LW Patrik Laine (2016, 2nd, WPG) XIV

[Field of Dreams]

I actually think he would of made a much better defenseman than a forward, his skating wouldn't of been as detrimental since he has the size and reach.

Not sure if he has the IQ or vision to be an effective defenceman

 

[teravaineSAROS]

Not sure if he has the IQ or vision to be an effective defenceman

Wha? Yikes do people even watch games here. All you would've had to do is watch like even the first two shifts of Jets - Wild game. He was very defensively sound

 

[Joe MacMillan]

I'm entirely sure that there is a portion of posters on these Laine threads who will do anything to pile on the guy. These same people try to casually claim "just calling it like I see it". Well, if you are a hockey fan and watched the games there's no way to see Laine's skating as a detrimental unless you want to see it that way.

I know other rookies get the same hate, but not in the same amounts as Laine does. And it always, without a fault, comes from one source.

I think you're one of the level headed Laine fans around here but I am sorry, your opinion is not the be all end all. Laine's skating is a glaring weakness and that is me just calling it as I see it. You can disagree with me and that's fine but that doesn't make me unaware of his abilities or not understanding hockey. That is just a difference of opinion.

I've watched all his games and Laine is regularly unable to create space for himself with the puck as the opponent is able to close in quick on him and take away time and space. With better first few steps and more explosiveness in his strides he could gain the extra distance needed and his offensive game would improve. As pointed out, he has good top-end speed but lacks quickness in his strides. I said prior to the draft that he would need to improve his skating drastically to be an effective goal scorer 5v5, and his performance thus far has not given me a reason to change that stance.

Otherwise his game is fine and just needs a little tweaking. Naturally he lacks strength but is able to use his big body and long reach to his advantage pretty well. Once he fills into his body and gains more strength he will be very tough to contain.

 

[Trilliann]

I think you're one of the level headed Laine fans around here but I am sorry, your opinion is not the be all end all. Laine's skating is a glaring weakness and that is me just calling it as I see it. You can disagree with me and that's fine but that doesn't make me unaware of his abilities or not understanding hockey. That is just a difference of opinion.

I've watched all his games and Laine is regularly unable to create space for himself with the puck as the opponent is able to close in quick on him and take away time and space. With better first few steps and more explosiveness in his strides he could gain the extra distance needed and his offensive game would improve. As pointed out, he has good top-end speed but lacks quickness in his strides. I said prior to the draft that he would need to improve his skating drastically to be an effective goal scorer 5v5, and his performance thus far has not given me a reason to change that stance.

Otherwise his game is fine and just needs a little tweaking. Naturally he lacks strength but is able to use his big body and long reach to his advantage pretty well. Once he fills into his body and gains more strength he will be very tough to contain.

huh? As far as I know, pretty much every one here agrees with what you said about the first steps.

That wasn't really the point, it was about some very active posters here who are only trying to get a reaction ( and sadly succeed way too often). Even other Leafs fans are telling them to stop

 

[QnebO]

Not sure if he has the IQ or vision to be an effective defenceman

I see elite NHL GM written all over him. He'd turn any team into a dynasty.

 

[Joe MacMillan]

huh? As far as I know, pretty much every one here agrees with what you said about the first steps.

That wasn't really the point, it was about some very active posters here who are only trying to get a reaction ( and sadly succeed way too often). Even other Leafs fans are telling them to stop

And those weak first few steps are in my opinion "detrimental" contrary to what TAnnala suggested.

 

[Plural]

Yeah, he needs to work on his explosiveness. But that wasn't what the poster I was referring to talked about. I was just making a point on how a non-trivial amount of posters come in these threads (not exclusively Laine threads, but these Laine threads see it more than other players) with the clear cut agenda to stir up controversy.

I don't mind when people give legitimate critic. As you did. He needs to work on his explosiveness. I think his top-end speed is fine and after his 2-3 steps, his acceleration is passable. His edge-work needs to get better, but since he's such a big guy he can compensate some of that with his big reach and stick-work.

But can people actually say with a straight face that this Laine thread doesn't see more attempts to side-track the discussion and just simply give mindless jabs about the player compared to other high-end prospect/rookie threads? It's counter-productive and frustrating. There are people overrating Laine a lot. But that's just simply the nature of sports. You have favorites and you tend to give leeway to them more than other athletes. It's part of the nature of being a sports-fan. But when you intentionally decide to stir up the glass with negative comments and act all innocent, well I think it serves to be called out. It's not part of being a fan. It's just negative and counter-productive.

