Kane might be in legal trouble in Buffalo Pt II (verifiable sources only, no hearsay)

[ColinO]

This is never going to happen, but if the Blues offered Tarasenko with the Hawks eating the difference in salary, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

With some of the playmaking potential the Hawks have now (Panarin, TT, Dano), I don't think the Hawks would miss Kane as much as many here think they would (assuming a somewhat fair return). If teams are offering great packages I'd definitely listen. Kane isn't worth 10.5 million, and even less so with the off-ice idiocy.

For the same reason that you would trade Kane for Tarasenko (or presumably similar talents) in a heartbeat, the St. Louis' of the world decline the trade in a heartbeat.

If Chicago wants to trade Kane it's because he's more trouble off the ice than he is worth on it. They'll find very few trading partners in that circumstance. And would not likely get much of a return.

 

[BobbyJet]

I love the "showtime" antics on the ice. I hate the "showtime" antics off the ice.

His hot dogging on the ice is a direct reflection of his maturity (or lack thereof) off of it. He's not 21 anymore.

 

[madgoat33]

His hot dogging on the ice is a direct reflection of his maturity (or lack thereof) off of it. He's not 21 anymore.

Laughable. It's a new era, deal with it.

 

[hawksrule]

His hot dogging on the ice is a direct reflection of his maturity (or lack thereof) off of it. He's not 21 anymore.

That's silly. He can have fun on the ice and still be expected to act responsibly off of it. The showtime antics are a non-issue.

 

[blams]

Kane is in the midst of a very, very severe criminal investigation. I don't know if a team would trade for him until they KNOW he isn't getting charged.

 

[Sarava]

For the same reason that you would trade Kane for Tarasenko (or presumably similar talents) in a heartbeat, the St. Louis' of the world decline the trade in a heartbeat.

If Chicago wants to trade Kane it's because he's more trouble off the ice than he is worth on it. They'll find very few trading partners in that circumstance. And would not likely get much of a return.

Obviously Kane is not tradable at this point. The question might be - *if* he gets cleared of the rape accusations...like 6 months or a year later when the smoke is clearing or cleared, will he be unexpectedly traded then? His value would have mostly returned if that is the case.

 

[BroadwayJay*]

Kane is in the midst of a very, very severe criminal investigation.

I wonder what is still being investigated so severely that the local police lack the probable cause to effect an arrest.

Or is it your view that they have the probable cause to effect an arrest, but lack the will? Perhaps they feel he wouldn't commit another crime and so there is no need to get him off the street?

Does that make much sense?

Just dropping by again to remind folks that "rumor" is often espoused to change the facts on the ground. Example: I had a case where i was about to pick a jury in federal court. That morning, the US Attorney's Office issued a press release about a similar allegation on an unrelated case. The timeliness was certainly interesting because it had no timely purpose whatsoever, except to perhaps cause readers of the local papers to be thinking about the gravity of similar crimes.

This is indicative of the law enforcement behavior. They do run PR. They do it to influence public opinion and the opinions of individuals in ways that would be otherwise inadmissible.

This man has not been arrested nearly a month after the alleged incident. The complainant is known to the police. The alleged suspect is known to the police. If they have the requisite probable cause (an extremely low bar) why hasn't he been arrested?

The obvious answer is that they DO NOT have the requisite probable cause, presumably because of an issue with the credibility of the witness. Remember, a statement ALONE from the complaining witness is sufficient to establish probable cause.

Just keep this all in mind as we talk about "severity" of investigations.

 

[BobbyJet]

I wonder what is still being investigated so severely that the local police lack the probable cause to effect an arrest.

Or is it your view that they have the probable cause to effect an arrest, but lack the will? Perhaps they feel he wouldn't commit another crime and so there is no need to get him off the street?

Does that make much sense?

Just dropping by again to remind folks that "rumor" is often espoused to change the facts on the ground. Example: I had a case where i was about to pick a jury in federal court. That morning, the US Attorney's Office issued a press release about a similar allegation on an unrelated case. The timeliness was certainly interesting because it had no timely purpose whatsoever, except to perhaps cause readers of the local papers to be thinking about the gravity of similar crimes.

This is indicative of the law enforcement behavior. They do run PR. They do it to influence public opinion and the opinions of individuals in ways that would be otherwise inadmissible.

This man has not been arrested nearly a month after the alleged incident. The complainant is known to the police. The alleged suspect is known to the police. If they have the requisite probable cause (an extremely low bar) why hasn't he been arrested?

