Speculation: is it time to blow it up???

[My Special Purpose]

Could you provide a plausible example or two of trades where shipping out Faulk would result in an improved defense?

I hate this crap. Everyone always asks for specific examples of potential trades, then jumps all over someone whenever they post something specific.

If your comment is basically "we'd lose any trade in which we traded Justin Faulk," then we're going to have to agree to disagree. There are plenty of examples of teams trading young defensemen -- who could still go either way -- and coming out just fine. Heck, I'll go back four years and find all the posts from respected board members who cursed the Canes for even considering trading Jamie McBain during his ascension. I could give you 100 examples of defensemen like Faulk who were traded and their teams never ended up regretting it, but all I'd get back was a bunch of "this guy was never considered as good as Faulk" and revisionist history would take over.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

I hate this crap. Everyone always asks for specific examples of potential trades, then jumps all over someone whenever they post something specific.

If your comment is basically "we'd lose any trade in which we traded Justin Faulk," then we're going to have to agree to disagree. There are plenty of examples of teams trading young defensemen -- who could still go either way -- and coming out just fine. Heck, I'll go back four years and find all the posts from respected board members who cursed the Canes for even considering trading Jamie McBain during his ascension. I could give you 100 examples of defensemen like Faulk who were traded and their teams never ended up regretting it, but all I'd get back was a bunch of "this guy was never considered as good as Faulk" and revisionist history would take over.

The Hurricanes don't have the pieces to fill one hole via trade without opening another. But that's not an excuse to do absolutely nothing. As is, this core only has a slim chance to compete. (BTW I'm agreeing with you)

 

[My Special Purpose]

I think, if the determination is made to move Sekera because he won't sign here, they have to look at getting a young defenseman in return, maybe someone on the cusp of becoming an NHLer. Picks would be nice, sure, but short of completely blowing things up, moving Sekera for a first just allows this team to tread water for the next however long. But if they move him for a usable player that can step in soon, they really might not be all that worse on the back end with everyone (Murphy, Fleury) a step closer to stepping in. It'd also free up space to either re-sign Tlusty or sign another second pairing guy. Assuming, of course, they don't just pocket the money.

Completely unexciting trade idea here. If we find that we can't sign Sekera, why not flip him to the Rangers for Marc Staal? We can debate for the next four months about who is "better," but that's not the important question. The important question is "which of them will play for us for $5 million per?" I think the better bet for that is Staal.

 

[What the Faulk]

I was thinking more along the lines of a Morgan Rielly. I wonder if that could work straight up.

 

[Francis10]

I was thinking more along the lines of a Morgan Rielly. I wonder if that could work straight up.

That would be a nice trade for us. Then sign Marc Staal as FA.

 

[What the Faulk]

Considering Rielly's entry level deal runs until the end of next year, I think even adding would make sense.

Absolute pass on Jake Gardiner.

 

[Navin R Slavin]

I hate this crap. Everyone always asks for specific examples of potential trades, then jumps all over someone whenever they post something specific.

Can you provide an example of this behavior?

 

[NotOpie]

Just did a 3 minute run through of the rest of our schedule and with a slightly optimistic review, the best I could have us hoping for is finishing about 5 games over .500 or about 21st/22nd in the league....yup, that's picking about 9th or 10th in the 2015 draft. Now I didn't factor in any ties and this was just a quick thumbnail run through....but I know we'll lose to teams we're not supposed to and occasionally beat a team we're supposed to lose to.

So unless we miraculously shore up the defense and start scoring more goals per game, we look mediocre at best. But as many have said, we don't appear to be that far off. So I'm in the camp of major tweaks as opposed to blow ups. I agree with Kev that fixing the defense fixes a lot of woes. I'm still looking for EStaal, Skinner, and, yes, Semin to all put up numbers closer to their averages than last year's results. I also agree that if we move Sekera we need to get a ready, or nearly ready player back.

We need to move Harry for a bag of pucks....unless his play dramatically improves over the next 1/2 dozen games. Other than parking him in the pressbox, I don't know what we can do with Liles. While some have felt that Hainsey has regressed, the Bellemore/Hainsey pairing has proven fairly adequate. Gleason has really worked with everybody he's been paired with this year. Faulk and Sekera, while not the best #1 pairing in the league don't look like a total **** show against top competition. To me, even Jordan has looked better and better. I'd likely play him on the 3rd pairing with Timmay...he could even work on the 2nd PP unit too.

So this is a long-winded way of saying, I would move the parts that we can and that make sense (Sekera if he won't re-sign, Tlusty if he won't re-sign, probably McClement, maybe Dwyer, and possibly Gleason at deadline time). I'd try to get prospects that were further along if possible. I'd try to get an up and coming 2nd pairing blueliner. And I'd get picks if nothing else works.

Not a real "blow up", but the type of moves that hopefully would improve us quicker. I just don't think this market has the patience for a full blown rebuild.

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

I was thinking more along the lines of a Morgan Rielly. I wonder if that could work straight up.

I really doubt it.

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

I just don't think this market has the patience for a full blown rebuild.

Fun fact: if we started the rebuild a couple of years ago when everyone STARTED getting sick of this 8th overall crap, we'd be done by now.

 

[NotOpie]

Fun fact: if we started the rebuild a couple of years ago when everyone STARTED getting sick of this 8th overall crap, we'd be done by now.

....or the trucks would be leaving for Vegas right about now....

 

[What the Faulk]

I really doubt it.

Oh trust me, I got that. The thread I made on that trade board got torn to shreds.

 

[My Special Purpose]

Fun fact: if we started the rebuild a couple of years ago when everyone STARTED getting sick of this 8th overall crap, we'd be done by now.

