Player Discussion Jonathan Drouin - So comman Edition

[Draft]

Same scenario as Weber. Good player traded for good player.... But not the saviour. Took a risk hoping he could be a 1C and the risk didn't work out. I'll reserve judgement on him considering how much of a disaster this season has been in all aspects of the team.

 

[Scriptor]

Lightning fan coming in peace. The switch to center definitely stunted his growth as an NHL player, but the thing nobody’s been talking about that I think really hurt him was all the weight he put on trying to bulk up for the position. From what I’ve seen he’s lost a good deal of his speed and that has hurt him far more than the added weight has helped him. Keep him at the wing and get him back down to his previous size and I think you’ll be much happier with the results...if you can get him to give consistent effort that is. He has all the tools to be a great player but whether he achieves it or just remains a maddeningly frustrating example of wasted talent all depends on his attitude.

Anyway, while as a Lightning fan I can’t wish you guys luck with a straight face, as a fan of hockey part of me hopes he becomes the player he’s capable of being. When he wants to he can absolutely take over a game and do things with the puck that very few players can do. It’d be nice to see that more often (as long as it isn’t against my team of course.)

I think the perceived lack of speed has a lot to do with not exploiting it on the wing. He skates on the ice like he has to worry about too many things. He seems to be afraid to commit to a play as a C and, when he does, it's a turnover.

 

[Scriptor]

Same scenario as Weber. Good player traded for good player.... But not the saviour. Took a risk hoping he could be a 1C and the risk didn't work out. I'll reserve judgement on him considering how much of a disaster this season has been in all aspects of the team.

Personally, I don't recall EVER thinking he would be a saviour. He certainly hasn't met expectations yet, but there is plenty of time for that to happen. He would've been a better complementary player if Bergevin had been able to keep Radulov and had, somehow, managed to add a top-6 C to the mix.

With Radulov controlling the puck along the boards and being able to make plays, even if the Habs had been stubborn enough to go ahead with the C experiment for Drouin, it would have had a huge chance of working out better.

However, I don't think that the Habs would have kept Drouin and Radulov together long enough if things hadn't worked out. The pressure to reunite Radulov to Danault and Pacioretty would've been too great.

 

[Kraken Jokes]

What's 'so comman'?

 

[Price is Wright]

Personally, I don't recall EVER thinking he would be a saviour.

When we first added him I felt good about it. I still had question marks on Sergachev's overall game (still kinda do but his offence is beyond what I thought he'd be at this year, Tampa or not) and from what I've seen of Drouin in Tampa I think he was a special player who needed that extra push. I also felt he didn't like Cooper.

Then he almost immediately signed and said all the right things and felt it was a very good fit if Radulov comes back. But Radulov didn't come back. And then Bergevin started talking about him becoming a centre. And it was clear it didn't matter if we didn't think he was a saviour (though some here thought because he was more skilled than Desharnais he was gonna become an 80 point player turning Pacioretty into a 50 goal scorer, no seriously there were posts like this), it's clear Bergevin was convinced he was going to be the first line centre to save his job.

It all reminds me of that scene in Moneyball where Brad Pitt tries to tell Chris Pratt it's easy to play first base and his coach says it's incredibly hard. I could see that being Bergevin and Muller telling Drouin he's gonna play first line centre. Only there's no winning streak like the A's.

 

[sandviper]

When we first added him I felt good about it. I still had question marks on Sergachev's overall game (still kinda do but his offence is beyond what I thought he'd be at this year, Tampa or not) and from what I've seen of Drouin in Tampa I think he was a special player who needed that extra push. I also felt he didn't like Cooper.

Then he almost immediately signed and said all the right things and felt it was a very good fit if Radulov comes back. But Radulov didn't come back. And then Bergevin started talking about him becoming a centre. And it was clear it didn't matter if we didn't think he was a saviour (though some here thought because he was more skilled than Desharnais he was gonna become an 80 point player turning Pacioretty into a 50 goal scorer, no seriously there were posts like this), it's clear Bergevin was convinced he was going to be the first line centre to save his job.

