Player Discussion Kris Knoblauch: Don’t Judge a Knob By Its Polish

[GOilers88]

Fully expect a Fire Knoblauch thread next season when the team goes on their annual winter slump and people are freaking out about not making the playoffs before the New Year.

 

[Stoneman89]

The historic PP propped this team up big time last year. They still had defensive issues but when you're pumping in a couple PP goals a game and cheating all over the ice, you can get away with it for a while until a team in the playoffs locks it down and then you're f***ed without stellar goaltending. That is a major difference this year, with teams scouting our PP and doing a better job of defending it with sticks and bodies, as well as us being our own worst enemy by not shooting enough. If our PP ever gets going a bit better (not to the historic pace) those 3-1 games will become 5-1, and we'll still have that excellent defensive structure and buy in, just in case the other teams goalie has a great game, or the breaks go against us.

Edit: I see K-man beat me to it with a somewhat similar explanation. Great minds.

 

[AM]

Most of the people that appear confident from the outset are self absorbed. They're the people that do really well in interviews but not necessarily in the jobs. Take somebody like Eakins. I recognized narcissist in first day.

People that are thoughtful tend not to be loud, sometimes are not initially forthright, and take their time settling in and giving answers. To give answers before knowing what the problems are is deceit.

Charlatans are the people that come across as full of chutzpah, they sell snake oil. You find this type on car lots. They'll smile the right way, say some things, they hit you up like its their first nature. You're not in the showroom for 5 secs and they're talking at you. I walk away from those types. They want their interests taken care of, not mine.

“Not initially forthright” you mean don’t jump to conclusions?

 

[Drivesaitl]

100% a part of it, but Ekholm was also on the team when bad habits re-emerged in the playoffs last year (speaks to Woodcroft's perpetual issues preparing the team for anything) before the wheels came off entirely this year.

Only difference between last year's start and this year's? McDavid and Drai lit it up last October/November/December and the power play was hot. Other than that the team was playing the same shitty brand of hockey two years in a row to start. If not for those two dragging the team to about .500 by around the start of 2023 we might be sitting here talking about Woodcroft being fired around this time last season. It's far from a first time occurrence, we just didn't have a redundancy (McDrai + PP) that made the coach look good kick in this time when everything else was bad.

Yet people had disputed my comments that Woodcroft has had poor starts to both seasons he has coached here. He's sub ,500 cumulatively in games prior to Xmas. Its only the PP and McDrai going supernova each back half that gave him a lofty win %. its undeniable the starts were poor. This season it got him fired.

22-23 season Team was 18-15-2 prior to Xmas. They were out of a playoff spot. This season 2-9-1 to start. Meaning Woodys cumulative record prior to Xmas in seasons was a pathetic 20-24-3. Thats a lottery club type pace.

 

[oXo Cube]

Fully expect a Fire Knoblauch thread next season when the team goes on their annual winter slump and people are freaking out about not making the playoffs before the New Year.

Guaranteed to happen.

This board is bipolar enough that it might happen earlier than next year if/when Skinner stops playing like a Vezina contender.

 

[GOilers88]

Yet people had disputed my comments that Woodcroft has had poor starts to both seasons he has coached here. He's sub ,500 cumulatively in games prior to Xmas. Its only the PP and McDrai going supernova each back half that gave him a lofty win %. its undeniable the starts were poor. This season it got him fired.

22-23 season Team was 18-15-2 prior to Xmas. They were out of a playoff spot. This season 2-9-1 to start. Meaning Woodys cumulative record prior to Xmas in seasons was a pathetic 20-24-3. Thats a lottery club type pace.

Being out of a playoff spot at Christmas really doesn't seem to mean much with this team. I don't know why people always freak out so early.

We see teams like the Bruins called paper tigers when they run roughshod over the league all year, but when the Oilers don't do that it's a total shitshow here because they haven't been running roughshod over the league all year.

 

[guymez]

This outlines the problem with Woodcroft. Never learned from mistakes, the same problems persisted. Shitty camp last year lead to a shitty camp this year. Shitty start last year lead to a shitty start this year. Didn't have the team prepared for any Game 1 ever. Team showed no signs at any point under him of truly maturing.

I agree with this.

Its a funny thing but when the Oilers beat the Flames in the playoffs and that shot of Woodcroft standing at the Flames bench with his hand on his hip went viral I thought that was very fitting.
Not for the reasons being projected at the time though that he was a Boss.
That pic for me represented a the look of a man with false bravado.
You can see it on his face...he really didnt own that pose.
It wasnt authentic.
That to me sums up his tenure as Head Coach. There was a veneer on the team under his reign. Similar to the veneer of Woody as a coach who couldnt put together a system worthy of a contending team. When things got tough (like they did when the team played Vegas) that veneer was stripped away.
The coach and the team was a Pretender.
Thats not to say that Woody wasnt a good coach...he is just not a coach that can propell a team to contender status. He needs more experience to work with systems IMO.

