GDT: GDT #15 New York Islanders @ Vancouver Canucks | Bowie Horvat Returns | November 15th | Too Late EST (10) PM | F/4-3 OTL

[Osakahaus]

This game is further proof of the coaching staff refusing to adjust to the game. If they pull the same stuff to the Kraken, who are also struggling like this team, then I have no hope in them beating Calgary. The west coast swing constantly kills the islanders. This is just further proof of the core being rotten and needing repairs.

The bitching over Bo and Barzal in a 3v3 OT when 3v3 has consistently been this teams worst aspect since 2021 is ridiculous. They are 9-23 in OT/SO's since then. This isn't an issue over those two failing to cover their man: its the issue that the islanders lack the talent to keep up with the big boys.

 

[SI90]

There ya go...way too much of this. Seriously, way too much.

There is some sort of disconnect between the players and the coaching staff.

While Lane was thought to be a new voice, and technically is(was) and yup, did not mind the hire.....His voice is not new enough....or maybe strong enough?.....or he has the wrong staff. Either or all, one can not fire the players (at least not all at once though that would be interesting), so....time to either start firing coaching staff, the head coach, or bloody all of them. Either way it needs to be done soon as possible as it should have been done this past Sunday.

It’s so abundantly clear there’s a disconnect. Maybe they like Lane but the message ain’t getting through.

 

[Rehabguy]

Im also a big barzal fan. But he does some infuriating crap. The over passing....the terrible penalties. His OT play.

I'll give you some of that. OT play not his forte but I didn't see anything wrong obviously with his play last night. The over passing at times yes, but I think he becomes so noticeable to Islander fans because of his incredible puck possession time. His mistakes become more obvious because he has the puck so often on his stick but taken as a whole I'm sure glad he's on our team.

 

[doublechili]

Re: the OT winner, there's blame to be shared by Barzal, Horvat and Pelech (although Pelech was playing a man, and in 3v3 the D doesn't always have to stay back so I actually cut him slack). As for Barzal or Horvat, I'm not a Barzal basher but let's not forget it was Quinn Hughes who he was covering and then left. If in football a fast CB was covering a fast WR and then left him for a linebacker to cover instead, there would be no question who was at fault. Barzal should have stayed with Hughes.

Barzal's issues can be summed up pretty easily, I think: "Make the simple play". If you have an open shot, take it. If you have an open teammate just pass it - don't hold it to wait for the perfect moment to create a grade AAA chance - just take what they're giving you. Or, if in OT you're covering the other team's best skater, stick with him - don't leave him to try to get to the puck to create an offensive chance. Does he not listen to coaches, or are they not telling him this?

Not sure if anyone mentioned it, but at least twice during OT an Isles forward (maybe Palmieri and Holmstrom) tried to beat a guy wide and got steered to the boards and lost the puck. How does that even happen in 3v3 with all the open ice? They should know not to put themselves in that position where they give up possession so easily. I put that on coaching.

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

They need to build a new younger core. This team needs speed.

Everybody drink.

 

[Osakahaus]

Everybody drink.

Over what? The truth? Look at how they got dogwalked by Beau last night. Petterson, Miller, Hughes, Di Guiseppe and even Joshua dictated the pace of play. This team can be summed up like this

-Chip puck into end
-hope that the winger picks it up
-throw it to the defenseman for one shot, gets cleared and the opposition controls play until the next miracle clear after like 2 minutes in the islanders end
-repeat until they take dumb penalty

And the Lee-Pageau-Wahlstrom line was dreadful. Anders Lee has to go. But oh no, we gave him 7 years and a NTC!

 

[Rehabguy]

Re: the OT winner, there's blame to be shared by Barzal, Horvat and Pelech (although Pelech was playing a man, and in 3v3 the D doesn't always have to stay back so I actually cut him slack). As for Barzal or Horvat, I'm not a Barzal basher but let's not forget it was Quinn Hughes who he was covering and then left. If in football a fast CB was covering a fast WR and then left him for a linebacker to cover instead, there would be no question who was at fault. Barzal should have stayed with Hughes.

For sure Barzal would have stayed with Hughes if Horvat did not signal he was switching off. Regardless if there was a miscommunication mishap there it was clearly Horvat's responsibility to cover Hughes once Barzal vacated his position. Horvat was just lazy and inattentive that entire sequence.