To be precise, it *should* have started when Gleason and Ruutu were pending UFAs in 2009-10. Resigning those two to matching four-year contracts was the beginning of the downward "we like our group" spiral that we're still trying to come out of now.

Now, Sekera is better than Gleason and Tlusty is probably better than Ruutu (especially if you factor in health), but that only means we should get even more talent back to start the final stage of the rebuild.

The bottom line is that we'll soon learn if the new regime is any smarter than the previous one, when it comes to non-star players entering unrestricted free agency.

 

[bleedgreen]

This will be an interesting deadline for us. If we are missing the playoffs again which seems obvious right now, will pk push to move estaal? What direction will rf go in? Should be fun to watch.

 

[Francis10]

Oh trust me, I got that. The thread I made on that trade board got torn to shreds.

Its cause all Leafs prospects are the next Gretzky or Bobby Orr. Talking to a Leafs fan is like talking to the wall. They are the most hated team/fans up here in Canada for a reason.

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

Reilly is more legit than most prospects they talk up.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

To be precise, it *should* have started when Gleason and Ruutu were pending UFAs in 2009-10. Resigning those two to matching four-year contracts was the beginning of the downward "we like our group" spiral that we're still trying to come out of now.

Now, Sekera is better than Gleason and Tlusty is probably better than Ruutu (especially if you factor in health), but that only means we should get even more talent back to start the final stage of the rebuild.

The bottom line is that we'll soon learn if the new regime is any smarter than the previous one, when it comes to non-star players entering unrestricted free agency.

While the correct decision at the time was to move Gleason and Ruutu (though I understand JR's reasoning for standing pat), that does not mean that every impeding FA must be dealt. To compete you need talent, and you can't amass talented players if you keep trading them away. Instead, you should do a case-by-case basis.

If the Hurricanes trade Sekera and get no present NHL impact in return, they will be down to one defender who would be in the top-4 on most other teams. 2 if Hainsey returns to his level last year, assuming he even can. Sekera is a great player, and one they need on the d-line. If you can resign him, you do it. Simple as that. One cog to consider, and I've said this in the past, is that the Hurricanes could acquire Marc Staal at the deadline if he is not interested in re-upping in New York, simply because the fear of Carolina luring him with playing time (stuck behind McDonaugh) and brothers will cause his value to depreciate, combined with his subpar play this season. Staal, Sekera and Faulk is a great core to build a defense around.

Tlusty, not so much. The Hurricanes are saturated at forward with the Staal's, Semin, Skinner and Lindholm taking the heavy lifting both offensively and defensively (love you J. Staal!) and with solid support (finally!) from Nash, Rask, Boychuk and Gerbe, is Tlusty really needed? He's a great player, does all the little things well, but he doesn't have the talent to take the Hurricanes to new heights. They need ES scoring, and Slutty will get paid like he can bring that when he really doesn't. So while I want to retain Tlusty, they would be better off trading him for a kings ransom.

I just want to reiterate, though, and I don't think you are saying this, that just because the Hurricanes got horribly burned when they stood pat with Ruutu and Gleason does not mean that trading your FA's is what you have to do every time.

 

[What the Faulk]

Reilly is more legit than most prospects they talk up.

I don't disagree, but Francis10 is right. That thread is full of nonsense. You'd think he was already an established star with the way they were carrying on.

 

[Ole Gil]

Its cause all Leafs prospects are the next Gretzky or Bobby Orr. Talking to a Leafs fan is like talking to the wall. They are the most hated team/fans up here in Canada for a reason.

My favorite thing, was when Kadri had a big season during the strike year, and he disappeared from the trade forums. Then he was mediocre the next year, and he popped right back in.

"Oh shoot, he actually turned into the player we were pretending he was going to become!"

 

[Unsustainable]

Completely unexciting trade idea here. If we find that we can't sign Sekera, why not flip him to the Rangers for Marc Staal? We can debate for the next four months about who is "better," but that's not the important question. The important question is "which of them will play for us for $5 million per?" I think the better bet for that is Staal.

I asked that in the trade board, most Rangers would, and think they would have to add something small.

 

[nobuddy]

Completely unexciting trade idea here. If we find that we can't sign Sekera, why not flip him to the Rangers for Marc Staal? We can debate for the next four months about who is "better," but that's not the important question. The important question is "which of them will play for us for $5 million per?" I think the better bet for that is Staal.

The difference of course being that Sekera is worth $5 million a year, and Marc Staal well, isn't.

 

[RodTheBawd]

Bringing in Marc would essentially lead to re-signing Eric long-term, which all sounds too JRish for me.

 

[rocky7]

I just can't see them moving EStaal at the deadline. Maybe during the off season but the entire franchise is marketed around the guy for better or worse. While I don't think they'll bring in MStaal, that wouldn't surprise me either, regardless of whether or not he's on a downward spiral in his career.

 

[Joe McGrath]

Maybe they sign Marc and Eric on July 1 to matching $6 mil deals (5 for Marc 4 addition for Eric) that way all 3 have the same basic contract.

I'm not saying that's the direction they should necessarily go, but you spend $24 mil a year on the 3 of them equally. If you want both at market value it's going to cost an extra million or two a year.

If the plan for the brothers is to just play together, and I don't know if that's the case, I'm going to be very disappointed if Francis trades anything of value for him. Especially Sekera since he's their best trade chip since I don't even know when. Maybe Danny Markov.

 

[rocky7]

Moving Sekera, unless he wants to go, would be a huge boneheaded decision....but who knows what these guys would do.....