Confirmed with Link: Jordan Subban traded for Nic Dowd

[Burke's Evil Spirit]

A lot of cap room opening up but man does the free agent pool suck.

 

[Bad Goalie]

Subban when he was good he could lift you outta your seat.... But unfortunately when he's bad, the puck ended up in his own net.... He would have a couple good games last year under Green, then start making mistakes.. eventually he would not dress for a couple games and first game back he would be solid, then tail off, get benched, not dress and the cycle continued........ consistency just wasn't there......

Bad part about another center is that whomever gets sent down eventually is a vet... Which we have too many of already......

This a point I have to contend with you. Jordan was injured for a spell, was also in Vancouver for a spell. Games were played in those periods that he missed. I'm not going to take the extensive time it would take me to find the exact number, but I did this not long ago and the number of actual healthy scratches was 4. He played 65 games + 4+69. So the games injured and in Vancouver = 7. His injuries were booboos that cost a game or 2 and he was back in. It might have seemed like he was scratched, but he was not.

Cull HAD been scratching him. 4 times in 7 games at one point and gave him 0 1st unit PP time right from the get-go. This was a plan from the beginning. Did anyone even see him in the well during games since his injury against Bridgeport on Dec 1st. Was he traded while injured? That's a rare event. He didn't practice up to Wednesday's game. Traded on Thursday.

 

[Bad Goalie]

At least the Comets probably gain a center when Bo returns to the lineup (or whoever gets sent down). What did the Comets get when their leading goal scorer was dealt? Nothing.

I like that you used probably. If the guy intended for Utica is snapped up from the waivers list they get nothing once again. That happened in the Etem trade. the Comets lost Jensen and then when Etem was once again placed on waivers to be assigned to Utica he was claimed and Utica got nothing. They could be 0/3 if it happens again.

 

[Bad Goalie]

Aren't you a vancouver fan too?

Absolutely. And your point?

 

[WTG]

What site did look at for Subban GF% rel? Can you send a link?

Canucks Army Pre-Season Prospect Rankings: #9 Jordan Subban

Pretty sure it's not public data but still.

 

[WTG]

"made the all-star team a year prior, struggling this year."
Look, I know you follow the Comets probably as closely as any Vancouver fan. You know what Subban has done offensively and it's verfy good by AHL standards. He was 4th in the league last seasson in goals and #17 in points. in a league with 30 teams playing 6 D-men a night those are impressive #s and i don't put any merit in posters talking about how his numbers were "meh". Those people are not AHL followers.

You also posted the Gf% stat that placed him #1 in the league.

Small correction, highest on the defense in Utica. Not league.

It was clear from every single training camp that Benning was never going to put Subban in the Canucks plans. He never played as much as a single preseason game until this year when the Canucks were in China. he wouldn't have played one this season if not for that fact.

I have been one of the hardest critics on jordan's D-game and have argued with you about it on more than one occasion. I have, however, touted his offensive skill set. Those skills cannot be denied. As "orcatown" has also stated in his game reviews, Jordan's D-game had gained strength by the end of last season and he always comes out early needing a kick in the ass to remind him to play D first and would result in a couple early scratches and that would be it. He was never going to be a steady D-man, but he could become livable if his offense made up for an occasional blunder. He would have to be paired with a darned good defensive D-man which the Comets didn't have this season whenever Wiercioch was out of town. It would help if the forward line he was out with was very offensive as well meaning most of their ice time would be spent in the other end against the other team's more defensive minded players.


With Benning writing him off and pushing his new acquisitions Chatfield, Brisebois, and Holm, cull had placed Jordan on the backburner for no apparent reason. Contrary to what posters who never watched him said, he had not regressed. he was not being played. he did not regress onthe PP, he was never used in the first place. His numbers are down because he wasn't givenan offensive opportunity. He was also played a lot with poor froward groupings meaning the offense would not be there. he was often the only guy in the five on the ice who actually carried the puck up the ice when one of his 5some could actually gain possession of the puck and was able to maneuver the puck into the offensive zone and create a scoring opportunity.