 

[IslandersGER]

What this team really needs in addition to a god damn coaching change is another shock the core and country club trade. I'm ready for LaFontaine for Turgeon 2.0 and would happily offer up Barzal as this generation's LaFontaine. The problem will be finding the next Turgeon.

unfortunately Barzal isn't this generations LaFontaine and even worse the whole league knows about that fact - no chance in hell to trade Barzal for a Turgeon

 

[PK Cronin]

For sure Barzal would have stayed with Hughes if Horvat did not signal he was switching off. Regardless if there was a miscommunication mishap there it was clearly Horvat's responsibility to cover Hughes once Barzal vacated his position. Horvat was just lazy and inattentive that entire sequence.

The fact that you think Horvat being in the same area is a signal that he's switching is very telling. That's not how switches work.

Let's say he did signal it though. What the f*** is Barzal doing exactly? Previously you mentioned his positioning was stopping a 2 on 1. How exactly is he doing that?

 

[Rehabguy]

The fact that you think Horvat being in the same area is a signal that he's switching is very telling. That's not how switches work.

Let's say he did signal it though. What the f*** is Barzal doing exactly? Previously you mentioned his positioning was stopping a 2 on 1. How exactly is he doing that?

Let's move on PK. This argument is getting silly. They scored on us in OT. Game over.

unfortunately Barzal isn't this generations LaFontaine and even worse the whole league knows about that fact - no chance in hell to trade Barzal for a Turgeon

Truth. More like a wasted Adam Oates with no Hull or Neely to complete his passes.

 

[Steve55]

I tuned in during the second intermission and was pleasantly surprised to see the Isles leading 3-2 (Had to go to work later on last night). But they folded for the first half of period 3 until Hronek's 107 miles/hr slapshot that tied the game at 3. I can't believe the Isles decided to play after tying goal, where the Demko giveaway was their best shot. But it seemed the Canucks carried the play for most of the third period and OT, where I couldn't believe Quinn Hughes, a defenceman, had a breakaway on Sorokin and the rest is history.

 

[duster19]

What are watching? Horvats standing right next to him and curls the other way allowing the breakaway

I’m watching Barzal cover no one. He starts in the corner. Chases the puck to Hughes. Stays with Hughes for a bit then circles back up the ice. He’s covering no one. Out for a skate.

 

[PK Cronin]

Let's move on PK. This argument is getting silly. They scored on us in OT. Game over.

Once again you refuse to answer any questions and just want to move it along after I've given a pretty detailed breakdown of the play. You'll post paragraph after paragraph about how wrong other people are but won't actually answer any questions or provide any level of detail.

You made a claim that he was preventing a 2 on 1 from occurring, if he was switching with Horvat how was Barzal preventing a 2 on 1 from occurring? What exactly was he doing? This isn't rocket science or chess, you should be able to break this down for someone even as dumb as me.

 

[MJF]

I suspect the reason for the lack of communication is partially that they're gassed. People sometimes seem to think that being tired affects only muscles, not brains, and it's not true. As you said above, being able to distribute ice time better to forwards who are actually mobile would go a long way to solving other problems. Dragging Lee, Wahlstrom, Martin, etc. up and down the ice is not working. And Clutterbuck is fine at 10-12 minutes right now, but at much more TOI.

When Lambert has to shorten his bench so much in the 3rd period that he’s only using 8 forwards for the last 4 minutes of the game fatigue certainly becomes a factor.

 

[PK Cronin]

I’m watching Barzal cover no one. He starts in the corner. Chases the puck to Hughes. Stays with Hughes for a bit then circles back up the ice. He’s covering no one. Out for a skate.

The "that guy was closer so it's his fault" argument is what you're dealing with here.

 

[PK Cronin]

When Lambert has to shorten his bench so much in the 3rd period that he’s only using 8 forwards for the last 4 minutes of the game fatigue certainly becomes a factor.

Previously it was also when he'd start to shorten the defensive side when Bolduc was playing too. Mixing up pairs late in the game could lead to more fatigue and potential communication issues since they aren't playing with the same pairing (or on the same side).