It all reminds me of that scene in Moneyball where Brad Pitt tries to tell Chris Pratt it's easy to play first base and his coach says it's incredibly hard. I could see that being Bergevin and Muller telling Drouin he's gonna play first line centre. Only there's no winning streak like the A's.

I was pretty pleased initially with the trade as we were so offensively starved, Drouin’s creativity I felt would really help us move up a level. I always liked Sergachev, but never would had expected to see this growth from him so soon. That said, my expectation was Radulov and Markov would be back, giving Mete and perhaps Juulsen time to develop.

The way I see it, after all that is said and done, we really took a step back. Drouin I still think can be a star top-3 player for us but he really needs the support, not just up front but in the backend also. Really, I think the issues with all our forwards is they are being forced to play more defensively than they should. In the case of Drouin and even Galchenyuk... these guys are never gonna win Selkes and we shouldn’t expect them to.

By the way, good analogy with Moneyball, I was thinking exactly the same with Hatteberg.

 

[Runner77]

The way I see it, after all that is said and done, we really took a step back. Drouin I still think can be a star top-3 player for us but he really needs the support, not just up front but in the backend also.

That's the X-Factor for me. If he can be a star player, this is not the season that has allowed us to see it. So many posts here see him as a complementary player -- and that's probably the worst case scenario. The skill is definitely there but it needs to be manifested consistently. Of course, you're going to get arguments about how he shouldn't be a center and how that's been holding him back and how he's still very young. Yes to all that, so why are they not putting him in a position where he can be at his best and we can find out how much the team's decision-making has been holding him back?

 

[Runner77]

We should get Mackinnon for him to help him look like a superstar. He has 35 goals in over 200 NHL games and has only produced more points than two players drafted in the top 10 of the 2013 draft. He may still turn things around and I hope he does because he is getting 5.5 million a year and is on pace for 10 goals with preferential treatment this season. I would have kept Radulov and Sergachev every day of the week and twice on Sunday over this guy and the team would be much better off right now.

No worries, Bergevin will fix his own mess. He's going to convert the painting of a monkey that he made, into some kind of baboon.

I don't know why so many Russians were let go and I'm just hoping it's just a coincidence. There just isn't any place you can look in this organization and not want to take this GM to task.

Because of no decision of consequence having been taken by upper management or ownership since the season started, you're left wondering when will we know that we've reached rock bottom. Of course, doing nothing is also a decision, but it's merely an accelerant in what has been a precipitous descent.

 

[Runner77]

What's 'so comman'?

It's so weird that it could soon be trending.

 

[OldCraig71]

Personally, I don't recall EVER thinking he would be a saviour. He certainly hasn't met expectations yet, but there is plenty of time for that to happen. He would've been a better complementary player if Bergevin had been able to keep Radulov and had, somehow, managed to add a top-6 C to the mix.

With Radulov controlling the puck along the boards and being able to make plays, even if the Habs had been stubborn enough to go ahead with the C experiment for Drouin, it would have had a huge chance of working out better.

However, I don't think that the Habs would have kept Drouin and Radulov together long enough if things hadn't worked out. The pressure to reunite Radulov to Danault and Pacioretty would've been too great.

Excellent post, Our forward group got really exposed without the presence of Radulov this year as well as Markovs puck moving skills from the back.

 

[OldCraig71]

No worries, Bergevin will fix his own mess. He's going to convert the painting of a monkey that he made, into some kind of baboon.

I don't know why so many Russians were let go and I'm just hoping it's just a coincidence. There just isn't any place you can look in this organization and not want to take this GM to task.

Because of no decision of consequence having been taken by upper management or ownership since the season started, you're left wondering when will we know that we've reached rock bottom. Of course, doing nothing is also a decision, but it's merely an accelerant in what has been a precipitous descent.

