Post-Game Talk: Jets hold on, win 2:1

[Jets4Life]

Very interesting and great post here Whileee, and I agree with the majority of it. I'm unsure on Maurice ? and would like to see him succeed, coz I like him generally. Sometimes I do question some of his personnel he chooses for his lineups. After this year, we'll have a good idea if Maurice is the future coach of the Jets, as the talent is there, and it "was not" before with most of his teams.
Interesting on the "puck possession"- and if that's the case, I totally agree with it, and hanging on til you get a real good opportunity. The Jets have skilled guys that can deploy this kind of strategy. This reminds me of the old great 1970's Russian teams, who would only skate in the puck, and never shoot it in. The Canadians would always have 2 times as many shots on net, but usually lost to the Russians. If you have guys skilled enough ( Ehlers etc) I like the thinking.
I'd like to see people cut Maurice a bit of slack, and watch and see what happens here this year.

I found this hockey blog article from November 2011, when Maurice was still coaching Carolina. It's deja vu:

Highlights:

"
Most notably is Maurice's incredible inability to develop any sort of special teams presence with his squads.
Starting with the '02-03 season—Maurice has coached seven full years with the Hurricanes and Maple Leafs since then—he has yet to field a power play or penalty kill that's ever ranked higher than 15th in the league. Over those seven seasons, Maurice's power-play units have averaged ranking 20th in the NHL; his penalty kill units have averaged ranking 23rd."

--snip--

"
Despite power-play specialists like Joni Pitkanen and Tomas Kaberle on the roster, 29-year-old bottom-feeding defenseman Jay Harrison—a player who has never scored a power-play goal in his life—has been allowed to poach over two minutes of average man-advantage time-on-ice per game.
On the other end of the table, offensive speedsters such as Jussi Jokinen and Jiri Tlusty have been given over a minute of shorthanded "TOI" every game while some hard-hitting forwards, namely Tuomo Ruutu and Anthony Stewart, have been completely ignored."

--snip--

"As we've alluded to in previous articles, Carolina's most-used line combination has been their third line of Brandon Sutter, Patrick Dwyer and Jiri Tlusty. Their second-most used combination has been their third line, this time consisting of Sutter, Dwyer and Alexei Ponikarovsky, as well.
That's sad.
No wonder Eric Staal can't break out of his well-documented slump—he doesn't even know who he's going to be playing with each day. Maurice's endless scrambling of the depth chart is hurting the team far more than finding any ultimate top-line trio will."

--snip--

"
Maurice's ignorance towards the franchise's promising prospects has also been a subject of concern.
Every fall, the same trends continue, be it Zach Boychuk of '09-10, Jerome Samson and Drayson Bowman of '10-11 or Zac Dalpe of this season; even the most talented up-and-comers find it impossible to earn any ice time, and the subsequent experience, under the upbringing of the Maurice regime."


source: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/933395

 

[HannuJ]

Can we agree that the PK still is ugly?

 

[KingBogo]

I don't think anyone thinks is this team has played great to start the year. Weve had some great individual performances but as a whole the team hasnt clicked very well yet. The positives are that the last three games has seen a much better focus on defense and we are starting to give up less quality chances (Step 1). On the flipside we haven't looked very good offensively (Likely due to the focus on defense). Given the talent on the team it's really only a matter of time before that comes around imo. I'm not satisfied with our play but the positives are that last year this team would have found ways to lose games like today and against Vancouver. There seems to be a new mentality and a level of maturity on this team so far this season. They aren't panicking as much.

They definitely will have to find some cohesion moving forward though.

I like this take on where things stand. Maturing is a good way to put it. The attention to detail in the defensive zone is improving, once the offense catches up I think we make a strong push this season. Contingent on if Helly keeps playing a like a quality starter. And also Mason finding his game so we can have a nice effective balance.

 

[Guffman]

I would rather win ugly than lose beautifully. Some may argue that winning ugly isn’t sustainable but I don’t think how you play in one game carries over all that much to future games anyway. You try to correct your flaws, regardless of whether you win or lose. It’s just nice that we can actually get wins against good teams when we still can improve a lot.

As for who to start...yeah, I like riding the hot hand though I don’t think icing Mason right away is healthy for the team long-term. Tough choice.