With Knoblauch there is no veneer....this team under his guidance is an authentic contender.
This is interesting to me because Knoblauch is a rookie NHL coach.
So that suggests that he has really refined his coaching (and systems) at multiple levels before getting to the NHL. Something that Woody wasnt able to do to the same extent.
It also suggests that not only is Knoblauch a better systems coach but that he also is a better communicator.

 

[AM]

Three straight years. Just going to keep saying it. They did it to Tippett, it got him fired, and most of you posted all the stupid flowery shit about Woodcroft and Manson and how amazing they were. They did it to Woodcroft last year, they came out of it and stormed the league. They outplayed the teams they were losing to, sometimes by a lot, and shot 6% and had a .870 save percentage in those first games. The man had an 18-2-1 record last spring going into the playoffs didn't suddenly coach them into that collapse.

In the winter, things go wrong and they squeeze their sticks and they lose everything. Three straight years, two different coaches. They've also gone on insane runs in three straight seasons, with two different coaches.

The coach change was a nice reset point, that's all. Knoblauch may be a better coach for the team overall in the end, and I'm grateful for that because I thought Woodcroft got his ass handed to him against Vegas, but it's still not the core issue. That issue is in the heads of 97, 29, 93, 25, etc.

It’s always the players. They are the ones playing. But players also respond to incentives and narrative. They have bought in to a more uptempo defense. Something we haven’t seen in a while. Is that coaching? Can’t say I’m not in the room.

 

[K1984]

I agree with this.

Its a funny thing but when the Oilers beat the Flames in the playoffs and that shot of Woodcroft standing at the Flames bench with his hand on his hip went viral I thought that was very fitting.
Not for the reasons being projected at the time though that he was a Boss.
That pic for me represented a the look of a man with false bravado.
You can see it on his face...he really didnt own that pose.
It wasnt authentic.
That to me sums up he tenure as Head Coach. There was a veneer on the team under his reign. Similar to the venneer of Woody as a coach who could put together a system worthy of a contending team. When things got tough (like they did when the team played Vegas) that veneer was stripped away.
The coach and the team was a Pretender.
Thats not to say that Woody wasnt a good coach...he is just not a coach that can propell a team to contender status. He needs more experience to work with systems IMO.

With Knoblauch there is no veneer....this team under his guidance is an authentic contender.
This is interesting to me because Knoblauch is a rookie NHL coach.
So that suggests that he has really refined his coaching (and systems) at multiple levels before getting to the NHL. Something that Woody wasnt able to do to the same extent.
It also suggests that not only is Knoblauch a better systems coach but that he also is a better communicator.

Agree with this.

This counts for literally nothing, but had you hooked a lie detector test up to me at any point in Woodcroft's tenure and asked me "are the Oilers going to win the cup this year" I only would have been truthful with a straight up "no," even though in my gut and my heart I hoped or thought that they could.

Now I wouldn't be lying if I said yes because we are actually consistently playing a championship style of hockey. Just pinning the success to goaltending is willfully ignoring the full picture IMO. Oilers have basically been unbeatable since Jan 1 2023 when they get goaltending (believe we're something like 56-1-2 now in games over .900 since then), but their style of play still wasn't commensurate with championship level hockey. Even with the goaltending the penalty killing was just average, the defending was just average, attention to detail was just average, etc. Goaltending (and scoring) made up for all of that, then as soon as one or the other went away the whole house crumbled. Now goaltending and at some point scoring are a supplement to all those things actually being done properly, which is a major shift in direction for this group and hasn't been seen at any point so far under any coach.

There is currently an unmatched level of redundancy in our game. If one thing goes wrong we are doing enough right elsewhere to cover it off for a period of time. In the past only one of the three pillars of the game (scoring, defending goaltending) would seem to ever be on at once. Having to cover up for any of the other two areas being bad is a ton to ask.

 

[guymez]

Agree with this.

This counts for literally nothing, but had you hooked a lie detector test up to me at any point in Woodcroft's tenure and asked me "are the Oilers going to win the cup this year" I only would have been truthful with a straight up "no," even though in my gut and my heart I hoped or thought that they could.

Now I wouldn't be lying if I said yes because we are actually consistently playing a championship style of hockey. Just pinning the success to goaltending is willfully ignoring the full picture IMO. Oilers have basically been unbeatable since Jan 1 2023 when they get goaltending (believe we're something like 56-1-2 now in games over .900 since then), but their style of play still wasn't commensurate with championship level hockey. Even with the goaltending the penalty killing was just average, the defending was just average, attention to detail was just average, etc. Goaltending (and scoring) made up for all of that, then as soon as one or the other went away the whole house crumbled. Now goaltending and at some point scoring are a supplement to all those things actually being done properly, which is a major shift in direction for this group and hasn't been seen at any point so far under any coach.

There is currently an unmatched level of redundancy in our game. If one thing goes wrong we are doing enough right elsewhere to cover it off for a period of time. In the past only one of the three pillars of the game (scoring, defending goaltending) would seem to ever be on at once. Having to cover up for any of the other two areas being bad is a ton to ask.

