Is it time to blow the team up and rebuild?

[bsl]

Pretty sure Price is tradable. Teams desperate for goaltending would take a crack at him. Why wouldn't they? Philly has been looking for a goalie as badly as we have been looking for a center. If the best center in the NHL would become available...you don't think we would desperately all over that?
If Crosby became available? Malkin? Heck, even Tavares who is likely going to get a similar deal, we for sure are going to be interested if he's available.
No different with Price.

It is a lot different with Price. He is absolutely untradeable now. He's never carried a team in the PO, has injury history, and he's 31 next year on 10.5 mill. For 8 more years. This will become the worst deal in Habs history. And that is saying something.

 

[Tyson]

Personally it pains me to say this but I hope they keep losing and looking bad. Funny how a team that had no players 4 months ago is already better than a team Bergevin has been building for almost 6 years.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Pretty sure Price is tradable. Teams desperate for goaltending would take a crack at him. Why wouldn't they? Philly has been looking for a goalie as badly as we have been looking for a center. If the best center in the NHL would become available...you don't think we would desperately all over that?
If Crosby became available? Malkin? Heck, even Tavares who is likely going to get a similar deal, we for sure are going to be interested if he's available.
No different with Price.

What do you honestly think we can get in return for Price and do you think we would be able to trade him without salary retention?

 

[Scintillating10]

What do you honestly think we can get in return for Price and do you think we would be able to trade him without salary retention?

Did his previous contract have a no-trade clause? I know new one does but I think that doesn't kick in until July 1

 

[vokiel]

...
You will hate the next guys too.


I personally hate watching the games when you are mathematically eliminated.

Why would anyone hate competent managers?

 

[Habs Halifax]

It is a lot different with Price. He is absolutely untradeable now. He's never carried a team in the PO, has injury history, and he's 31 next year on 10.5 mill. For 8 more years. This will become the worst deal in Habs history. And that is saying something.

Price's contract has potential to backfire but the Salary Cap is going up on average of $2M per year recently and goalies are going to be making more in future years as Price set the new bar. Just imagine what Bobrovsky, Rinne, Talbot make in a few seasons when they become free agents. It's not going to be close to Price's contract but they will be getting raises and will likely be near the $8M AAV mark.

Current season (2017-2018):
- Cap rises $2M to $75M
- Price's AAV of $6.5M (9% of cap)
- Price is age 30

First Season of Price's New Contract (2018-2019):
- Cap at $77M?
- Price's AAV of $10.5M (13% of cap)
- Price is age 31

Last Season of Price's New Contract (2025-2026):
- Cap at $91M?
- Price's AAV of $10.5M (11% of cap)
- Price is age 38

I think many teams would not be able to absorb Price's contract due to contract they already have but there are a few teams that have a very young core and need goaltending help. There will be interest but we likely have to retain salary to sweeten the deal so we get a good return.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Did his previous contract have a no-trade clause? I know new one does but I think that doesn't kick in until July 1

Yes, his current contract that expires this year has a NMC / NTC (15 teams). Price submits a list of teams he can't be traded to. In all honestly, if this ship ends up sinking in future years, Price will waive his NMC to go to a team that has a chance to win a Cup. I don't think this would be a major issue if Price feels he can't win in Montreal. He likely is the one to approach the Habs to demand a trade if we struggle to improve our team in the next few years.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Personally it pains me to say this but I hope they keep losing and looking bad. Funny how a team that had no players 4 months ago is already better than a team Bergevin has been building for almost 6 years.

Playing with pressure to win <<<< Playing with no pressure to win

This is our problem. We are too afraid to make mistakes. I know we are not an offensive powerhouse team but Vegas is not either. We simply need to bring our intensity and compete level up. I don't believe Julien ran a good camp for us as it was too passive. Something the players are likely not use to from a MT style camp in previous years.

 

[habsgirl5000]

What do you honestly think we can get in return for Price and do you think we would be able to trade him without salary retention?

MB has made a lot of mistakes, but in the end his biggest one will end up being the price contract,

i dont think you get much more then a first round pick for price, and im not even talking a top 3

the guy is on the decline, its obvious, he is injury prone, over 30, and never done anything when it counts....he aint worth heck of a lot now, its too bad MB doesn't see that, CP contract will become the biggest joke in the entire NHL, he is a middle of the pack goalie now, and he aint gonna be improving on that,

nobody is going to give up much for a mid pack goalie, just because his name is Price

 

[Tyson]

That is a good point about CJ not running a Good camp. Well said.

