GDT: Game #27: Anaheim Ducks vs Winnipeg Jets, 5pm PT, BSSC

[CrazyDuck4u]

 

[Hockey Duckie]

We'll you make the trade to shakeup the team. It's either that or the coach gets canned

We didn't do any movement last year and the coach got canned after the season ended. This year, we have improved in several areas (PP, PK, and ES GA), but stalled in one area (ES GF) and degraded in another (incurring penalties).

Last year, we had one rookie in McTavish. This year, we have started the season with six rookies: C Carlsson, C Groulx, LD/RD LaCombe, LD Mintyukov, RD Luneau, and G Dostal.

It's a development season that is currently marred by a mass of injuries. Maybe people can start to realize that sometimes a lack of talent can dictate a lack of winning.

Look at our AHL team. They were on a 13-game losing streak. Then they finally get captain forward De Leo as well as G Suchanek got promoted due to an injury to G Stalock. With those two into the fold, they've helped the Gulls go 5-2 since. De Leo solved a lot of forward line issues.

 

[190Octane]

I re-watched the Strome hit… looked like he was trying to hit a ghost.

Didn’t miss in the fight though.

 

[Ducks DVM]

I feel like he’s had more impact than any of our veteran top players and at 18yo

Invisible also means nothing glaringly bad too?

Compared to Terry, Fowler, Killorn less mistakes is t bad for a kid

Yes and no. He’s outstanding for an 18 year old, but when your two wingers are borderline 1st line players at the best of times, and it’s not the best of times, the 1C has to be supporting them, and he frequently isn’t. Invisible because you’re not doing anything useful isn’t any more helpful than trying to do something and utterly failing, it’s just a different type of not helping the team win. Yes, he’s young, yes, he’s learning, and yes, that means that the line isn’t going to work well, and that yes, part of the reason is him. That’s not “unfair”, that’s actually “fair” to point out. It’s not whatabboutism, it’s pointing out that we don’t have anyone on the top line that’s got the current skill set to be on an NHL 1st line. I’m not saying he is the WORST player on the line, but I am saying that his play isn’t actually helping the other two much on many nights. Tonight was one of those nights. For people who put any stock in those charts, he’s been very not good the last 2 games, mediocre the game before, and lights out the game before that. Even mediocre tonight of against chicago and we potentially pull out a win. Yes, the same can be said about frick and frack, but Carlsson managed to underperform them two games running.

Still super glad we got him.

 

[duxfan1101]

We are now only 1 point ahead of San Jose and Chicago.

 

[Sean Garrity]

Yes and no. He’s outstanding for an 18 year old, but when your two wingers are borderline 1st line players at the best of times, and it’s not the best of times, the 1C has to be supporting them, and he frequently isn’t. Invisible because you’re not doing anything useful isn’t any more helpful than trying to do something and utterly failing, it’s just a different type of not helping the team win. Yes, he’s young, yes, he’s learning, and yes, that means that the line isn’t going to work well, and that yes, part of the reason is him. That’s not “unfair”, that’s actually “fair” to point out. It’s not whatabboutism, it’s pointing out that we don’t have anyone on the top line that’s got the current skill set to be on an NHL 1st line. I’m not saying he is the WORST player on the line, but I am saying that his play isn’t actually helping the other two much on many nights. Tonight was one of those nights. For people who put any stock in those charts, he’s been very not good the last 2 games, mediocre the game before, and lights out the game before that. Even mediocre tonight of against chicago and we potentially pull out a win. Yes, the same can be said about frick and frack, but Carlsson managed to underperform them two games running.

Still super glad we got him.

He definitely doesn't have the puck enough recently and looks a bit less explosive, but I'm not sure why. Not really worried about it, hell Bedard was invisible against us when not on the PP.

 

[JAHV]

We'll you make the trade to shakeup the team. It's either that or the coach gets canned

Why would the Ducks need to do that?

I'm not saying Verbeek should sit on his hands and do nothing. If a trade is there to improve the long-term outlook of the team, he should do it. But this is not a team that is under-performing expectations. At least not significantly. They're below where we thought they would be, but not by much, and the shortfall can primarily be attributed to injuries to several top of the lineup players.

Shake-up trades (or coach firings) are for presumed playoff teams or veteran bubble teams that aren't playing up to their talent level. The Ducks do not qualify for either category. They're a team coming off an abysmal season with a ton of rookies, some veterans playing out the string, and a new coach implementing a new system (plus the injuries mentioned above). There's no need to make a trade just to shake things up. And there's absolutely zero chance the coach gets fired 27 games into his first season, unless there's some sort of gross malpractice that's uncovered.

 

[The Midnight Burrito]

We'll you make the trade to shakeup the team. It's either that or the coach gets canned

They're losing because they're bad, not because they're not playing to their potential.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

Anybody who plays poorly in a game deserves to get called out by the fans. It's the nature of sports. But if I'm ranking the players, season to date, on who deserves the most criticism, Carlsson is far down the list.

