Speculation: Free Agency thread (Part III)

[Kriss E]

Here is a controversial statement

Duchene plus 4 1sts >> Marner

I'd say that it depends. For the Leafs, I dont think so. Adding 4 first wont help them a whole lot.
Marner is elite, Duchene isnt on that level.

If they're willing to let Marner go..then just trade him now, I'm sure you could get a better return that can help in immediate future.

 

[the]

I better see a tweet of Duchene with a Hab pyjama on July 1st.

 

[crazyd74]

Getting Duchene and planning the next few years...

[ 2019-2020 ]
Sign Armia and Lehkonen 2.2M a piece, 2 years each.

This brings our cap space to 4.3M

Trade Shaw and Peca, recup 5.2M which brings our cap at 9.5M

Sign Duchene to anything lower than 8.5M

[ 2020-2021 ]
Recup Weise + Thompson + Deslauriers salary (4.3M total) and add it to Domi's current salary (3.150M) which makes a cap hit of - roughly - 7.5M

[ 2021-2022 ]
Recup Tatar's salary, split it in half and reallocate to the kids: KK + Poehling. They each will have a cap hit of 3.325M - rounded off to 3.4M - on 2 year deals

Recup Weal's salary + some extra space under the cap to add to Gally' current cap hit: 3.750M + 1.4M = 5.15M + extra cap space due to higher cap, we can offer 6M

Add Armia's salary to Danault's current cap hit: 2.2M + 3.083M = 5.283M + extra cap space due to higher cap, we can offer 5.5M

Evaluate if we keep or not Lehkonen, will depend if any of the prospects are making a hard push or not.

Caufield will still be on his ELC, Suzuki may be up for his first RFA contract and we still have a year left on the Drouin and Byron contracts (counts for 8.9M).

Our Forward salary structure would be:
Duchene 8.5M
Domi 7.5M
Gallagher 6M
Drouin 5.5M
Danault 5.5M
KK 3.4M
Poehling 3.4M
Byron 3.4M

In 2023-2024 the Drouin and Byron money will go the KK + Poehling + Suzuki and Caufield.

All things considered, the piece all fall quite nicely into place.

 

[waffledave]

A lot to consider here.

People bringing up Domi and future contracts have a point. I think if MB goes and signs Duchene for what it takes to sign him, it means he doesn't have full faith in Domi repeating. Otherwise he would have yet another guy in the 10mil range and that will never work.

He also may believe Domi can repeat and plans to trade him before his last year, like Karlsson/Paciotetty/Duchene... I like Domi but this is not a terrible idea considering what he could return in a trade. And we'd have Duchene so the depth exists to make that move.

Yeah Duchene only has done 70+ twice but Domi has only done it once and most have no doubt he'll do it again. Personally I am on the fence with Duchene and partly just want it to happen so I can get excited about something. It could go really well or it could bomb and that would finally end this era of MB. I think it could work, for the record. I could see both guys top 80 if they play together.

I can look past the Uber stuff. I hate to see that stuff but everyone has seen situations like that in their jobs I am sure. To me it says as much about the coaching staff and team culture as it does about the players.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

Getting Duchene and planning the next few years...

[ 2019-2020 ]
Sign Armia and Lehkonen 2.2M a piece, 2 years each.

This brings our cap space to 4.3M

Trade Shaw and Peca, recup 5.2M which brings our cap at 9.5M

Sign Duchene to anything lower than 8.5M

[ 2020-2021 ]
Recup Weise + Thompson + Deslauriers salary (4.3M total) and add it to Domi's current salary (3.150M) which makes a cap hit of - roughly - 7.5M

[ 2021-2022 ]
Recup Tatar's salary, split it in half and reallocate to the kids: KK + Poehling. They each will have a cap hit of 3.325M - rounded off to 3.4M - on 2 year deals

Recup Weal's salary + some extra space under the cap to add to Gally' current cap hit: 3.750M + 1.4M = 5.15M + extra cap space due to higher cap, we can offer 6M

Add Armia's salary to Danault's current cap hit: 2.2M + 3.083M = 5.283M + extra cap space due to higher cap, we can offer 5.5M

Evaluate if we keep or not Lehkonen, will depend if any of the prospects are making a hard push or not.

Caufield will still be on his ELC, Suzuki may be up for his first RFA contract and we still have a year left on the Drouin and Byron contracts (counts for 8.9M).

Our Forward salary structure would be:
Duchene 8.5M
Domi 7.5M
Gallagher 6M
Drouin 5.5M
Danault 5.5M
KK 3.4M
Poehling 3.4M
Byron 3.4M

In 2023-2024 the Drouin and Byron money will go the KK + Poehling + Suzuki and Caufield.