 

[Habs Halifax]

MB has made a lot of mistakes, but in the end his biggest one will end up being the price contract,

i dont think you get much more then a first round pick for price, and im not even talking a top 3

the guy is on the decline, its obvious, he is injury prone, over 30, and never done anything when it counts....he aint worth heck of a lot now, its too bad MB doesn't see that, CP contract will become the biggest joke in the entire NHL, he is a middle of the pack goalie now, and he aint gonna be improving on that,

nobody is going to give up much for a mid pack goalie, just because his name is Price

Sorry I disagree. We had no choice but to re-sign Price. Also, Price is not in decline. Come on man. The contract is massive but we will be fine with cap space. The issue is improving our team in the critical areas. PMD and top 2 center with size/skating/skill combination.

 

[Tyson]

If the Habs truly decided to blow it up and start over you are looking at 7 years minimum to right the ship.
A new GM will have to undo a ton of mistakes. There is 28 million in cap space tied up in Price, Weber, Shaw and Alzner for the next 5 years. These salaries are unmovable.
On the farm the cupboards are embarrassingly bare and that aspect of the team needs overhauled badly. Bringing back Lefebvre to continue not developing our prospects....repeating the same thing and expecting different results.....

I never thought having a President overlooking hockey operations was a critical position but having an inept GM feeding bullshit to a moronic owner is the constant in this team’s decline.

 

[PaulD]

I honestly don't know what we're in for this season. Like, I really have no clue. We could be the weakest offensive team in the league, or the young kids could start clicking and we could improve on last year. No clue. Our D could be hopeless in joining the rush and moving the puck up, or they could develop chemistry and become rock-solid. I no longer recognize this team (certainly not the defence) and aren't familiar with the system they're trying to implement.

And here's the other thing: I no longer have the same feeling for the players themselves. I love Price, Byron, and Gallagher, am rooting hard for Lehkonen, Hudon and Mete, but most of the roster is a bunch of strangers. Even Drouin, who is a real talent. Don't ask me about Max and Galchenyuk... not sure I want to go there. I don't know who these guys are yet, and beyond the 45 year reflex that I want the Montreal Canadiens to win, I don't care much. Yet. I hope it changes. But right now I'm watching a Frankenteam wearing familiar-looking jerseys.

The specifics you mention are key. I agree Drouin would be better on the wing, and more valuable as he'd be free to shoot more. Our D has been scary... not sure what'll happen there... but I do know it takes time for a bunch of strangers to learn to play together. It's almost exactly like an expansion team, with everyone getting to know each other for the first time. Jeff Petry is the longest-serving defenceman we have, followed by Weber. How weird is that?

Feels like we're already witnessing a rebuilt team, constructed from used material.

and so starts the......... is Drouin better on the wing or at center?

Will it last 5 years like it did for Chucky?

Bring Therrien back....he'll groom Drouin.

 

[habsgirl5000]

Also, Price is not in decline. Come on man.n.

the guy is on the decline, i know we dont want to admit that but its true,

by the time his new contract starts he will be a mid pack goalie

 

[PaulD]

If the Habs truly decided to blow it up and start over you are looking at 7 years minimum to right the ship.
A new GM will have to undo a ton of mistakes. There is 28 million in cap space tied up in Price, Weber, Shaw and Alzner for the next 5 years. These salaries are unmovable.
On the farm the cupboards are embarrassingly bare and that aspect of the team needs overhauled badly. Bringing back Lefebvre to continue not developing our prospects....repeating the same thing and expecting different results.....

I never thought having a President overlooking hockey operations was a critical position but having an inept GM feeding bull**** to a moronic owner is the constant in this team’s decline.

Actually Its a sure fire way to sabotage a team and ruin it if one was so inclined.

 

[PaulD]

the guy is on the decline, i know we dont want to admit that but its true,

by the time his new contract starts he will be a mid pack goalie

slightly.

Still a great goalie obviously.

But he peaked in 015.

He will never play like that again.

 

[PaulD]

Sorry I disagree. We had no choice but to re-sign Price. Also, Price is not in decline. Come on man. The contract is massive but we will be fine with cap space. The issue is improving our team in the critical areas. PMD and top 2 center with size/skating/skill combination.

You mean the essentials that all the other teams have?

Gee what a great idea.

Call Molson, have him inform MB

 

[Habs Halifax]

If the Habs truly decided to blow it up and start over you are looking at 7 years minimum to right the ship.
A new GM will have to undo a ton of mistakes. There is 28 million in cap space tied up in Price, Weber, Shaw and Alzner for the next 5 years. These salaries are unmovable.
On the farm the cupboards are embarrassingly bare and that aspect of the team needs overhauled badly. Bringing back Lefebvre to continue not developing our prospects....repeating the same thing and expecting different results.....

I never thought having a President overlooking hockey operations was a critical position but having an inept GM feeding bull**** to a moronic owner is the constant in this team’s decline.

If (and I stress the word IF), we start a re-build now. Salaries are not the issue as we don't need cap space for the next 5-7 years. We need the cap space after that when our re-build of younger players start to be impact players for us. Remember, it takes 3-5 years to draft and develop (excluding the elite level players). So, if we re-build, we want to suck really so why not keep those players and trade them one piece at a time and ensure they are all gone in 5 years from now.

