Value of: Erik Karlsson - UFA. Will it happen? Where does he end up?

[Patty Ice]

You would have to think the Sharks are all in on him ,and are working out a deal...Otherwise that is one expensive rental

Whether he stays or not I make this deal every day of the week and twice on Sunday. While they gave up good assets, none were considered essential to the future core of the team (maybe Balcers if he hits his highest potential...he could be a steal). While he has been in and out of the lineup lately, Karlsson transforms this team into the deepest lineup I have ever seen with the Sharks.

 

[topshelf15]

Whether he stays or not I make this deal every day of the week and twice on Sunday. While they gave up good assets, none were considered essential to the future core of the team (maybe Balcers if he hits his highest potential...he could be a steal). While he has been in and out of the lineup lately, Karlsson transforms this team into the deepest lineup I have ever seen with the Sharks.

You essentially gave 2 1st,s a 2nd included with Balcers not too mention a serviceable rhd and a 40 to 50 point center...Singed EK and its no contest a win ..But for a rental even one as good as EK its getting a little high...I think he does sign with SJ though

 

[Crazy Joe Divola]

You essentially gave 2 1st,s a 2nd included with Balcers not too mention a serviceable rhd and a 40 to 50 point center...Singed EK and its no contest a win ..But for a rental even one as good as EK its getting a little high...I think he does sign with SJ though

It’s only two (late) firsts if the Sharks make the cup finals or re-sign him. Otherwise it’s just a 1st and a 2nd. DeMelo isnt very good and Tierney is a solid but unspectacular player. Norris and Balcers may be something at some point but who knows.

Even if just for a year of the best D man on the planet that’s a deal they make every time.

 

[topshelf15]

It’s only two (late) firsts if the Sharks make the cup finals or re-sign him. Otherwise it’s just a 1st and a 2nd. DeMelo isnt very good and Tierney is a solid but unspectacular player. Norris and Balcers may be something at some point but who knows.

Even if just for a year of the best D man on the planet that’s a deal they make every time.

Its 3 in that case,Norris was you 2017 1st rounder,and we have your 2020...

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

You essentially gave 2 1st,s a 2nd included with Balcers not too mention a serviceable rhd and a 40 to 50 point center...Singed EK and its no contest a win ..But for a rental even one as good as EK its getting a little high...I think he does sign with SJ though

The fact that you’re talking about a “serviceable RHD” as a notable part of the package just shows how weak of a package it was.

Dylan DeMelo is, on his absolute best day, serviceable. On his worst day, he’s not an NHL defenseman, and on the Sharks, he would be the 8th best defenseman right now. Sharks fans hated him when he was here because he played in a #6D role when he was more deserving of a #7D role. He was not qualified as an RFA, spent over a week as a UFA, and then circled back here on a very cheap deal.

Those are the kinds of irrelevant players that you never lose sleep over and never hesitate to include in a package for a star player.

 

[topshelf15]

The fact that you’re talking about a “serviceable RHD” as a notable part of the package just shows how weak of a package it was.

Dylan DeMelo is, on his absolute best day, serviceable. On his worst day, he’s not an NHL defenseman, and on the Sharks, he would be the 8th best defenseman right now. Sharks fans hated him when he was here because he played in a #6D role when he was more deserving of a #7D role. He was not qualified as an RFA, spent over a week as a UFA, and then circled back here on a very cheap deal.

Those are the kinds of irrelevant players that you never lose sleep over and never hesitate to include in a package for a star player.

So does that make it any less??For one season of any player its pretty expensive..

 

[The don godfather]

It’s only two (late) firsts if the Sharks make the cup finals or re-sign him. Otherwise it’s just a 1st and a 2nd. DeMelo isnt very good and Tierney is a solid but unspectacular player. Norris and Balcers may be something at some point but who knows.

Even if just for a year of the best D man on the planet that’s a deal they make every time.

Thats why i kept pounding the table that dorion won the deal and I got thrown to the curb. Norris is the wildcard if he becomes elite then it's a landslide.

 

[Gecklund]

Thats why i kept pounding the table that dorion won the deal and I got thrown to the curb. Norris is the wildcard if he becomes elite then it's a landslide.

And what’s your evidence/proof that he becomes elite? Cause I could say the same about Perron.

 

[topshelf15]

Thats why i kept pounding the table that dorion won the deal and I got thrown to the curb. Norris is the wildcard if he becomes elite then it's a landslide.

What about the 2020 pick???A few key injuries and it could be higher than most expect,anyhow we didnt win the deal but if SJ cant keep him we didnt lose it as bad as many here thought

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

So does that make it any less??For one season of any player its pretty expensive..

