Confirmed with Link: Jordan Subban traded for Nic Dowd

[looseneditforyou]

Pretty much shows how bad the Canucks talent pool is.

Yes subban made the all star game, but the comets were putrid that season, Chaput and Megna were up. There wasn't much to choose from. Most here in Utica were left scratching their head when they selected him..... You guys act like he was a shooting in selection when in reality he was selected based on points on a horrible team.....

The Canucks' prospect pool is universally regarded as above average, and the best prospect in it is at this moment considered the best player outside the NHL. What you've said is simply incorrect.

 

[Megaterio Llamas]

The Canucks' prospect pool is universally regarded as above average, and the best prospect in it is at this moment considered the best player outside the NHL. What you've said is simply incorrect.

Yes, but it just doesn't extend down to Utica unfortunately for Comets fans. Maybe next year eh.

 

[go comets]

The Canucks' prospect pool is universally regarded as above average, and the best prospect in it is at this moment considered the best player outside the NHL. What you've said is simply incorrect.

If their prospect pool was that deep a inept defensive Fringe prospect who reguarly is a healthy scratch would not be listed In The top ten.....

 

[M2Beezy]

Add-in Adrian Aucoin (another 5th round selection) - over 1100 NHL game career.

The immortal Robert Kron (1985 5th round draft class) - over 770 NHL game career.

Selke trophy WINNER Dirk Graham (1979 5th round draft class).

And who the **** can forget this other 5th round pick - GINO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Well that explains the username of one of the posters here

 

[M2Beezy]

If their prospect pool was that deep a inept defensive Fringe prospect who reguarly is a healthy scratch would not be listed In The top ten.....

Shouldnt of been. At the start of the year top ten prospects should of been:

Boeser
Pettersson
Gaudette
Demko
Dahlen
Lockwood
Juolevi
Lind
Gad
Mceneneny
Dipietro
Palmu
Mckenzie
Etc

 

[Nucker101]

Really not seeing an issue with this deal. It makes a couple of Benning's previous deals look worse but looking at this trade by itself, it's fine.

Subban was still being healthy scratched in the AHL just last year. He's a long shot to ever become a NHL regular at this point.

Dowd has some positive review from Kings fans and when I watched him in the AHL he looked like a dangerous playmaker who wasn't afraid to throw a hit. His shot is weak, but I could see his passing skills and vision translating a bit into the NHL.

 

[looseneditforyou]

The NHL's Best Farm Systems in 2017: A 1-31 Ranking

From Reddit: NHL Prospect Pools Ranked

2017 Organizational Prospects Rankings

TSP: NHL Organizational Prospect Pool Rankings Top 10

According to most sources, the Canucks' prospect pool is around 7th-9th, and the lowest ranking I could find anywhere is 12th. And this is before 3-4 of the team's prospects blew up this season and last year's 1st rounder posted a historic season in the SHL and entered conversations about the best player from that draft/outside the league.

 

[infinitemile]

Really not seeing an issue with this deal. It makes a couple of Benning's previous deals look worse but looking at this trade by itself, it's fine.

Subban was still being healthy scratched in the AHL just last year. He's a long shot to ever become a NHL regular at this point.

Dowd has some positive review from Kings fans and when I watched him in the AHL he looked like a dangerous playmaker who wasn't afraid to throw a hit. His shot is weak, but I could see his passing skills and vision translating a bit into the NHL.

This trade is atrocious because Benning shouldn't be trying to acquire more depth forwards. We have enough. We need picks for this draft. And instead of trading for picks he acquired a meat and potatoes forward which we could have picked up on waivers a la Boll who's on waivers right f***ing now. So exasperating.

 

[StreetHawk]

Really not seeing an issue with this deal. It makes a couple of Benning's previous deals look worse but looking at this trade by itself, it's fine.

Subban was still being healthy scratched in the AHL just last year. He's a long shot to ever become a NHL regular at this point.

No issue moving on from Subban either. Rather just get a late round draft pick instead than a borderline fringe NHL/AHL tweener.

Subban, his positives simply don't outweigh the negatives when it comes to becoming an NHL player.