 

[Weezeric]

Maurice's ignorance towards the franchise's promising prospects has also been a subject of concern.
Every fall, the same trends continue, be it Zach Boychuk of '09-10, Jerome Samson and Drayson Bowman of '10-11 or Zac Dalpe of this season; even the most talented up-and-comers find it impossible to earn any ice time, and the subsequent experience, under the upbringing of the Maurice regime."


source: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/933395

Hmm, it seems in retrospect that Maurice was right and Jerome Samson, drayson bowman, and zac dalpe(??) just weren't NHL players and the genius bloggers were wrong about their potential.

I for one am shocked that Maurice couldn't get those amazing leafs teams of the 2000's to win.....

 

[lomiller1]

[mod] Maurice is not being fired.

I think some people here actually want us to lose and are disppointed that we won the game.

Playing poorly and winning is the worst case scenario for these games. I'd rather have us play well and win, or even play well and lose because that bodes well for the rest of the season. Playing poorly and loosing can at least lead to some changes that may turn our season around. Playing poorly and winning just sets us up for yet another lost season.

 

[Jets4Life]

Playing poorly and winning is the worst case scenario for these games. I'd rather have us play well and win, or even play well and lose because that bodes well for the rest of the season. Playing poorly and loosing can at least lead to some changes that may turn our season around. Playing poorly and winning just sets us up for yet another lost season.

I disagree. You never want your team to lose. It's a similar mindset to hoping your team tanks the season to get a better draft pick.

 

[ffh]

Playing poorly and winning is the worst case scenario for these games. I'd rather have us play well and win, or even play well and lose because that bodes well for the rest of the season. Playing poorly and loosing can at least lead to some changes that may turn our season around. Playing poorly and winning just sets us up for yet another lost season.

go watch Arizona and buffalo if you want to see a team playing poorly. we are not playing bad. not playing your best doesn't mean you aren't trying to improve and will be complacent because you are winning.

 

[Aavco Cup]

Petan & Dano had 1 shift each in the third period. Basically after Machoo left the game they were stapled to the bench

 

[Afterburner]

Why give up on a goalie after two starts (the first 2 games of the season at that., which are 2 of the least correlative to actual team success)?

The team played TERRIBLY in front of him in those two games and have played better in front of Helle the last three.

We need to have two goalies with confidence, especially at this point in the season - this is one of the major things that Jets 2.0 has lacked. Let’s get two guys rolling - nonetheless very happy with Helle’s start.

I don't think they're giving up on Mason, I think they're just happy/surprised/ whatever that Helle is playing awesome after some extra Summer coaching, so they want to see what he's got.

 

[Aavco Cup]

Playing poorly and winning is the worst case scenario for these games. I'd rather have us play well and win, or even play well and lose because that bodes well for the rest of the season. Playing poorly and loosing can at least lead to some changes that may turn our season around. Playing poorly and winning just sets us up for yet another lost season.

I don't think we played poorly. I don't think we played well as a team either.

 

[KingBogo]

Wheelers interview last night, stated it was important for this young team to be comfortable winning ugly in front of their fans, on home ice. That controlling the urge to force play to get the fans going and digging yourself a deeper hole to climb out, is important for the team to learn.

I didn't catch any of the interviews last night so I will go back for a listen. But these are very interesting comments. It fits with the idea that Jets are working on maturing as a team with more attention to detail over letting the young guns loose chasing individual stats.

 

[Afterburner]

I found this hockey blog article from November 2011, when Maurice was still coaching Carolina. It's deja vu:

Highlights:

"
Most notably is Maurice's incredible inability to develop any sort of special teams presence with his squads.
Starting with the '02-03 season—Maurice has coached seven full years with the Hurricanes and Maple Leafs since then—he has yet to field a power play or penalty kill that's ever ranked higher than 15th in the league. Over those seven seasons, Maurice's power-play units have averaged ranking 20th in the NHL; his penalty kill units have averaged ranking 23rd."

--snip--

"
Despite power-play specialists like Joni Pitkanen and Tomas Kaberle on the roster, 29-year-old bottom-feeding defenseman Jay Harrison—a player who has never scored a power-play goal in his life—has been allowed to poach over two minutes of average man-advantage time-on-ice per game.
On the other end of the table, offensive speedsters such as Jussi Jokinen and Jiri Tlusty have been given over a minute of shorthanded "TOI" every game while some hard-hitting forwards, namely Tuomo Ruutu and Anthony Stewart, have been completely ignored."