All things considered, the piece all fall quite nicely into place.

and nothing was done for a LHD

 

[ForeverHabs97]

Getting Duchene and planning the next few years...

[ 2019-2020 ]
Sign Armia and Lehkonen 2.2M a piece, 2 years each.

This brings our cap space to 4.3M

Trade Shaw and Peca, recup 5.2M which brings our cap at 9.5M

Sign Duchene to anything lower than 8.5M

[ 2020-2021 ]
Recup Weise + Thompson + Deslauriers salary (4.3M total) and add it to Domi's current salary (3.150M) which makes a cap hit of - roughly - 7.5M

[ 2021-2022 ]
Recup Tatar's salary, split it in half and reallocate to the kids: KK + Poehling. They each will have a cap hit of 3.325M - rounded off to 3.4M - on 2 year deals

Recup Weal's salary + some extra space under the cap to add to Gally' current cap hit: 3.750M + 1.4M = 5.15M + extra cap space due to higher cap, we can offer 6M

Add Armia's salary to Danault's current cap hit: 2.2M + 3.083M = 5.283M + extra cap space due to higher cap, we can offer 5.5M

Evaluate if we keep or not Lehkonen, will depend if any of the prospects are making a hard push or not.

Caufield will still be on his ELC, Suzuki may be up for his first RFA contract and we still have a year left on the Drouin and Byron contracts (counts for 8.9M).

Our Forward salary structure would be:
Duchene 8.5M
Domi 7.5M
Gallagher 6M
Drouin 5.5M
Danault 5.5M
KK 3.4M
Poehling 3.4M
Byron 3.4M

In 2023-2024 the Drouin and Byron money will go the KK + Poehling + Suzuki and Caufield.

All things considered, the piece all fall quite nicely into place.

In this scenario; I'm all for it 100% but there's too many pieces that have to fall just right.
Having Duchene come to us under 8.5M in this UFA market is a big if. Someone will be willing to pay more and he may go for more money.
If we can clear/trade Peca, Shaw or even Weise this summer to clear more space for the future, then I'm 100% on board.
Trying to trade or buyout Alzner rather than have him sit in the minors might help clear some cap space and contracts to get more LD/Backup Goalies.

 

[mariolemieux66]

Getting Duchene and planning the next few years...

[ 2019-2020 ]
Sign Armia and Lehkonen 2.2M a piece, 2 years each.

This brings our cap space to 4.3M

Trade Shaw and Peca, recup 5.2M which brings our cap at 9.5M

Sign Duchene to anything lower than 8.5M

[ 2020-2021 ]
Recup Weise + Thompson + Deslauriers salary (4.3M total) and add it to Domi's current salary (3.150M) which makes a cap hit of - roughly - 7.5M

[ 2021-2022 ]
Recup Tatar's salary, split it in half and reallocate to the kids: KK + Poehling. They each will have a cap hit of 3.325M - rounded off to 3.4M - on 2 year deals

Recup Weal's salary + some extra space under the cap to add to Gally' current cap hit: 3.750M + 1.4M = 5.15M + extra cap space due to higher cap, we can offer 6M

Add Armia's salary to Danault's current cap hit: 2.2M + 3.083M = 5.283M + extra cap space due to higher cap, we can offer 5.5M

Evaluate if we keep or not Lehkonen, will depend if any of the prospects are making a hard push or not.

Caufield will still be on his ELC, Suzuki may be up for his first RFA contract and we still have a year left on the Drouin and Byron contracts (counts for 8.9M).

Our Forward salary structure would be:
Duchene 8.5M
Domi 7.5M
Gallagher 6M
Drouin 5.5M
Danault 5.5M
KK 3.4M
Poehling 3.4M
Byron 3.4M

In 2023-2024 the Drouin and Byron money will go the KK + Poehling + Suzuki and Caufield.

All things considered, the piece all fall quite nicely into place.

And I am afraid we are still a bubble team. Petry (35), Price (35) and Weber (37) all past their prime and most likely done.

 

[le_sean]

A lot to consider here.

People bringing up Domi and future contracts have a point. I think if MB goes and signs Duchene for what it takes to sign him, it means he doesn't have full faith in Domi repeating. Otherwise he would have yet another guy in the 10mil range and that will never work.

He also may believe Domi can repeat and plans to trade him before his last year, like Karlsson/Paciotetty/Duchene... I like Domi but this is not a terrible idea considering what he could return in a trade. And we'd have Duchene so the depth exists to make that move.