He can QB a PP, but how many PP's do the Canucks get? Last season, they had 227 chances, which is 2.8 per game, so under 6 minutes of PP time a game. They don't have the speed to draw penalties.

So, can Subban give you 12 minutes of ES play? Cause the Canucks 1st unit D can play 24-25 minutes if it's Edler/Tanev. But, then it drops down to 20 minutes when you get to the rest of the group. Leaving the last pair to handle 15-16 minutes. So, if Subban can't carry his weight at ES, then that adds more ice time to the other guys on the right side and they are probably stretched as far as they can if Tanev get 24/25 minutes and either Stecher/Gudbranson gets 20. They don't have the horses to compensate. In the 2015 playoffs, the Blackhawk's 5-6 D played under 10 minutes a game. Leaving Keith to play almost 30 minutes, while the other 3 played 25-26 each.

In camp this year, Subban was winded during the hard skating drills to kick off camp. And Green criticized his passing. That's not good for an undersized PP QB is it?

 

[ProstheticConscience]

This trade is atrocious because Benning shouldn't be trying to acquire more depth forwards. We have enough. We need picks for this draft. And instead of trading for picks he acquired a meat and potatoes forward which we could have picked up on waivers a la Boll who's on waivers right ****ing now. So exasperating.

Oh yeah. Boll was put on waivers pretty much right after this deal, so if Benning had waited a bit we could have added someone with genuine toughness without losing someone on our AHL team.

D'oh.

 

[StreetHawk]

Oh yeah. Boll was put on waivers pretty much right after this deal, so if Benning had waited a bit we could have added someone with genuine toughness without losing someone on our AHL team.

D'oh.

Sure be nice to be psychic.

Pickard cleared waivers then the knights traded him to the leafs. A week later they start losing their goalies.

 

[Bleach Clean]

The NHL's Best Farm Systems in 2017: A 1-31 Ranking

From Reddit: NHL Prospect Pools Ranked

2017 Organizational Prospects Rankings

TSP: NHL Organizational Prospect Pool Rankings Top 10

According to most sources, the Canucks' prospect pool is around 7th-9th, and the lowest ranking I could find anywhere is 12th. And this is before 3-4 of the team's prospects blew up this season and last year's 1st rounder posted a historic season in the SHL and entered conversations about the best player from that draft/outside the league.

From "the best prospect in it is at this moment considered the best player outside the NHL" to "ENTERED conversations about the best player outside the league". Hmmm... from considered the best to entered conversations about being the best. Not the same thing is it?

Anyways, what you're saying only means anything if you think A)Lists are predictive of talent pool conversion and B) Bad teams usually don't finish high on these lists and C) An average GM would not have produced the same results per the draft. Are you saying any of these things? Because if not, it comes as no surprise that a team that has picked in the top 6 in 3 of the last 4 years is regarded as having a good talent base. It stands to reason that it would. The key qualifier being: Would it have been there regardless of Jim Benning running the draft?

If you want to make that case, I'd love to see you try.


Edit: Reddit has STL going from 23rd to 8th rank in 1 year... crazy.

 

[looseneditforyou]

From "the best prospect in it is at this moment considered the best player outside the NHL" to "ENTERED conversations about the best player outside the league". Hmmm... from considered the best to entered conversations about being the best. Not the same thing is it?

Anyways, what you're saying only means anything if you think A)Lists are predictive of talent pool conversion and B) Bad teams usually don't finish high on these lists and C) An average GM would not have produced the same results per the draft. Are you saying any of these things? Because if not, it comes as no surprise that a team that has picked in the top 6 in 3 of the last 4 years is regarded as having a good talent base. It stands to reason that it would. The key qualifier being: Would it have been there regardless of Jim Benning running the draft?

If you want to make that case, I'd love to see you try.


Edit: Reddit has STL going from 23rd to 8th rank in 1 year... crazy.

You poor, poor man.

 

[VanJack]

From a Kings standpoint, this trade is much like the Pouliot deal in Pittsburgh....they knew if they put these guys on waivers they'd like lose them for nothing....so getting Subban and Pedan as defensive depth for the farm team at least made more sense. Dowd is a UFA on July 1st and Subban is an RFA. I'd be willing to wager that both guys will be UFA's eventually and looking for new teams.