Well if Bergevin is permitted to do the rebuild that I guess there are still no consequences for the bad job he has done. You know as well as I do that if he indeed makes a bunch of trades that he will only say that the players he assembled on the team in 2017-18 simply under performed. He always does that, it will be nothing new. Just wait for some of the returns he gets in some of these trades, the new hf site will be tested, the old one would definitely crumble under that pressure.

 

[groovejuice]

Well if Bergevin is permitted to do the rebuild that I guess there are still no consequences for the bad job he has done. You know as well as I do that if he indeed makes a bunch of trades that he will only say that the players he assembled on the team in 2017-18 simply under performed. He always does that, it will be nothing new. Just wait for some of the returns he gets in some of these trades, the new hf site will be tested, the old one would definitely crumble under that pressure.

It's ironic that Bergevin's worst flaw is also the one he so desperately promulgates as vital in players - character. He has none. He will not take responsibly, he makes excuses, he blames and publicly criticizes others.

If he did have genuine character, I would not be so terrified by the prospect of him rebuilding the team. He doesn't learn from his mistakes and has repeated the same ones over and over. There's no reason to assume that will ever change.

If we could separate ourselves from Gainey, a man with more experience, skill, intelligence, success and character, why in the world would we continue with a man lesser in every area?

 

[Rapala]

That's the X-Factor for me. If he can be a star player, this is not the season that has allowed us to see it. So many posts here see him as a complementary player -- and that's probably the worst case scenario. The skill is definitely there but it needs to be manifested consistently. Of course, you're going to get arguments about how he shouldn't be a center and how that's been holding him back and how he's still very young. Yes to all that, so why are they not putting him in a position where he can be at his best and we can find out how much the team's decision-making has been holding him back?

If we try to simplify things it's very evident that Drouin being an East/West player needs to play with talented North/South players of which we have none. This is the only saving grace we can possibly acknowledge.
Having said that the trade itself has turned out terribly for this particular team.

 

[Habs Icing]

Excellent post, Our forward group got really exposed without the presence of Radulov this year as well as Markovs puck moving skills from the back.

We definitely miss Rads and Markov but Drouin's presence should somewhat mitigate Radulov's absence. That didn't happen. You need to look at what else changed. The answer is Claude Julien. His system sucks when it comes to creating offense. It always did. That's why Neely wanted him out for so many years in Boston. Last night the Caps color commentator said something that stroke as very true. The Habs shoot pucks at the net to just shoot. They don't take shots to create offense.

 

[SirClintonPortis]

Drouin is a mid-grade playmaker who has to do a lot of improvement to become a consistent 50+ assist guy. Becoming a 50+assist guy is the only way for him to be considered "elite" because one thing's for sure, he's never going to be a goalscorer. Dude is too pass happy just like a lot of previous playmakers. And like all playmakers, he needs some decent gunners to smash home his passes. And no, "grindy" goalscorers like Gallagher and Byron are not the type of goalscorer that can capitalize on the sweet passing of a good playmaker. You need a legit sniper with instincts, and we have don't have that type of goalscorer with intuition.

 

[Tyson]

Montreal- where promising young players go to regress

 

[Drew4u]

Drouin is a mid-grade playmaker who has to do a lot of improvement to become a consistent 50+ assist guy. Becoming a 50+assist guy is the only way for him to be considered "elite" because one thing's for sure, he's never going to be a goalscorer. Dude is too pass happy just like a lot of previous playmakers. And like all playmakers, he needs some decent gunners to smash home his passes. And no, "grindy" goalscorers like Gallagher and Byron are not the type of goalscorer that can capitalize on the sweet passing of a good playmaker. You need a legit sniper with instincts, and we have don't have that type of goalscorer with intuition.

Pacioretty, Galchenyuk...

 

[SirClintonPortis]

Pacioretty, Galchenyuk...

Pacioretty and Drouin play the same position. LW. They would not work on the same line. Never mind Pac lacks the intuition of a Selanne or even Bobby Ryan to gun home passes from a playmaker anyway. He just goes north-south and tries to snipe it into the goalie's chest.