 

[IslandersGER]

Truth. More like a wasted Adam Oates with no Hull or Neely to complete his passes.

that's still overestimating Barzal. Oates had proven he could produce a Hull or Neely if they are next to him. Barzal hasn't proven anything but being in his rookie season a superb second fiddle behind the traitor. Since then Barzal was sometimes a good, sometimes a very good player, but not the franchise player type of Lafontaine or Turgeon. If Barzal were the new Oates then Lee would score 40 every year or at least Wahlstrom would score 30. This are pipe dreams, not only because lack of talent next to Barzal, but Barzal himself lacks the talent being a reborn Oates. Barzals best skill is his speed and unfortunately for him in the years since he entered the league more and more other players matching his speed and therefore he's no more outstanding like in his early days

 

[Rehabguy]

that's still overestimating Barzal. Oates had proven he could produce a Hull or Neely if they are next to him. Barzal hasn't proven anything but being in his rookie season a superb second fiddle behind the traitor. Since then Barzal was sometimes a good, sometimes a very good player, but not the franchise player type of Lafontaine or Turgeon. If Barzal were the new Oates then Lee would score 40 every year or at least Wahlstrom would score 30. This are pipe dreams, not only because lack of talent next to Barzal, but Barzal himself lacks the talent being a reborn Oates. Barzals best skill is his speed and unfortunately for him in the years since he entered the league more and more other players matching his speed and therefore he's no more outstanding like in his early days

That's sad if true, but I don't consider a Wahlstrom or Lee to be good comparisons to Hull or Neely. Eberle was Barzal's best line-mate and that's not saying much.

 

[Rehabguy]

Once again you refuse to answer any questions and just want to move it along after I've given a pretty detailed breakdown of the play. You'll post paragraph after paragraph about how wrong other people are but won't actually answer any questions or provide any level of detail.

You made a claim that he was preventing a 2 on 1 from occurring, if he was switching with Horvat how was Barzal preventing a 2 on 1 from occurring? What exactly was he doing? This isn't rocket science or chess, you should be able to break this down for someone even as dumb as me.

I did answer your questions PK several posts ago. You just have to acknowledge them yourself. Like I said let's just move on. I don't think we are ever going to agree with what happened here regardless of what either one of us says.

The 2 on 1 was mis-stated by me. The point being you don't be in a situation where you allow odd man breaks because both of you were covering one player.

 

[isles55]

Barzal leads this team in shots.

 

[The Real JT]

I didn’t watch the game so of course I’ll give my opinion.

3v3 OT and the shootout are bullshit parlor games so I can’t get too upset that we failed in that setting again. Don’t get me wrong, I know it’s part of the league scoring system so we should maximize our efforts to play that game. It’s still a minor issue for me.

When it comes down to it, I remained focused on our 90 minute game. Sounds like there were positives to take from last night’s effort against a good team but once again we cratered with the lead.

I’ve been in the pessimistic camp from the beginning of the season but there truly is time to turn this around. Tonight is only one game but I’d like to see a solid performance by our guys against a weak Seattle team that, like us, is coming off a b2b.

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

Over what? The truth?

You're starting from a conclusion and working backwards to fulfill it.

 

[PJGooch]

Why are we starting it there when the play developed way before then? You're just going to ignore anything that happened before then because this is the worst look for Horvat, to whom I've already assigned some blame.

Incorrect. Barzal was in position until the last second when he decided to float to the puck carrier. There's no reason to go toward the puck carrier in this situation when Pelech already has him covered and Horvat is taking the third man. In fact, if Horvat does cover Hughes in this scenario the third man is going to have a lot of options with where to skate when he gets given the puck because Barzal is standing in the center of the ice. Being in the middle of the ice is generally very bad if you're standing still.

If you look at the time stamps, again, and notice that the information being given to Horvat is all indicating that Barzal is going to cover Hughes maybe you wouldn't cling to the one micro second that makes Horvat look like he f***ed up royally. Did Horvat make a mistake? Absolutely. He should've recognized Barzal was floating out of position and tried to recover. Does that absolve Barzal from making the poor decision? Absolutely not and ultimately it was his mess up that created confusion and allowed his man to go uncovered for a breakaway.

Amazing breakdown. I don't really care who was at fault, so hopefully I'm not branded a "hater." Looked to me like Hughes saw two guys gliding with nobody back and did what all intelligent players would do in that situation.

Meanwhile we have offensive players who use the "skate wide and fall down" routine in OT. Not nearly as effective.

 

[crashthenet]

The Dobson -Aho pairing. My god, what idiot does this. Aho turnover out of the corner led to the 5v3. I can't believe he is playing in the NHL.

First shift of the 3rd, Barzal elects not to shoot but to try and get to his backhand on Demko's right side. Why? Turnover and eventual scoring chance the other way while he extends his shift.

I believe Barzal should have picked up Hughes but unclear why Pelech, who looks like Andy MacDonald lately, commits slowly to the puck carrier. Tough to watch.

Woodcroft or Lambert? Hmmm.

 

[Throttle]

Never doubt stupidity

They will hire someone with clout in the league office.