Yes it actually does when you look at each piece individually. DeMelo was a fringe NHLer who would be the 8th best defenseman on this Sharks team without Karlsson. Tierney is a 40-50 point center who is scoring out of his league as a result of increased ice time but he’s also getting absolutely shelled defensively because he’s out of depth in his role. Losing Tierney was addition by subtraction for a Sharks team who is able to use Hertl, Couture, and Thornton as their top-3 centers; Tierney is far inferior to all those players and with him in the lineup somebody would be moved to wing. Norris was a solid B prospect who had just had an underwhelming D+1 season in the NCAA. Balcers was a solid B prospect who was probably going to play another full season in the AHL with one NHL cup of coffee in his D+4 season.

It’s like if I gave you 10 shiny coins for a dollar bill. And you said that I overpaid because there were 2 big shiny silver coins, 1 extra small shiny silver coin, and 3 medium shiny silver coins, and 4 shiny copper coins. Yeah, that sounds like a lot when you put it that way. But when you look at each piece individually and assess a value to it, that’s only 89 cents for a dollar.

Thats why i kept pounding the table that dorion won the deal and I got thrown to the curb. Norris is the wildcard if he becomes elite then it's a landslide.

All I know is, when Norris was a Shark, I never heard the slightest peep that he might become elite. Not from even the most biased and optimistic of Sharks fans was there ever a belief that Josh Norris might become an elite player.

 

[topshelf15]

Yes it actually does when you look at each piece individually. DeMelo was a fringe NHLer who would be the 8th best defenseman on this Sharks team without Karlsson. Tierney is a 40-50 point center who is scoring out of his league as a result of increased ice time but he’s also getting absolutely shelled defensively because he’s out of depth in his role. Losing Tierney was addition by subtraction for a Sharks team who is able to use Hertl, Couture, and Thornton as their top-3 centers; Tierney is far inferior to all those players and with him in the lineup somebody would be moved to wing. Norris was a solid B prospect who had just had an underwhelming D+1 season in the NCAA. Balcers was a solid B prospect who was probably going to play another full season in the AHL with one NHL cup of coffee in his D+4 season.

It’s like if I gave you 10 shiny coins for a dollar bill. And you said that I overpaid because there were 2 big shiny silver coins, 1 extra small shiny silver coin, and 3 medium shiny silver coins, and 4 shiny copper coins. Yeah, that sounds like a lot when you put it that way. But when you look at each piece individually and assess a value to it, that’s only 89 cents for a dollar.



All I know is, when Norris was a Shark, I never heard the slightest peep that he might become elite. Not from even the most biased and optimistic of Sharks fans was there ever a belief that Josh Norris might become an elite player.

You seem to want to argue about nothing here ...The deal for EK ,should he not sign with the club isnt a good one no matter how you try and spin it...You gave up 2 1st,s and a 2nd along with Tierney ,Demelo and Balcers...

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

What about the 2020 pick???A few key injuries and it could be higher than most expect,anyhow we didnt win the deal but if SJ cant keep him we didnt lose it as bad as many here thought

San Jose is 10-3-1 without Karlsson this season, and if he walks you had best believe that cap space that has been allocated to him will be used elsewhere. That pick will be in the late teens in an absolute best case scenario for Ottawa.

You seem to want to argue about nothing here ...The deal for EK ,should he not sign with the club isnt a good one no matter how you try and spin it...You gave up 2 1st,s and a 2nd along with Tierney ,Demelo and Balcers...

I’m just trying to tell people that none of those pieces were seen as anything special while we had them becaus they’re not anything special. It’s still a price worth paying for one year of Karlsson.

 

[SensFactor]

Sens will win the trade if Karlsson walks. Simply as that. Listen losing Karlsson in any circumstance is bad for any team however Sens got some bottom six roster players, two B propects one of which is playing decent in Ottawa in Balcers, a bottom pairing Dman and a 1st round draft pick. If Norris turns out to be even a very good 3rd line center in the NHL. That's decent compared to losing him for nothing.

 

[topshelf15]

San Jose is 10-3-1 without Karlsson this season, and if he walks you had best believe that cap space that has been allocated to him will be used elsewhere. That pick will be in the late teens in an absolute best case scenario for Ottawa.



I’m just trying to tell people that none of those pieces were seen as anything special while we had them becaus they’re not anything special.

Which ones??Demelo ,or Tierney...Both are serviceable,I get this...It the picks and the prospects ,that dispite what are trying to reassure yourself about are still an unknown ...
But me saying that if EK should walk in FA than this is an overpayment,isnt a lie or me trying to make you feel bad ..Its fact

 

[topshelf15]

Sens will win the trade if Karlsson walks. Simply as that. Listen losing Karlsson in any circumstance is bad for any team however Sens got some bottom six roster players, two B propects one of which is playing decent in Ottawa in Balcers, a bottom pairing Dman and a 1st round draft pick. If Norris turns out to be even a very good 3rd line center in the NHL. That's decent compared to losing him for nothing.

Add in the FLD 2nd

 

[topshelf15]

One season of anybody for that price isnt worth it,come on Shark fans put down the knives for a second and think logically about it...