A re-build don't guarantee anything either. We need to get lucky in a lottery draft and acquire a player (better than Galchenyuk who was drafted 3rd overall) for several years. I think most don't realize how difficult a re-build is and how lucky you need to get to be successful. In 7 years from now, we might not even have a better team than we have today.

The only formula for success is to not trade away too many of your draft picks (especially top 100 picks). If you get close to being a contender and you have few holes in your line-up, you should trade futures to put your team closer to winning a Cup. However, if you are built like the current Habs, you don't trade picks! Bergevin has kept most of his picks which is something most people don't give him credit for.

2008-2011: 8 top 100 picks (average of 2 per year)
2012-2017: 23 top 100 picks (average of 3.83 per year).
2018: Possibly 4 more top 100 picks (if Sergachev plays more than 40 games)

If we can add to our age 25 and under core like we did last year (Poehling, Ikonen, Brook, Walford, Fleury) with 4 more top 100 picks in next years draft, we will be on our way to rebuilding our team on the fly IMO.

 

[WeThreeKings]

He had a three year stretch where he had no second round picks by virtue of trading them away.
Most people don't "realize" this, though.

 

[Habs Halifax]

You mean the essentials that all the other teams have?

Gee what a great idea.

Call Molson and tell him that please.

I can just imagine what the non supporters would say if Bergevin decided to trade Price instead of re-sign him. People that evaluate due to frustration of not winning a cup will never be happy with 90% of the moves we make.

 

[habsgirl5000]

If (and I stress the word IF), we start a re-build now. Salaries are not the issue as we don't need cap space for the next 5-7 years. We need the cap space after that when our re-build of younger players start to be impact players for us. Remember, it takes 3-5 years to draft and develop (excluding the elite level players). So, if we re-build, we want to suck really so why not keep those players and trade them one piece at a time and ensure they are all gone in 5 years from now.

you don't keep players and contracts like weber/price/shaw etc during a rebuild, you trade them for DRAFT PICKS

you trade them all now to get the best value, you dont keep them till they are worth nothing

 

[Habs 4 Life]

Sorry I disagree. We had no choice but to re-sign Price. Also, Price is not in decline. Come on man. The contract is massive but we will be fine with cap space. The issue is improving our team in the critical areas. PMD and top 2 center with size/skating/skill combination.

I agree that we had no choice to sign Price, I think it was the right move
The problem is when MB and his dumb friends traded PK Subban for She Weber, he sent a message that the time to win in Montreal was now
Since then he hasn't done anything, he signed Radulov last summer
He lost Markov and Radulov, he traded away a top 10 prospect in the league today for Drouin who pretty much will replace Radu's offense
He lost Markov, Emelin and others while signing an overrated Alzner who looks terrible so far and going downhill with still 4 more years left after this one which is only 4 games in!!!
He has plenty of cap space, WOW, what's he going to do with it? He has nothing left to trade, you guys can stop with these McCaron, Juulsen and others. These guys will be waiver players in a year or 2 you watch.

That's my problem with him, since taking over he has no direction. with the team he had when he took over with a younger Price, Subban and Pacioretty + a 3rd overall pick, this team should have been competing for the East and the Cup by now, not fighting for a playoff spot every year and have 9 million of cap space not knowing what to do with it because all of his plans FAILED in the summer

 

[WeThreeKings]

He had a choice to not sign Price. But he signed Price to keep his job, nothing more.

He has no vision.

I mean, I would've signed Price too.. but I wouldn't have traded Subban for Weber, made the Shawful trade, signed Alzner.. but I would've brought Markov and Radulov back. Probably would have made the Drouin deal in that sense.. and I would've developed Galchenyuk as a C, or traded him before his value was gone when I -decided he will never be a C-

 

[Habs 4 Life]

He had a choice to not sign Price. But he signed Price to keep his job, nothing more.

He has no vision.

I mean, I would've signed Price too.. but I wouldn't have traded Subban for Weber, made the Shawful trade, signed Alzner.. but I would've brought Markov and Radulov back. Probably would have made the Drouin deal in that sense.. and I would've developed Galchenyuk as a C, or traded him before his value was gone when I -decided he will never be a C-

Agreed, the whole point of bringing Drouin in was to be able to have Radulov and add that player to our weak offense, but as usual he failed
No excuses seems to always find excuses

 

[PaulD]

I can just imagine what the non supporters would say if Bergevin decided to trade Price instead of re-sign him. People that evaluate due to frustration of not winning a cup will never be happy with 90% of the moves we make.

la dee da

Im sure all of MBs relitives agree with you.

btw...not acquiring a number one center for 6 seasons is not "a move we made"

Signing Price for sure. No brainer. Too bad all the other ingredients that you need to go with a goalie like that (in order to contend) are on other teams.