 

[Trilliann]

And those weak first few steps are in my opinion "detrimental" contrary to what TAnnala suggested.

??? That is your opinion and you made some very good points, nothing wrong with that.
Still not what it was about. It's the daily posts from certain people, posts that don't really have any other content but "hahaha he sucks"


Edit: but you probably don't spend a lot of time in this thread and most of it gets deleted pretty quickly these days, so you can't know

 

[Plural]

And those weak first few steps are in my opinion "detrimental" contrary to what TAnnala suggested.

Yeah, I should have been more clear. Obviously it's a legitimate critic to give. He's got work to do with his skating. My point was more towards the agenda behind giving that critic. Even if you have a point, it's one thing to bring out the point because you want to discuss about it. But if the agenda behind it is just simply raise havoc and controversy in this thread, why do it? Maybe I've gotten too sensitive to the issue in Laine threads? But it's been to blatant and obvious for months now, that a sizeable portion of posters come in this thread with the sole intention of piling on the guy and raising storm in the thread.

It's really frustrating and makes discussion almost impossible. Just because there's a way to be ass-hat without breaking the site rules, doesn't mean you can't be called on it.

I'm in no way addressing this to you. Just explaining where I'm coming from.

 

[Trilliann]

Yeah, I should have been more clear. Obviously it's a legitimate critic to give. He's got work to do with his skating. My point was more towards the agenda behind giving that critic. Even if you have a point, it's one thing to bring out the point because you want to discuss about it. But if the agenda behind it is just simply raise havoc and controversy in this thread, why do it? Maybe I've gotten too sensitive to the issue in Laine threads? But it's been to blatant and obvious for months now, that a sizeable portion of posters come in this thread with the sole intention of piling on the guy and raising storm in the thread.

It's really frustrating and makes discussion almost impossible. Just because there's a way to be ass-hat without breaking the site rules, doesn't mean you can't be called on it.

I'm in no way addressing this to you. Just explaining where I'm coming from.

this you put it so much better than I

they delete pages of that poop every day
And because it's all deleted,we look like raving lunatics over-reacting like this

 

[HockeyGuruPitka]

Does anyone have an assessment of how he played last night? I can see by posts that he isnt being used properly on the PP however he played 19:52 which is incredibly high for a forward. That has to be a good sign no?

 

[BB88]

huh? As far as I know, pretty much every one here agrees with what you said about the first steps.

That wasn't really the point, it was about some very active posters here who are only trying to get a reaction ( and sadly succeed way too often). Even other Leafs fans are telling them to stop

It's pretty frustrating that it happens in pretty much every page.

It also has to be pretty frustrating for Leafs fans who come here to honestly talk about Laine and his game, there are lot of Leafs posters I enjoy talking with.

Laine isn't perfect, he has his flaws, like his 1st step. But for rookie he's looked great so far.
I love it that he wants to play defense and learn to play defense, and is already throwing big hits out there.

Does anyone have an assessment of how he played last night? I can see by posts that he isnt being used properly on the PP however he played 19:52 which is incredibly high for a forward. That has to be a good sign no?

Last night the Scheifele line wasn't clicking at all, lot of the time Buff& Myers took desperate shots from the blueline trying to shoot through 3-4 players ignoring players on better spots.

You can trust Laine defensively already, that's why his icetime has been 1st line level. In the 1st 2 games he has driven possession at high rate but didn't do that so well last night, atleast feels like it.
90% of the time played on the 2nd powerplay where Myers acts as the shooter.

 

[Trilliann]

It's pretty frustrating that it happens in pretty much every page.

It also has to be pretty frustrating for Leafs fans who come here to honestly talk about Laine and his game, there are lot of Leafs posters I enjoy talking with.

Laine isn't perfect, he has his flaws, like his 1st step. But for rookie he's looked great so far.
I love it that he wants to play defense and learn to play defense, and is already throwing big hits out there.

I totally agree with the bolded! edit: and the rest too

As for Laine, I've been pleasantly surprised, he looks less rookie-ish than I expected.

 

[Joe MacMillan]

Fair enough. I didn't pay close attention to what others have been saying so maybe I misunderstood the post. My bad.

 

[Hokinaittii]

Interesting if we are going to see this much talk everytime Laine plays a mediocre game this season.

 

[thomast]

I think he had off game yesterday. Boston didn't give him any room just like they did to Matthews. Was extremely impressed by Carlo. He is one tough player to play against.