Yeah Duchene only has done 70+ twice but Domi has only done it once and most have no doubt he'll do it again. Personally I am on the fence with Duchene and partly just want it to happen so I can get excited about something. It could go really well or it could bomb and that would finally end this era of MB. I think it could work, for the record. I could see both guys top 80 if they play together.

I can look past the Uber stuff. I hate to see that stuff but everyone has seen situations like that in their jobs I am sure. To me it says as much about the coaching staff and team culture as it does about the players.

Or he thinks Domi can provide the same impact at his original position, LW. Then you have two 70 point players on the 1st line. When’s the last time the Habs have had that? 07-08? Except this time your 2nd line doesn’t have Higgins and Ryder. And your 3rd line doesn’t have Latendresse and Sergei Kostitsyn. Way more depth to go with the 1st line talent.

 

[Hins77]

Yeah duchene could be expensive but imo, he will be the skillest player if hes coming in Montreal. You trade a guy like byron or shaw or lehkonen for a LD i dont know. But elite skill level are not easy to find on ufa or trade market... i remember alex kovalev. When we needs a goal, he was there. Thats an elite skill level

 

[Guns n Roses]

I better see a tweet of Duchene with a Hab pyjama on July 1st.

Trust me dude, we will dodge a huge bullet, 9 million is ridiculous for him.

 

[ForeverHabs97]

Or he thinks Domi can provide the same impact at his original position, LW. Then you have two 70 point players on the 1st line. When’s the last time the Habs have had that? 07-08? Except this time your 2nd line doesn’t have Higgins and Ryder. And your 3rd line doesn’t have Latendresse and Sergei Kostitsyn. Way more depth to go with the 1st line talent.

Yeah and I think it's important we try and maintain that depth for more than just a season. We don't want to become a team like Edmonton or Toronto with so much skill upfront but not enough committed to depth. On the flip side if you commit too much to depth, you loose your top players like Columbus is going through. I think it's really about maintaining balance throughout the team and having Domi + Duchene would be a legit top line right now. Question is would it work and would it work long term.

 

[waffledave]

Or he thinks Domi can provide the same impact at his original position, LW. Then you have two 70 point players on the 1st line. When’s the last time the Habs have had that? 07-08? Except this time your 2nd line doesn’t have Higgins and Ryder. And your 3rd line doesn’t have Latendresse and Sergei Kostitsyn. Way more depth to go with the 1st line talent.

This would be my dream. But then Domi is going to ask for the same contract as Duchene and I don't know if you can make it work having 3 guys making above 10mil, that's almost half the cap on like 3 players plus Weber.

But imagine a forward core of Duchene, Domi, Gallagher, KK, Suzuki, Caulfield and guys like Danault, Poehling...

I don't think MB will address the holes on defense this summer. It's not going to be a long term or major acquisition. So give me Duchesne !

 

[webersshot]

Duchene had 36 goals and 81 points in 83 games. Pay the man. It's not going to hurt us. We have so many expendable players because of how good our farm system is and the beauty is you can keep them all together to contend for a couple years before saying goodbye to shaw, Byron, danault, Petry, Tatar, but look...

Domi - Duchene - Gallagher
Drouin - Kotkaniemi - Caufield
Poehling - Suzuki - Ylonen
Who - even - cares

Romanov - Weber
Mete - Juulsen
Kulak - Brook

Price

How sexy does that look

 

[ECWHSWI]

Getting Duchene and planning the next few years...

[ 2019-2020 ]
Sign Armia and Lehkonen 2.2M a piece, 2 years each.

This brings our cap space to 4.3M

Trade Shaw and Peca, recup 5.2M which brings our cap at 9.5M

Sign Duchene to anything lower than 8.5M

[ 2020-2021 ]
Recup Weise + Thompson + Deslauriers salary (4.3M total) and add it to Domi's current salary (3.150M) which makes a cap hit of - roughly - 7.5M

[ 2021-2022 ]
Recup Tatar's salary, split it in half and reallocate to the kids: KK + Poehling. They each will have a cap hit of 3.325M - rounded off to 3.4M - on 2 year deals

Recup Weal's salary + some extra space under the cap to add to Gally' current cap hit: 3.750M + 1.4M = 5.15M + extra cap space due to higher cap, we can offer 6M

Add Armia's salary to Danault's current cap hit: 2.2M + 3.083M = 5.283M + extra cap space due to higher cap, we can offer 5.5M

Evaluate if we keep or not Lehkonen, will depend if any of the prospects are making a hard push or not.

Caufield will still be on his ELC, Suzuki may be up for his first RFA contract and we still have a year left on the Drouin and Byron contracts (counts for 8.9M).