As for Terry, nobody knows for a fact what his problem is. But I do get tired of people making up a convenient excuse that allows many to have a warm and fuzzy feeling that it's an acceptable excuse and therefore he doesn't deserve criticism for his play. If he keeps playing like shit he deserve to get called out on it.

 

[Mr Rogers]

Drysdale’s shadow is about to be etched on the wall behind him he’s spent so much time up there lol, and I say that as a fan

 

[Hockey Duckie]

Loved his comments about holding onto the stick. Paraphrasing, "We've been losing for a while now. There's nowhere to go, but up. If you still are holding your stick, then it's only in your head."

 

[The Midnight Burrito]

Loved his comments about holding onto the stick. Paraphrasing, "We've been losing for a while now. There's nowhere to go, but up. If you still are holding your stick, then it's only in your head."

His response to the idea that guys were gripping their sticks too hard is basically don't do that.

 

[Ducks DVM]

He definitely doesn't have the puck enough recently and looks a bit less explosive, but I'm not sure why. Not really worried about it, hell Bedard was invisible against us when not on the PP.

Agreed, I think it’s just an 18 year old being a bit overwhelmed. He’ll get better. I think he needs to not be “the guy” just yet.

 

[ZEBROA]

Learn from this game Carlsson and on to the next! Dont think about that Swedish christmas food just yet!

 

[Kalv]

Learn from this game Carlsson and on to the next! Dont think about that Swedish christmas food just yet!

Now I want to go to IKEA for mashed potatoes and Swedish meatballs, thank you

 

[HanSolo]

Too many men you mean?

I mean that's an easy one. I'm referring more to puck management tendencies and the rooster's general approach and capacity to winning battles all over the ice. Things that get honed and refined through proper drilling at practice.

In a lot of ways, this team has made significant improvements on execution of hockey fundamentals but I don't think he's getting the best of out these guys at the moment.

And you can really stop reading there but I'd add that I don't think it all stems from coaching but I've seen multiple examples of weak teams on paper executing better than this group can. It's one thing if the roster just isn't good enough but they try their best and don't get far. Obviously, this roster is a far cry from a cup contender. But this being a development season you want to see guys improving where they were deficient last year. And they have, all things considered, but it's had its limitations, and I don't think this roster should be as bad as their place in the league standings suggests. There's a lot of fundamentals of the game that I think they have in them to execute better but for whatever reason they're not. I think it's gotta be in one part coaching, and it's just that much harder when veterans, who are supposed to set an example for the future of this team, are floundering as much as they have been.

The only times this team is fun to watch and shows promise that things are on the upswing is when a notable name on the roster has a good performance that the other guys rally around. Tonight, I really feel like a better team would have shredded the Ducks. No one had a particularly good night inclusive of young guys like Leo and Minty. But watching guys like Terry, Fowler, Henrique, who are supposed to set an example play like trash, it's really frustrating.

 

[HanSolo]

Carlsson isn't great more often than we like to admit. He makes a lot of flashy plays, but he also disappears for parts of many games, doesn’t always puck support well after the flashy plays, and is a non factor every 3-4 games. He’s only really played a couple of complete games this year IMO.

I feel like I agree with parts of this and disagree with others.

Like this was the first game where I felt he was truly invisible from start to finish. Most games he's appeared in he's still generating at least a small handful of chances and hounding puck carriers. So I really disagree that he's a non factor every 3-4 games. I think that's a bit of a stretch, there was tonight where it was indisputable and a couple games when he was dealing with the hip issue (or so we all think) where, yeah it was lower impact but he was still making good plays.

I would agree that there are games where he "disappears" for stretches but I don't think it's always his fault. A lot of the times his line either gets hemmed in or his puck support from the D and wings don't put him in a position to make an impact play before a minute of ice time has run out. Then of course there's the situations where he makes an ill advised pass or mishandles the puck for a turnover and I think a lot of that goes to the inexperience of being an 18 year old in the best league in the world. None of our kids have been exempt from rookie mistakes. In any case that will improve with time as he learns how to independently control play on his own (which we've seen shades of already), as the team around him inevitably improves (mileage on that improvement TBD), and as he grows into his body and hones his own fundamentals for NHL level play. I mean this was only his 19th game in the NHL.

And given that he's only an 18 year old with barely 20 games in this league, I think the last line about playing complete games really depends on your definition. If that means doing good things with a positive impact on game flow every shift of a game, I don't think you can say any of these guys have had more than a fww "complete games." All in all, if you're asking me to be objective and name the most positive effective players on this team, that list would slot Leo somewhere with McTavish, Vatrano, Gibson, Mintyukov, Gudas, and at this point I'd struggle to put Terry above him. I mean the kid is fifth on the team in scoring as an eighteen year old with fewer games played and could easily have 5-10 more points if his linemates could finish better and if a few of his shots off the post went in.