 

[Bleach Clean]

From a Kings standpoint, this trade is much like the Pouliot deal in Pittsburgh....they knew if they put these guys on waivers they'd like lose them for nothing....so getting Subban and Pedan as defensive depth for the farm team at least made more sense. Dowd is a UFA on July 1st and Subban is an RFA. I'd be willing to wager that both guys will be UFA's eventually and looking for new teams.

Kings took a flyer on a particular skill set and lost potential waiver fodder to get it. They delayed the timeline on an asset, essentially. Good management.

@looseneditforyou About what I expected as far as a rebuttal. If you could post anything of relevance in response, anything, I'd love to see it. And I would be more than happy to debate/critique it.

 

[ProstheticConscience]

Sure be nice to be psychic.

Pickard cleared waivers then the knights traded him to the leafs. A week later they start losing their goalies.

I never said it was Benning's fault that happened. It just sucked the way the timing worked out.

 

[F A N]

Kings took a flyer on a particular skill set and lost potential waiver fodder to get it. They delayed the timeline on an asset, essentially. Good management.

Isn't it good management as well to get a serviceable NHL player for a player who is never going to be an NHL player by management's estimation?

The fact is that Subban will be eligible for waivers next season. Unless you think he's going to take the next step and crack the NHL next season, "waivers status" is irrelevant.

The players involved in the trade have little to no value. It's kind of stupid to use this trade as an example of good or bad management IMO.

 

[krutovsdonut]

You have one word in your post that is never used by Comets fan base when tlaking about what Benning will do "OBVIOUSLY". So many things that seem so obvious never happen.

"Obviously" you are assuming no other forwards will be hurt until Horvat returns.

The Canucks only have 7 D-men available at the moment and thus can carry 14 forwards. You count then up. Even with Chaput and Dowd there's 14. Obviously they don't have to return Chaput at all unless they want to.

Demko up once again for cap reasons. No other comet fills that bill who can hurt the comets less than Demko? "Obviously" there are but he keeps taking Thatcher for that purpose. There are a bunch of guys on the Comets that fit that need, but he needlessly takes the most important Comet. If they played him, no problem, but they haven't and likely won't.

lol. you were right.

 

[Melvin]

"best farm system" is an absolutely meaningless distinction.

 

[Hit the post]

lol. you were right.

Obviously.

 

[VanJack]

After watching Nic Dowd for two games and knowing the penchant for the Canucks pro scouting department to trade for plugs, starting to get a sinking feeling....I know Subban wouldn't have played in Vancouver anyway, but is this Dowd guy the second coming of Joseph Cramarossa?

 

[Megaterio Llamas]

After watching Nic Dowd for two games and knowing the penchant for the Canucks pro scouting department to trade for plugs, starting to get a sinking feeling....I know Subban wouldn't have played in Vancouver anyway, but is this Dowd guy the second coming of Joseph Cramarossa?

You could argue he is Cramarossa without the toughness and the foot speed. He has one ugly skating stride and seems not to possess an aggressive bone in his body. He'd likely be a better fit in Utica than Subban was but he isn't down there is he. And if previous acquisitions of seeming AHL material are any indication, Uticans shouldn't hold their breath waiting for him to get there.

 

[Harry Rag]

We traded a minor leaguer for an NHLer - that's a clear win. Benning strikes again.

 

[PG Canuck]

Dowd is just another form of Megna. He will be gone come July.

 

[DFAC]

Really not seeing an issue with this deal. It makes a couple of Benning's previous deals look worse but looking at this trade by itself, it's fine.

Subban was still being healthy scratched in the AHL just last year. He's a long shot to ever become a NHL regular at this point.

Dowd has some positive review from Kings fans and when I watched him in the AHL he looked like a dangerous playmaker who wasn't afraid to throw a hit. His shot is weak, but I could see his passing skills and vision translating a bit into the NHL.

People will always find something to complain about. Subban was nothing special, he was never going to make the NHL. His defensive game was simply too weak