The obvious answer is that they DO NOT have the requisite probable cause, presumably because of an issue with the credibility of the witness. Remember, a statement ALONE from the complaining witness is sufficient to establish probable cause.

Just keep this all in mind as we talk about "severity" of investigations.

Your insight is appreciated. We are approaching one month since the alleged incident was first reported. From your experience, do you know why it takes month(s) for forensic results to come back (as we keep hearing)?

It certainly makes one wonder exactly what is being discussed behind closed doors in the interim.

 

[Periwinkle]

Just keep this all in mind as we talk about "severity" of investigations.

I would imagine the poster referred to the severity of the alleged crime. I don't know how it can be in any way disputed that rape is a severe crime.

For the other points you made, I'd like to refer back to my post and question in post #599, in case you missed it and wish to comment on it.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=106315743&postcount=599

 

[UsernameWasTaken]

I wonder what is still being investigated so severely that the local police lack the probable cause to effect an arrest.

Or is it your view that they have the probable cause to effect an arrest, but lack the will? Perhaps they feel he wouldn't commit another crime and so there is no need to get him off the street?

Does that make much sense?

Just dropping by again to remind folks that "rumor" is often espoused to change the facts on the ground. Example: I had a case where i was about to pick a jury in federal court. That morning, the US Attorney's Office issued a press release about a similar allegation on an unrelated case. The timeliness was certainly interesting because it had no timely purpose whatsoever, except to perhaps cause readers of the local papers to be thinking about the gravity of similar crimes.

This is indicative of the law enforcement behavior. They do run PR. They do it to influence public opinion and the opinions of individuals in ways that would be otherwise inadmissible.

This man has not been arrested nearly a month after the alleged incident. The complainant is known to the police. The alleged suspect is known to the police. If they have the requisite probable cause (an extremely low bar) why hasn't he been arrested?

The obvious answer is that they DO NOT have the requisite probable cause, presumably because of an issue with the credibility of the witness. Remember, a statement ALONE from the complaining witness is sufficient to establish probable cause.

Just keep this all in mind as we talk about "severity" of investigations.

Weird, these articles say it's not uncommon for these types of investigations to move slowly:

http://sabres.buffalonews.com/2015/...of-kane-rape-investigation-relatively-common/

http://www.buffalonews.com/city-reg...erstar-is-subject-of-rape-allegation-20150806

But perhaps they're wrong!

 

[x Tame Impala]

His hot dogging on the ice is a direct reflection of his maturity (or lack thereof) off of it. He's not 21 anymore.

No he's not. But he's still winning us cups, leading the team in scoring, and being an elite offensive talent so who cares?

 

[Callidusblackhawk]

His hot dogging on the ice is a direct reflection of his maturity (or lack thereof) off of it. He's not 21 anymore.

This might be the most curmudgeonly thing I've ever read.

 

[19VJ17]

This man has not been arrested nearly a month after the alleged incident. The complainant is known to the police. The alleged suspect is known to the police.

Sorry didn't read anything about the complainant having a history with the police. Do you have a link???

 

[HockeySauce]

Sorry didn't read anything about the complainant having a history with the police. Do you have a link???

He means both parties are known by the police; they aren't searching for a suspect or tracking down a witness.

 

[MTP]

Sorry didn't read anything about the complainant having a history with the police. Do you have a link???

That's not at all what he meant.

 

[19VJ17]

He means both parties are known by the police; they aren't searching for a suspect or tracking down a witness.

That's not at all what he meant.

Thanks for clearing that up for me

 

[archimet]

I wonder what is still being investigated so severely that the local police lack the probable cause to effect an arrest.

Or is it your view that they have the probable cause to effect an arrest, but lack the will? Perhaps they feel he wouldn't commit another crime and so there is no need to get him off the street?

Does that make much sense?

Just dropping by again to remind folks that "rumor" is often espoused to change the facts on the ground. Example: I had a case where i was about to pick a jury in federal court. That morning, the US Attorney's Office issued a press release about a similar allegation on an unrelated case. The timeliness was certainly interesting because it had no timely purpose whatsoever, except to perhaps cause readers of the local papers to be thinking about the gravity of similar crimes.

This is indicative of the law enforcement behavior. They do run PR. They do it to influence public opinion and the opinions of individuals in ways that would be otherwise inadmissible.