Galchenyuk is gonna be booted out of town rather than be paid by management, no ands, ifs, or buts about it.

 

[ahmedou]

Da phoque you don't know what's So Comman meaning gang of ignorant Been created by a french-african humorist. It refers at c'est comment/wassup/what's going on in the world of laughing. You use that in the moments of discomfort, disturbance or when you're in a state of shock. Check on YouTube: La voiture du derangement.

 

[OldCraig71]

We definitely miss Rads and Markov but Drouin's presence should somewhat mitigate Radulov's absence. That didn't happen. You need to look at what else changed. The answer is Claude Julien. His system sucks when it comes to creating offense. It always did. That's why Neely wanted him out for so many years in Boston. Last night the Caps color commentator said something that stroke as very true. The Habs shoot pucks at the net to just shoot. They don't take shots to create offense.

The game where we had 50+ shots against the Islanders was like this to a certain extent, we get plenty of shots in most of these games but most of them are such low percentage chances that it is tough to score. In defense of our forward group, there is virtually no puck movement from the back end, everything starts at D and sadly for us most things die with our D.

 

[AndreRoy]

Drouin is a mid-grade playmaker who has to do a lot of improvement to become a consistent 50+ assist guy. Becoming a 50+assist guy is the only way for him to be considered "elite" because one thing's for sure, he's never going to be a goalscorer. Dude is too pass happy just like a lot of previous playmakers. And like all playmakers, he needs some decent gunners to smash home his passes. And no, "grindy" goalscorers like Gallagher and Byron are not the type of goalscorer that can capitalize on the sweet passing of a good playmaker. You need a legit sniper with instincts, and we have don't have that type of goalscorer with intuition.

Pacioretty and Drouin play the same position. LW.

I respectfully disagree. He displayed a very nice shot last year in Tampa (mostly while at RW) and he was successful on a line with Filppula and Boyle who are far from legit snipers.

Also as I alluded to in my previous sentence he can play both wings. We actually had him at RW for almost all of last year because we were deeper at LW, and I think he’s a more balanced player on that side as he at least seemed to shoot more successfully from it (not sure where I can find stats to confirm or refute that but that’s just where I remember most of his goals coming from.)

Anyway you guys shouldn’t give up on him. Sergachev is certainly looking like he could be a great player, but Drouin can still be one too. He just needs to want it and to be utilized properly.

 

[Price is Wright]

Pacioretty and Drouin play the same position. LW.

Drouin's best season in Tampa was at RW and when he was first acquired we called him the Radulov replacement for that reason. Instead the Habs have played him mostly at centre.

 

[PhysicX]

Da phoque you don't know what's So Comman meaning gang of ignorant Been created by a french-african humorist. It refers at c'est comment/wassup/what's going on in the world of laughing. You use that in the moments of discomfort, disturbance or when you're in a state of shock. Check on YouTube: La voiture du derangement.

Thanks for clarifying. Obviously we all knew that... LOL

 

[Runner77]

Well if Bergevin is permitted to do the rebuild that I guess there are still no consequences for the bad job he has done. You know as well as I do that if he indeed makes a bunch of trades that he will only say that the players he assembled on the team in 2017-18 simply under performed. He always does that, it will be nothing new. Just wait for some of the returns he gets in some of these trades, the new hf site will be tested, the old one would definitely crumble under that pressure.

I could see a GM saying that for one or two players, but almost his whole team has cratered and is lifeless. At what point does the failed architect take responsibility for his house of cards?

 

[Runner77]

Da phoque you don't know what's So Comman meaning gang of ignorant Been created by a french-african humorist. It refers at c'est comment/wassup/what's going on in the world of laughing. You use that in the moments of discomfort, disturbance or when you're in a state of shock. Check on YouTube: La voiture du derangement.

Just checked the video, the user comments spell it as in your thread title, "so comman". It's a state of being but an uncomfortable one. Cool, you fished in pretty deep waters for that, not at all common around these parts. Ça manquait à ma culture, lol.