Call me a conspiracy advocate, but it sure looked like the orders from on high were to play the new guys. So Wiercioch, Holm, Brisebois, and Chatfield were automatics and McEneny and Sautner got the nod ahead of Jordan and Sautner was not a better d-man than Subban the last 2 seasons. Jordan was being phased right out of the picture and the debacles in front of Demko and Bachman have taken place every single game regardless of the final score. At it's best this is not a solid D-corps and the team as whole rates very low defensively. Thatcher has kept the stats respectable, not the team in front of him and he has been bombarded on most nights and some of those nights he has collapsed under the onslaught as well. To even hint at the fact that Subban's D-game has been a reason for the Comets defensive failures is ludcrous. The team wears a huge "POOR D" t-shirt under their Jerseys.

Do I make any sense to you based on what you have seen?

Makes perfect sense, but I cannot go deep into this with you. I will bow out here and say that I haven't been keeping up with the AHL too closely this year, only caught a few games here and there. I definitely see that Benning wanted nothing to do with Subban, he barely got a contract to begin with. Subban was never the problem with Utica as you say, it's always come down to the lack of good veterans that this team can mix around with the rookies.

You're hypothesis about them trying to push Subban out of the system is very likely to be correct.

I also do not see how this improves Utica... To me, it makes them worse, not better. Chaput is simply not the right veteran to have down here, they should have seen this. But what the hell, I'm not even phased by this trade, despite all that effort I spent defending him. We all knew this was coming, I think that's why so many people suddenly have become experts in his play. People who have probably never watched an AHL game in their live suddenly become experts saying that he "sucked". And that this will somehow HELP Utica because Chaput can be sent back down again. I've seen it all. On Twitter I even had someone say he wasn't a prospect at all! Crazy stuff, all these experts I never knew about who are somehow experts in the field of how Jordan played in the AHL.

 

[BenningHurtsMySoul]

A lot of cap room opening up but man does the free agent pool suck.

Tavares is the only star player available. Dude is gonna get paaaaaid

 

[go comets]

Canucks Army Pre-Season Prospect Rankings: #9 Jordan Subban

Pretty sure it's not public data but still.

Pretty much shows how bad the Canucks talent pool is.

Yes subban made the all star game, but the comets were putrid that season, Chaput and Megna were up. There wasn't much to choose from. Most here in Utica were left scratching their head when they selected him..... You guys act like he was a shooting in selection when in reality he was selected based on points on a horrible team.....

 

[clunk]

Tavares is the only star player available. Dude is gonna get paaaaaid

He's gonna get max contract 100%.

 

[Blade Paradigm]

I did a double-take after reading "Vancouver trades Subban for Dowd."


I thought, "Dowd's been retired for 10 years!"

 

[Bad Goalie]

Pretty much shows how bad the Canucks talent pool is.

Yes subban made the all star game, but the comets were putrid that season, Chaput and Megna were up. There wasn't much to choose from. Most here in Utica were left scratching their head when they selected him..... You guys act like he was a shooting in selection when in reality he was selected based on points on a horrible team.....

You would be correct, but he was the best they had. That doesn't make him chicken ****. I have advocated his trade and am on record saying his chances at the NHL are nil if he doesn't fix his defensive game.

However on the current Comets squad he is still top six and the comets will really see what his contribution to their offense was when you subtract his 35+ points from the defense's scoring totals.

Last season the Comets defense scored 35 total goals and he had 16 of them. This season the D has amassed 7 goals and Wiercioch has 4 of them and only 3 D-men have actually scored a goal. Subban had most often been put on the ice with 4 weak offensive players. is PP time ended up being with the third line and an extra D-man, not the PP units that Holm, Wiercioch, and even Brisebois got to play with. His decline in offensive production was directly related to how he was deployed by Cull. He was set up to fail, whereas Green set him up to succeed and did not attach a leash to his offensive creativity. However, Green still held him accountable for his defensive responsibilities and he got into the dog house when he failed to hold up his end of the bargain.