 

[Crazy Joe Divola]

Sens will win the trade if Karlsson walks. Simply as that. Listen losing Karlsson in any circumstance is bad for any team however Sens got some bottom six roster players, two B propects one of which is playing decent in Ottawa in Balcers, a bottom pairing Dman and a 1st round draft pick. If Norris turns out to be even a very good 3rd line center in the NHL. That's decent compared to losing him for nothing.

It’s not nothing, but for an entire season of the best defenseman in the league, it wasn’t a heavy price to pay. Even if he walks I’d be happy with the trade as it gave them a very legit shot at the cup this year. The 1st round pick and the two prospects are the only worthwhile pieces that would be missed.

If he re-signs or they make the cup final, it gets much more respectable for Ottawa though and the odds of atleast one of those happening seems fairly good.

 

[Crazy Joe Divola]

It’s also why most Sharks fans, myself included, wouldn’t be upset at EK himself if he did walk. We didn’t gut our team to get him, he gave us an entire season of play and a shot at a cup. Can’t be mad at him if he decided to pay less taxes or play closer to home or whatever.

It would suck for sure, but wouldn’t have any ill will toward him.

 

[SensFactor]

It’s also why most Sharks fans, myself included, wouldn’t be upset at EK himself if he did walk. We didn’t gut our team to get him, he gave us an entire season of play and a shot at a cup. Can’t be mad at him if he decided to pay less taxes or play closer to home or whatever.

It would suck for sure, but wouldn’t have any ill will toward him.

I guess if he walks, every party involved got something. IMO he's going to TB to save state income taxes, play with Hedman and live on the East coast and closer to home. His wife and her family are all still in Ottawa.

 

[Crazy Joe Divola]

I guess if he walks, every party involved got something. IMO he's going to TB, to save state income taxes and live on the East coast and closer to home. His wife and her family are all still in Ottawa.

Word came out the the other day that Bryce Harper’s decision to go to Philly over SF was partially due to CA’s state taxes (Giants would’ve had tack on another ~30 million to even out the actual pay he received). I would be highly annoyed if our stupid high taxes play any role if EK going somewhere else.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

Sens will win the trade if Karlsson walks. Simply as that. Listen losing Karlsson in any circumstance is bad for any team however Sens got some bottom six roster players, two B propects one of which is playing decent in Ottawa in Balcers, a bottom pairing Dman and a 1st round draft pick. If Norris turns out to be even a very good 3rd line center in the NHL. That's decent compared to losing him for nothing.

Yeah it’s obviously decent compared to losing him for nothing. It’s also not a win at all.

Which ones??Demelo ,or Tierney...Both are serviceable,I get this...It the picks and the prospects ,that dispite what are trying to reassure yourself about are still an unknown ...
But me saying that if EK should walk in FA than this is an overpayment,isnt a lie or me trying to make you feel bad ..Its fact

It’s really not a fact at all, it’s an opinion and it’s not correct either. Even as a rental, the price that was paid was very cheap for one year of the best defenseman in the NHL. Lots of quantity, no quality.

Word came out the the other day that Bryce Harper’s decision to go to Philly over SF was partially due to CA’s state taxes (Giants would’ve had tack on another ~30 million to even out the actual pay he received). I would be highly annoyed if our stupid high taxes play any role if EK going somewhere else.

State taxes probably won’t be a factor because San Jose will offer far more than Tampa.

 

[topshelf15]

Yeah it’s obviously decent compared to losing him for nothing. It’s also not a win at all.



It’s really not a fact at all, it’s an opinion and it’s not correct either. Even as a rental, the price that was paid was very cheap for one year of the best defenseman in the NHL. Lots of quantity, no quality.



State taxes probably won’t be a factor because San Jose will offer far more than Tampa.

So 2 firsts and a high second arent enough quality???NVM the rest ,Its not as cheap as you are claiming ,in fact make a poll and see how many teams would give that up for one year of any player...

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

So 2 firsts and a high second arent enough quality???NVM the rest ,Its not as cheap as you are claiming ,in fact make a poll and see how many teams would give that up for one year of any player...

No, that’s not a lot of quality for Erik Karlsson. A low risk center picked in the late teens, another pick which will be in the late teens at best, and a high 2nd which should be between 35 and 45.

Most teams aren’t in the position that San Jose was so it really wouldn’t matter what their fans say.

 

[topshelf15]

No, that’s not a lot of quality for Erik Karlsson. A low risk center picked in the late teens, another pick which will be in the late teens at best, and a high 2nd which should be between 35 and 45.

Most teams aren’t in the position that San Jose was so it really wouldn’t matter what their fans say.

What we said after we traded for Duchene ....Look you can tell yourself whatever you want ,but you guys need to sign him or this deal doesnt look good ...Iam not trying to burst your bubble or to try and make you feel bad ,but this deal is an overpayment on a rental ..Even if it was for a full season ,because at the end of it you guys will have nothing ...And we will have 2 of your last 5 seasons 1st,s and a high 2nd along with everything else

 

[PatrikBerglund]

I hope he signs with Tampa or Las Vegas.


Would love if he signed with Buffalo, but that's just not realistic seeing how trash we are.