Our Forward salary structure would be:
Duchene 8.5M
Domi 7.5M
Gallagher 6M
Drouin 5.5M
Danault 5.5M
KK 3.4M
Poehling 3.4M
Byron 3.4M

In 2023-2024 the Drouin and Byron money will go the KK + Poehling + Suzuki and Caufield.

All things considered, the piece all fall quite nicely into place.

Duchene, 8.5... did you hear about the Skinner deal ? or the Hayes deal ?

 

[waffledave]

Shit now I'm going to be pissed if we don't get Dushane. Y'all got me excited.

 

[The Real Timo]

So is David Desharnais not a consideration at all? I mean..... you know what I mean.

 

[The Great Weal]

**** now I'm going to be pissed if we don't get Dushane. Y'all got me excited.

He can go to Nashville and become the next terrible contract over there. I'm not giving up $10 million for a 60 point player like Duchene.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

I'd say that it depends. For the Leafs, I dont think so. Adding 4 first wont help them a whole lot.
Marner is elite, Duchene isnt on that level.

If they're willing to let Marner go..then just trade him now, I'm sure you could get a better return that can help in immediate future.

As much as I like Marner I don't think he's lights out better than Duchene.

 

[HuGo Sham]

i doubt we sign duchene but if it happens, it insulates both domi / kotkaniemi. i believe shaw or byron maybe even a drouin get moved for a LD...and alzner bought out. the kids will be expected to step up like suzuki and play out their entry level deals to minimize paying three guys close to 26 mill

 

[Zorba]

He can go to Nashville and become the next terrible contract over there. I'm not giving up $10 million for a 60 point player like Duchene.

It’s not your money man. Stop worrying about what the habs will dish out. Molson and Bergevin have a job to win NOW and the future

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Trust me dude, we will dodge a huge bullet, 9 million is ridiculous for him.

Sure but all UFA prices are ridiculous. As if Duchene at 9 is crippling. It's fine. Its contracts like Alzner that are a bigger problem.

 

[Zorba]

As much as I like Marner I don't think he's lights out better than Duchene.

Duchene playing with Max could be dynamite

 

[Omar]

Getting Duchene and planning the next few years...

[ 2019-2020 ]
Sign Armia and Lehkonen 2.2M a piece, 2 years each.

This brings our cap space to 4.3M

Trade Shaw and Peca, recup 5.2M which brings our cap at 9.5M

Sign Duchene to anything lower than 8.5M

[ 2020-2021 ]
Recup Weise + Thompson + Deslauriers salary (4.3M total) and add it to Domi's current salary (3.150M) which makes a cap hit of - roughly - 7.5M

[ 2021-2022 ]
Recup Tatar's salary, split it in half and reallocate to the kids: KK + Poehling. They each will have a cap hit of 3.325M - rounded off to 3.4M - on 2 year deals

Recup Weal's salary + some extra space under the cap to add to Gally' current cap hit: 3.750M + 1.4M = 5.15M + extra cap space due to higher cap, we can offer 6M

Add Armia's salary to Danault's current cap hit: 2.2M + 3.083M = 5.283M + extra cap space due to higher cap, we can offer 5.5M

Evaluate if we keep or not Lehkonen, will depend if any of the prospects are making a hard push or not.

Caufield will still be on his ELC, Suzuki may be up for his first RFA contract and we still have a year left on the Drouin and Byron contracts (counts for 8.9M).

Our Forward salary structure would be:
Duchene 8.5M
Domi 7.5M
Gallagher 6M
Drouin 5.5M
Danault 5.5M
KK 3.4M
Poehling 3.4M
Byron 3.4M

In 2023-2024 the Drouin and Byron money will go the KK + Poehling + Suzuki and Caufield.

All things considered, the piece all fall quite nicely into place.

I get that, what I don’t get is how the 10 guys you’ve listed

Duchene 8.5M
Domi 7.5M
Gallagher 6M
Drouin 5.5M
Danault 5.5M
KK 3.4M
Poehling 3.4M
Byron 3.4M
Caufield
Suzuki

fit into the top 9. The spots don’t work for me. To me, Byron and/or Drouin are gone by 2021-22.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

i doubt we sign duchene but if it happens, it insulates both domi / kotkaniemi. i believe shaw or byron maybe even a drouin get moved for a LD...and alzner bought out. the kids will be expected to step up like suzuki and play out their entry level deals to minimize paying three guys close to 26 mill

I think we have too many wingers, always have. So yeah one of those would be first to go.

 

[OnTheRun]

So is David Desharnais not a consideration at all? I mean..... you know what I mean.

He got a 2 years deal in the NLA. DAVID DESHARNAIS UND VIKTOR STALBERG ZU FRIBOURG-GOTTERON | HC Fribourg-Gottéron

So, no.