So, I agree trading Subban with the plans they had for him (or lack thereof) was something that should have been explored. A non veteran AHL reputable center would have been my mission. I don't believe Benning acquired Dowd for that purpose and I don't believe he wishes to part with Burmistrov either. I do think he finds himself in a pickle when the BO and Sutter return, but I'm betting the injury parade in Vancouver will continue and there will be room for both Dowd abd Burmi for most of the season. If not, I like the chance that his choice gets scooped off waivers and the Comets are left empty shopping in the ECHL like with Jensen and Shinkaruk.

 

[Dab]

Pretty dumb trade.

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

Only on this board where a nothing trade thread can be active for days

 

[Bitz and Bites]

Only on this board where a nothing trade thread can be active for days

Just wait until Subban puts up a multi point game in Ontario or Dowd misses his coverage or loses a puck battle.It's gonna be another Shinkaruk vs Granlund epic thread.

 

[NoShowWilly]

Canucks streak of 4th round picks failing continues. 30 years.

 

[Bad Goalie]

Canucks streak of 4th round picks failing continues. 30 years.

Probably a good reason not to be trading away 2nd and 3rds, eh?

 

[thepuckmonster]

Aren't you a vancouver fan too?

Rangers fan but die hard + loyal to Utica

 

[LeftCoast]

Canucks streak of 4th round picks failing continues. 30 years.

But hey, they got Gaudette, Forsling, Hutton, Corrado and Bieksa in the 5th round, so they must be great drafters?

I think you could say the same for just about any team. 4th round and later are always long shots.

 

[David Bruce Banner]

Maybe Dowd and Virtanen will have some chemistry... Dowd sounds like the kind of center Virtanen needs. The dollar store version, anyway.

 

[NoShowWilly]

But hey, they got Gaudette, Forsling, Hutton, Corrado and Bieksa in the 5th round, so they must be great drafters?

I think you could say the same for just about any team. 4th round and later are always long shots.

It is something I noticed looking at Canucks draft history. Thought it was funny.

 

[VanJack]

Canucks streak of 4th round picks failing continues. 30 years.

And Cole Cassels was selected one round before Subban, and he's fared even worse....might have had something to do with the guys doing the drafting.

 

[beachcomber]

The simple fact with Subban is that he wasn't good enough to make the Canucks. He had been passed on the depth charts. Hutton wasn't one of "Benning's boys" yet here he is in the bigs so that narrative can go out the window.

 

[Bleach Clean]

The simple fact with Subban is that he wasn't good enough to make the Canucks. He had been passed on the depth charts. Hutton wasn't one of "Benning's boys" yet here he is in the bigs so that narrative can go out the window.

We'll see what happens with Hutton this offseason.

So the simple fact was that Subban wasn't good enough secure a spot on the Canucks? Ok. Is Dowd good enough to secure a spot with the team? I'm not talking as a spare forward. I'm talking about a persistent 4C that is playing here beyond this season? What are your thoughts?

 

[Hit the post]

But hey, they got Gaudette, Forsling, Hutton, Corrado and Bieksa in the 5th round, so they must be great drafters?

I think you could say the same for just about any team. 4th round and later are always long shots.

Add-in Adrian Aucoin (another 5th round selection) - over 1100 NHL game career.

The immortal Robert Kron (1985 5th round draft class) - over 770 NHL game career.

Selke trophy WINNER Dirk Graham (1979 5th round draft class).

And who the **** can forget this other 5th round pick - GINO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Siludin]

This trade makes the Canucks a little better by filling temporary holes and providing a cushion in the bottom-6 for the rest of the season. If Dowd is better than Gaunce, he could be re-signed. Chaput in Utica is better than Subban in Utica right now, too. So this trade makes the Canucks and Utica better - can't complain about that.