This man has not been arrested nearly a month after the alleged incident. The complainant is known to the police. The alleged suspect is known to the police. If they have the requisite probable cause (an extremely low bar) why hasn't he been arrested?

The obvious answer is that they DO NOT have the requisite probable cause, presumably because of an issue with the credibility of the witness. Remember, a statement ALONE from the complaining witness is sufficient to establish probable cause.

Just keep this all in mind as we talk about "severity" of investigations.

Also keep in mind that while the threshold for an arrest is extremely low, that's only part of the story. DA's are most often very reluctant to proceed until they believe they have sufficient evidence to win in court... especially in high profile cases. That's particularly difficult to achieve in the majority of rape cases because of the nature of the crime. I wouldn't read much into the fact that Patrick Kane has not been arrested. The bottom line is there's simply not enough public information to have the foggiest idea what's going on. Virtually everything at this point is speculation or opinion.

 

[DPHawk]

His hot dogging on the ice is a direct reflection of his maturity (or lack thereof) off of it. He's not 21 anymore.

Yes, I also hate fun.

 

[SAADfather]

I personally love Kaner's on ice showtime antics. The guy gets excited when he scores goals. Scoring goals is fun and you can just tell how much fire he has for this game. That dagger through the heart celly that was posted is one of my favorites and its very often imitated in minor hockey now.

 

[Easton Modano Curve]

I wonder what is still being investigated so severely that the local police lack the probable cause to effect an arrest.

Or is it your view that they have the probable cause to effect an arrest, but lack the will? Perhaps they feel he wouldn't commit another crime and so there is no need to get him off the street?

Does that make much sense?

Just dropping by again to remind folks that "rumor" is often espoused to change the facts on the ground. Example: I had a case where i was about to pick a jury in federal court. That morning, the US Attorney's Office issued a press release about a similar allegation on an unrelated case. The timeliness was certainly interesting because it had no timely purpose whatsoever, except to perhaps cause readers of the local papers to be thinking about the gravity of similar crimes.

This is indicative of the law enforcement behavior. They do run PR. They do it to influence public opinion and the opinions of individuals in ways that would be otherwise inadmissible.

This man has not been arrested nearly a month after the alleged incident. The complainant is known to the police. The alleged suspect is known to the police. If they have the requisite probable cause (an extremely low bar) why hasn't he been arrested?

The obvious answer is that they DO NOT have the requisite probable cause, presumably because of an issue with the credibility of the witness. Remember, a statement ALONE from the complaining witness is sufficient to establish probable cause.

Just keep this all in mind as we talk about "severity" of investigations.

Blah, blah, blah. Another speculative post. We will all find out soon enough where this case goes when the police talk.

 

[JaegerDice]

just wonder...

Kane for Malkin with some tweaks added. Would you do it?

Yes, immediately.

But the Pens would never make that trade, even if Kane weren't being investigated.

 

[BroadwayJay*]

Your insight is appreciated. We are approaching one month since the alleged incident was first reported. From your experience, do you know why it takes month(s) for forensic results to come back (as we keep hearing)?

It certainly makes one wonder exactly what is being discussed behind closed doors in the interim.

There is always major backlog at the DNA analysis labs.

I'm on my phone so forgive my brevity. There is no need for forensics. Is there a question that they had sex? Tearing and trauma does not require sending out to the lab.

 

[BroadwayJay*]

I would imagine the poster referred to the severity of the alleged crime. I don't know how it can be in any way disputed that rape is a severe crime.

For the other points you made, I'd like to refer back to my post and question in post #599, in case you missed it and wish to comment on it.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=106315743&postcount=599

Just ask your question again, I'm on my phone.

 

[BroadwayJay*]

Sorry didn't read anything about the complainant having a history with the police. Do you have a link???

The complainant is not in the wind. They know who she is. That's what I meant.

 

[BroadwayJay*]

Also keep in mind that while the threshold for an arrest is extremely low, that's only part of the story. DA's are most often very reluctant to proceed until they believe they have sufficient evidence to win in court... especially in high profile cases. That's particularly difficult to achieve in the majority of rape cases because of the nature of the crime. I wouldn't read much into the fact that Patrick Kane has not been arrested. The bottom line is there's simply not enough public information to have the foggiest idea what's going on. Virtually everything at this point is speculation or opinion.

I couldn't disagree with you more.

I practice criminal defense in New York, but not Buffalo. Maybe your experience is closer, but my experience is that you're way off base.