Completely agree and I would even highlight the Power play as the main driving factor in the teams success pre Knoblauch. The NHL's best PP (best in NHL history) covered up a lot of flaws.
The PP just outscored whatever details were lacking (system or otherwise) in their defensive game.

The bolded is extremely well put.
Very accurate way of framing this teams game right now.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Being out of a playoff spot at Christmas really doesn't seem to mean much with this team. I don't know why people always freak out so early.

We see teams like the Bruins called paper tigers when they run roughshod over the league all year, but when the Oilers don't do that it's a total shitshow here because they haven't been running roughshod over the league all year.

2-9-1 start was only running roughshod over the Oilers playoff chances and something had to be done. Even subsequently we find out Manson had just recently lost his wife to cancer. This was just before seasons start so that would undoubtedly make it hard for him to perform in his role at a top level of hockey while having just lost his significant other.

 

[elmeroil]

Fully expect a Fire Knoblauch thread next season when the team goes on their annual winter slump and people are freaking out about not making the playoffs before the New Year.

They might never lose again though!

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Fully expect a Fire Knoblauch thread next season when the team goes on their annual winter slump and people are freaking out about not making the playoffs before the New Year.

It is tradition

 

[MessierThanThou]

I'm happy to agree with some/all of this, but I think it was pretty clear that the problem on a more macro level was that Ekholm filled a gaping hole on the roster that was holding the team back from being a true contender.

Yeah...no. But good luck in your "Ekholm for Hart" campaign.

I don't know how much more evidence is needed to convince you that the coaching change had a deep effect on the team's success. This is a superhuman degree of stubbornness on your part.

 

[guymez]

Yeah...no. But good luck in your "Ekholm for Hart" campaign.

I don't know how much more evidence is needed to convince you that the coaching change had a deep effect on the team's success. This is a superhuman degree of stubbornness on your part.

I agree about the coaching but Ekholm was a major difference maker.
IMO his stellar play on D drove the team further than they probably deserved to go last season.

 

[MessierThanThou]

I agree about the coaching but Ekholm was a major difference maker.
IMO his stellar play on D drove the team further than they probably deserved to go last season.

I don't disagree with Ekholm being our defensive MVP and filling a major hole for us, I just disagree with that person's claim that Woodcroft would have the same results as KK.

 

[mkatcherin00]

Thank the lawwwwd for the Knob and Folgers coffee. Folgers Instant that is, as in instantly fixing our D and Knob instantly making this team feel like a team and have everybody play better D.

So far it's been 2+ months. Lets see how the team keeps playing. Feb is still considered an "easy" schedule. March and after it harder.

In the end, it's about direction and how the players follow and execute it. We will see if they falter out of this.

It could also be the that the boys got one big a** kick in their a**es and "smartened up" as well. Only took a whole bunch of coaches to do it.

 

[Satoru Gojo]

Obviously love what he's bringing, particularly with the improved defensive play and PK

My only concern is that he has never coached an NHL playoff game, and may have to go up against Cassidy or Bednar

That may not matter but just a thought

 

[Ol' Jase]

It’s pretty much speculation on my part, but Knoblauch strikes me as the player-friendly coach who isn’t actually friends with the players. I feel that might have been a weakness on Woodcroft’s part.

 

[tiger_80]

Did the Knob coach any team before? I remember they had some success with Krueger in Yakupov's first year only to ditch him later for the Swarm Defense Eakins, who was supposedly the next great thing. Knoblauch reminds me of Krueger somehow.

 

[guymez]

Did the Knob coach any team before? I remember they had some success with Krueger in Yakupov's first year only to ditch him later for the Swarm Defense Eakins, who was supposedly the next great thing. Knoblauch reminds me of Krueger somehow.

Krueger was all about player relationships and communications. I dont recall seeing much of anything in terms of solid systems.
Outside of their calm demeaner and strong player relationships I dont see many similarities between Krueger and Knoblauch.

 

[JordanGalhanth]

Krueger was all about player relationships and communications. I dont recall seeing much of anything in terms of solid systems.
Outside of their calm demeaner and strong player relationships I dont see many similarities between Krueger and Knoblauch.

This.

Krueger I think is what Woodcroft would've been had he been hired in the DoD.

 

[Matthew L Wilson]

Kris coached in Erie with the Otters for 4 years. He had four 50 win seasons there. McDavid, Brown, and Foegele all played for Erie. He also coached as an assistant for the Flyers, and then he coached Hartford in the AHL. He is a terrific coach. You folks are very lucky to have him.

 

[Stoneman89]

Krueger was all about player relationships and communications. I dont recall seeing much of anything in terms of solid systems.
Outside of their calm demeaner and strong player relationships I dont see many similarities between Krueger and Knoblauch.

I think Krueger would have made an excellent assistant coach in some capacity. His teams always had an excellent powerplay.

 

[guymez]

I think Krueger would have made an excellent assistant coach in some capacity. His teams always had an excellent powerplay.

I think that its fair to say that he would likely be a solid contributer to a coaching staff...I just wouldnt be in favor of him running the show.