--snip--

"As we've alluded to in previous articles, Carolina's most-used line combination has been their third line of Brandon Sutter, Patrick Dwyer and Jiri Tlusty. Their second-most used combination has been their third line, this time consisting of Sutter, Dwyer and Alexei Ponikarovsky, as well.
That's sad.
No wonder Eric Staal can't break out of his well-documented slump—he doesn't even know who he's going to be playing with each day. Maurice's endless scrambling of the depth chart is hurting the team far more than finding any ultimate top-line trio will."

--snip--

"
Maurice's ignorance towards the franchise's promising prospects has also been a subject of concern.
Every fall, the same trends continue, be it Zach Boychuk of '09-10, Jerome Samson and Drayson Bowman of '10-11 or Zac Dalpe of this season; even the most talented up-and-comers find it impossible to earn any ice time, and the subsequent experience, under the upbringing of the Maurice regime."


source: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/933395

Wow, Mo is like deja vu all over again. I'm happy we're winning games, I sure don't want the alternative. But I still worry that Mo isn't the man to take this group over to the promised land, even with some wins.

 

[Beavski24]

I'm glad they don't play mason the guy is a bum after letting that goal against the capitals the worst goal in history he belongs not even in the nhl

 

[KingBogo]

So in terms of roster moves. Assuming MP and Kulikov are both out and Lowry is only day to day. I say we call up Connor and rejig the top 6 a bit.

Ehlers-Scheifele-Laine
Connor-Little-Wheeler
Matthias-Lowry-Tanev
Petan/Dano-Copp-Armia

Morrissey-Truba
Toby-Buff
Poolman-Myers

Wheeler and Little help support Connor in the defensive zone and are more predictable in the offensive zone. Playing with Ehlers and Scheifele and their speed might really get Laine going with more open space.

 

[jetswin]

Petan & Dano had 1 shift each in the third period. Basically after Machoo left the game they were stapled to the bench

This is the issue....lots of knowledgeable hockey guys, including Ferraro are talking about us needing 3 good offensive and defensive lines and a 4th defensive line.

The contrasting ways Babcock and Maurice coach similarly talented teams is super frustrating for fans. I hope his way pays off, but I am much more confident Babcock's does. I keep thinking of the high octane offence we had when Kompon prepared the team last fall when Maurice was at the World Cup. That early jets team was never out of a game....injuries and the Maurice effect eventually took the swagger out of the young guys. Laine needs to play with Little and someone more creative than Perrault. I like Perrault but he doesn't make Laine better.

 

[GNP]

Playing poorly and winning is the worst case scenario for these games. I'd rather have us play well and win, or even play well and lose because that bodes well for the rest of the season. Playing poorly and loosing can at least lead to some changes that may turn our season around. Playing poorly and winning just sets us up for yet another lost season.

This is such an interesting and multi faceted post !!! I'd rather play poorly and win, because "points" are the final measuring stick, if you advance to the playoffs. Over my time of watching sports, I've seen a lot of great teams play poor, but pull out the game in the end. Teams like the 85 Oilers, and the Patriots of the NFL.

There is nothing more frustrating when your playing really well, and always coming up a goal short and losing on multiple occasions. I've seen this happen so many times. You hear stuff like we lost our last 7 games by only 1 goal-but what good is that and what does it tell you about the mind set of the team ??

I do think it's better to develop a "mind set" and a culture of winning, so that subconsciously, you know and believe you can always pull a game out if you really dig down deep. It's nice when your playing well though, but if your losing well doing it, it's very deflating, and kills the team's confidence. I don't believe any team plays their best all the time. You have to learn how to win "ugly."

 

[Whileee]

Some interesting stats, compiled by hockeystats.com.

5v5 Scoring Chances Differential:

Vs.

Leafs -3
Flames -5
Oilers +9
Canucks +14
Canes -1

Season to date.... +14

This tends to comport with my viewing of the Jets' play. They have been reasonably good at limiting scoring chances, and tend not to shoot from low danger areas. In contrast, the Canucks just put the puck toward the net at any chance, seldom even looking to make a play. The Canes were more like that, too.