I don't really know how much more you're exactly expecting. Like sure, tonight was a sore disappointment from the kid, but I think this take as a whole is a bit harsh.

 

[ZEBROA]

Now I want to go to IKEA for mashed potatoes and Swedish meatballs, thank you

Seen the meatball they sell in UK?
Move over, Christmas ham: IKEA debuts GIANT 'turkey-sized' meatball

 

[MMC]

 

[Leonardo87]

Connor McDavid would struggle to score on this team. That’s all I have to say.

 

[2faded]

He definitely doesn't have the puck enough recently and looks a bit less explosive, but I'm not sure why. Not really worried about it, hell Bedard was invisible against us when not on the PP.

Because Terry is almost always the one carrying the puck on that line and he doesn't pass it.

 

[dracom]

Connor McDavid would struggle to score on this team. That’s all I have to say.

He would only put up like 80 points in a season here lol

 

[lwvs84]

He would only put up like 80 points in a season here lol

If he could stay healthy...

 

[cheesymc]

It's crazy that even with a very exciting start to the season that we are 1 point from being last in the league. I'm curious if we will make some moves if we continue to tank before year-end. It wouldn't be a terrible idea if we are able to get some early takers for Gibby and Henrique and give those opportunities to younger players to develop more.

 

[Ducks DVM]

I feel like I agree with parts of this and disagree with others.

Like this was the first game where I felt he was truly invisible from start to finish. Most games he's appeared in he's still generating at least a small handful of chances and hounding puck carriers. So I really disagree that he's a non factor every 3-4 games. I think that's a bit of a stretch, there was tonight where it was indisputable and a couple games when he was dealing with the hip issue (or so we all think) where, yeah it was lower impact but he was still making good plays.

I would agree that there are games where he "disappears" for stretches but I don't think it's always his fault. A lot of the times his line either gets hemmed in or his puck support from the D and wings don't put him in a position to make an impact play before a minute of ice time has run out. Then of course there's the situations where he makes an ill advised pass or mishandles the puck for a turnover and I think a lot of that goes to the inexperience of being an 18 year old in the best league in the world. None of our kids have been exempt from rookie mistakes. In any case that will improve with time as he learns how to independently control play on his own (which we've seen shades of already), as the team around him inevitably improves (mileage on that improvement TBD), and as he grows into his body and hones his own fundamentals for NHL level play. I mean this was only his 19th game in the NHL.

And given that he's only an 18 year old with barely 20 games in this league, I think the last line about playing complete games really depends on your definition. If that means doing good things with a positive impact on game flow every shift of a game, I don't think you can say any of these guys have had more than a fww "complete games." All in all, if you're asking me to be objective and name the most positive effective players on this team, that list would slot Leo somewhere with McTavish, Vatrano, Gibson, Mintyukov, Gudas, and at this point I'd struggle to put Terry above him. I mean the kid is fifth on the team in scoring as an eighteen year old with fewer games played and could easily have 5-10 more points if his linemates could finish better and if a few of his shots off the post went in.

I don't really know how much more you're exactly expecting. Like sure, tonight was a sore disappointment from the kid, but I think this take as a whole is a bit harsh.

I’m not even remotely saying that he is THE problem, but rather that his play is A problem contributing to the malaise of the top line. Which is understandable, he doesn’t belong on it yet, we just have no other reasonable options.

As far as a complete game, I’m not talking shift to shift, nobody looks good shift to shift. I’m more noticing that he will look strikingly good for a period, usually the first period, then recede into the shadows for the remainder of the game. He also has a tendency to do the same “beat 2-3 players on my own” game that Terry does, but he does it at higher speed, and 95% of the time loses or gets knocked off the puck. It’s just as pointless as when Terry does it (Terry, in previous years, usually came out the other side with the puck, neither of them usually does this year). The one goal Leason got from following him on one of those forays he DID get through, but off the type of shot Fowler would laugh at. He’s 15-20# too light to be getting away with those moves yet. Hope for the future though. He’s going to be amazing. He’s just…almost, at this point. Nothing wrong with him being that way at this age, and nothing wrong with pointing it out IMO.

Carlsson would absolutely have a higher points total if Killorn, Terry, and Zegras could pot a few goals. And Killorn, Terry, and Zegras would also have more points if that group, AND Carlsson, would pot a few goals. Carlsson has missed two completely open nets on passes from Terry in the last 3 games. Thats not damning him, but it happened. The “why” may be understandable, but the “what“ is irrefutable.

I’m not actually expecting anything else out of Carlsson. I’m just pointing out that he’s NOT a guy who can carry (or honestly even belongs on) a first line at this point in his career, especially not one with borderline 1st line talent. Nor should he be expected to. I just think that needs to be taken into account when we rail on the other guys - they are absolutely not getting paid like legit star 1st line players in this current Cap dynamic, we should stop expecting legit star play out of them. This team will win with a system and team depth, and they seem confused on one of those and completely lacking in the other right now. Hopefully next week will be different.