 

[TheFinnishTrap]

The 1st line created quite little in my viewings. Boston was quick to take any space away from them. Laine isn't used very well on the PP either. I fell asleep during the second period for a while, but up to that point I think Laine was given the puck in a shooting position ONCE. Part of it might be on him, but this game was pretty bad in that regard. Commenting on his skating I was honestly a bit shocked to see him blaze to full speed that quickly on that one rush. I'm not sure how he did it, but he seemed to go from like 20-30% to 100% very quickly. A somewhat slow Boston team might highlight it, but he seemed very fast on some plays, not just on his own scale.

 

[ijuka]

And those weak first few steps are in my opinion "detrimental"

Judging by what some of the Jets fans who've been watching the practice sessions live have said, that's doubtful.

 

[Gavy]

Like another poster in here said, Lain suffers from big man syndrome. It actually take a few times watching him to realize he actually is moving pretty fast.

He's a good skater who needs to work on his explosiveness.
I also hope he starts hitting more. He makes the type of hits that take energy to receive as he's jist so big and heavy.


Also, I think the reason so many come here to pile on Laine is because of the ridiculous expectations that some homers put on him before the season started and because some people said he should have gone 1OA.

 

[Joe MacMillan]

Judging by what some of the Jets fans who've been watching the practice sessions live have said, that's doubtful.

I'm not even talking about practice man, I am talking about the game. The actual game, when it matters.

 

[Hokinaittii]

Also, I think the reason so many come here to pile on Laine is because of the ridiculous expectations that some homers put on him before the season started and because some people said he should have gone 1OA.

And that's understandable for a while. After 10 games it gets pretty old when it's just the same old faces coming here and posting their lazy oneliners that adds nothing to the conversation.

I really doubt we would see many if any Jets fans jumping into your prospect's thread if he would be left pointless against Boston, everytime he has a mediocre game by his standards or when he makes a sloppy play that leads into goal.

 

[Kamiccolo]

And that's understandable for a while. After 10 games it gets pretty old when it's just the same old faces coming here and posting their lazy oneliners that adds nothing to the conversation.

I really doubt we would see many if any Jets fans jumping into your prospect's thread if he would be left pointless against Boston, everytime he has a mediocre game by his standards or when he makes a sloppy play that leads into goal.

I think it's a double edged sword but it's been three games.

His comparable who shall not be named was already used to small ice from previous years and learned to play on small ice. Laine will need time to adjust, I'm not convinced this is best spent in the NHL even if his other assets are NHL ready.

If at the end of the year he has 30 points or something after all the hype he had, then yes he deserves criticism IMO. Just as if the situations were reversed, the other guys would be called out as well.

 

[TheFinnishTrap]

I think it's a double edged sword but it's been three games.

His comparable who shall not be named was already used to small ice from previous years and learned to play on small ice. Laine will need time to adjust, I'm not convinced this is best spent in the NHL even if his other assets are NHL ready.

If at the end of the year he has 30 points or something after all the hype he had, then yes he deserves criticism IMO. Just as if the situations were reversed, the other guys would be called out as well.

Maybe it's not Laine who deserves to be criticised? If you want to discuss him, you can do so without always reflecting on Karjala-cap expectations, or expectations in the future. If you have a problem with some posters' expectations, you can just contact them directly.

Besides, he looks fairly comfortable already. I was expecting FAR more struggles considering how his skating has been downplayed, but he keeps up just fine. Doesnt fly like Wheeler, but can still outskate defenders on the rush and get back in time. Defensively he has taken a step ahead from last season, he uses his abilities more consistently. Offensively he still needs some time to figure out what works and what doesn't, but he seems to improve on that every game. At this point, AHL doesn't really offer much.

If at the end of the year he has 30 points, then so be it. I think that's better than Barkov. 40 points is the general expectation.

 

[UsernameWasTaken]

And that's understandable for a while. After 10 games it gets pretty old when it's just the same old faces coming here and posting their lazy oneliners that adds nothing to the conversation.

I really doubt we would see many if any Jets fans jumping into your prospect's thread if he would be left pointless against Boston, everytime he has a mediocre game by his standards or when he makes a sloppy play that leads into goal.

Agreed. It's the same individuals doing it all the time. It's incredibly tiresome. For people with such a lukewarm view of Laine, they certainly spend a lot of time posting about him.

From what I've seen, he's looked very good so far. He's looked stronger than I thought he would to start the season.

 

[ijuka]

I'm not even talking about practice man, I am talking about the game. The actual game, when it matters.

That makes no sense. A player's first steps are a player's first steps. There's no reason he shouldn't be able to do the same in a game.