him isn't completely related, but I do think it's something that the league needs to push for as they go forward. Obviously, the best manager option should get the job. But I do think there's a bit of a question on the fact that there's only Hughton in the EPL and barely any minority managers in the top 4 leagues in England and much of Europe in general. I do think there is some growth there that needs to occur at some point.