This is a very different team, and many of the forwards ate going to be looking for plays rather than taking shots. Similarly, the D are inclined to dump the puck behind the net if they don't have a good shot opportunity. I'm not sure if this will result in better outcomes, but time will tell.

 

[ffh]

This is the issue....lots of knowledgeable hockey guys, including Ferraro are talking about us needing 3 good offensive and defensive lines and a 4th defensive line.

The contrasting ways Babcock and Maurice coach similarly talented teams is super frustrating for fans. I hope his way pays off, but I am much more confident Babcock's does. I keep thinking of the high octane offence we had when Kompon prepared the team last fall when Maurice was at the World Cup. That early jets team was never out of a game....injuries and the Maurice effect eventually took the swagger out of the young guys. Laine needs to play with Little and someone more creative than Perrault. I like Perrault but he doesn't make Laine better.

replying to the aavco post about dano and petan it sounds like to me you believe that they are equal to Toronto's 3rd liners marleau and kadri. they are not. kompon coaching a bunch of chlers and ahlers for a game or 2 to decent results should not be compared to what Maurice was faced with in the regular season.

 

[GNP]

So in terms of roster moves. Assuming MP and Kulikov are both out and Lowry is only day to day. I say we call up Connor and rejig the top 6 a bit.

Ehlers-Scheifele-Laine
Connor-Little-Wheeler
Matthias-Lowry-Tanev
Petan/Dano-Copp-Armia

Morrissey-Truba
Toby-Buff
Poolman-Myers

Wheeler and Little help support Connor in the defensive zone and are more predictable in the offensive zone. Playing with Ehlers and Scheifele and their speed might really get Laine going with more open space.

I like the concept Bogo, but Lowry cannot score and belongs only on the PK, and on the 4-th line. I like to have a "sniper" on all 3 lines, along with one "playmaker" -"something like this"

Line 1- Ehlers --- Scheifele -Perrault

Line 2- Laine -- Little ----- Wheeler

Line 3 Connor-- Petan -- Armia or Copp

The way I see a 3 Line team working is at least one playmaker, and one "sniper" on all 3 lines. This would be the ideal setup. ( or something very similar)

 

[Whileee]

This is the issue....lots of knowledgeable hockey guys, including Ferraro are talking about us needing 3 good offensive and defensive lines and a 4th defensive line.

The contrasting ways Babcock and Maurice coach similarly talented teams is super frustrating for fans. I hope his way pays off, but I am much more confident Babcock's does. I keep thinking of the high octane offence we had when Kompon prepared the team last fall when Maurice was at the World Cup. That early jets team was never out of a game....injuries and the Maurice effect eventually took the swagger out of the young guys. Laine needs to play with Little and someone more creative than Perrault. I like Perrault but he doesn't make Laine better.

I've been advocating for Perreault on the third line for some time. Put Connor in the top 6, or even Petan or Dano.

 

[Aavco Cup]

So the team decided to cancelled practice today. We obviously won't get any news about our "health" today

 

[Guffman]

So in terms of roster moves. Assuming MP and Kulikov are both out and Lowry is only day to day. I say we call up Connor and rejig the top 6 a bit.

Ehlers-Scheifele-Laine
Connor-Little-Wheeler
Matthias-Lowry-Tanev
Petan/Dano-Copp-Armia

Morrissey-Truba
Toby-Buff
Poolman-Myers

Wheeler and Little help support Connor in the defensive zone and are more predictable in the offensive zone. Playing with Ehlers and Scheifele and their speed might really get Laine going with more open space.

I can see a big Maurice freak out when he actually uses Chairot as the LHD replacement instead of Poolman.

 

[Whileee]

Meanwhile, a sample of comments from the Canes' board (paraphrased)...

Canes don't have enough skill and play too much of a system approach...

They should stop spreading out the skill and load up the top players on a couple of lines...

Canes look like they are on track for a high position in the "Corsi playoffs".

Canes need Stempniak back.

Fans...

 

[puck stoppa]

With Petan and Dano on the bench Tanev finished in MPs spot. Now I may agree that Tanev has done enough to play fourth line but to see him out there the last three minutes was painful, he threw the puck back in his zone where he could've went up the wall, this hemmed us in, then he runs at their D man in a straight line, the guy side steps him and Helly had to bail him out with a big glove save. Why on earth would he be out there that late!?