Erik Karlsson Discussion Thread: He mad

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Rodzilla

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Aug 31, 2010
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Well to be honest, to anyone who has ever played a competitive sport, how would you feel going out there and looking behind and beside you and seeing nothing? That's the question you have to ask yourselves. When you're on an other level you expect to have support it must be really frustrating to play with people no where near your caliber. I understand we won't get 6 Karlssons but man get him some help.


He's absolutely going to test UFA if things stay that way and they probably will, I don't blame him one bit. I respect Mr Melnyk but at some point take a look in the mirror, if you don't want to invest in this team you'll get the same crappy result every year and you won't make more money. It's really frustrating to see him waste Karlsson's best years.
 

Uchiha

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Jun 14, 2014
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I wonder how Doughty/Keith/Subban/Weber/Suter would react when playing with Borowiecki
 

HavlatMach9

streamable 3rah1
Mar 17, 2011
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This has got to be one of the most important off seasons for this organizations in a long time
progress is steady, there's no sudden jump. our progress is slow because we're relying internally, and if that isn't changing, you can't assume a jump will happen no matter how much of an effort given
 

Pierre from Orleans

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May 9, 2007
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progress is steady, there's no sudden jump. our progress is slow because we're relying internally, and if that isn't changing, you can't assume a jump will happen no matter how much of an effort given

This is the time to make that jump. A handful of contracts are coming off the books.
 

BondraTime

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Nov 20, 2005
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progress is steady, there's no sudden jump. our progress is slow because we're relying internally, and if that isn't changing, you can't assume a jump will happen no matter how much of an effort given

If something doesn't happen, and we continue to ice 5 guys on the blue line who could/should be in the AHL or pressbox, Karlsson will, and should take his talents elsewhere.

We had a #1 C in Spezza, gave him Greening and Butler, then 10 games of Ryan, he left for obvious reasons. The same seems to be happening with Karlsson, I know if I reached UFA and I had the chance to play with other NHL D on a team who spent to get talent, I'd take it.

I hate over reactions after losses, this is something that has been dawning on me for a while.

We've been waiting on our "progress" for years.
 

Rodzilla

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Aug 31, 2010
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If something doesn't happen, and we continue to ice 5 guys on the blue line who could/should be in the AHL or pressbox, Karlsson will, and should take his talents elsewhere.

We had a #1 C in Spezza, gave him Greening and Butler, then 10 games of Ryan, he left for obvious reasons. The same seems to be happening with Karlsson, I know if I reached UFA and I had the chance to play with other NHL D on a team who spent to get talent, I'd take it.

I hate over reactions after losses, this is something that has been dawning on me for a while.



100% agreed, Karlsson must want to have a good support cast, he's playing over half the game right now and has put up 52 (!!!!!) pts on this team. Like you said, being a pro I'd want to win before anything else, and Karlsson seems like a winner.
 

Ouroboros

There is no armour against Fate
Feb 3, 2008
15,101
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This has got to be one of the most important off seasons for this organizations in a long time

Not sure how they could possibly top last summer's signings. They set the bar pretty high.
 

Xspyrit

DJ Dorion
Jun 29, 2008
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Montreal, Canada


Karl must be counting down the days to FA.


Is there any proof that it comes from Karlsson?

The team plays without MacArthur (top-6 LW), Turris (#1 C), Methot (#2 D) and Michalek (7th best forward)

Sens lost a 1 goal game, 3 goals allowed were weak by Anderson, and a bit lucky for the Sabres. On the other hand, Sens didn't have luck at all with several posts and pucks that miraculously didn't go in, as well as a trying goal 0.01 seconds too late.

Karlsson has plenty of skill to play with. Hoffman, Ryan, Stone, Turris, MacArthur, Zibanejad, Michalek, Pageau, Prince, Puempel, Ceci and even Wiercioch is enough for him to rack up points and be by far the best scoring D-man.

I doubt it's coming from him. Or else he'd be reading too much HF and be a bit stupid. So I don't think it's real.
 
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BondraTime

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Nov 20, 2005
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Is there any proof that it comes from Karlsson?

The team plays without MacArthur (top-6 LW), Turris (#1 C), Methot (#2 D) and Michalek (7th best forward)

Sens lost a 1 goal game, 3 goals allowed were weak by Anderson, and a bit lucky for the Sabres. On the other hand, Sens didn't have luck at all with several posts and puck that miraculously didn't go in, as well as a trying goal 0.01 seconds too late.

Karlsson has plenty of skill to play with. Hoffman, Ryan, Stone, Turris, MacArthur, Zibanejad, Michalek, Pageau, Prince, Puempel, Ceci and even Wiercioch is enough for him to rack up points and be by far the best scoring D-man.

I doubt it's coming from him. Or else he'd be reading too much HF and be a bit stupid. So I don't think it's real.

So the TSN producer (the account on twitter) lied?
 

FlyingJ

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Feb 25, 2014
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Honest question: we're about $6million dollars from cap, does anyone honestly think $6million in players would seriously fix this team and make it more than what it's been at the best of times for basically Murray's entire tenure as GM: a bubble team?

Frankly, the blame is with a management group that values perceived character and intangibles to an absurd degree.

It's why we have so much money wrapped up in players like Cowen, Michalek (with the knees of a 40 year old), Greening, Chiasson, Borowiecki, and Neil. Most of these guys spend a lot of time in their own end because they aren't suited to the modern NHL: they suck at puck retrieval and actually limiting opponents' chances. But hey, they have "heart" or size, so that must mean they're "real good." The ones that aren't as often hemmed in their own end? They don't produce actual goals or assists much. Sure, most of them don't make much individually, but it all adds up, they all take up roster spots, which they get the inside track due to veteran status and/or one-way contracts. And despite their glaring inefficiencies, something a budget team really can't afford many of, management is reluctant to admit their poor play. Hell, they often seem to actually think these guys play well consistently. It took 2 and a half seasons of often garbage play for Murray and co. to finally seriously consider trading Cowen. That is just baffling. Though I must admit Neil has been better this year...compared to last. And hey, putting him with Prince, one of those risky guys Cameron doesn't like, has yielded some really positive numbers. So I guess coaching overvaluing certain players is a big part of all this too.

Management is also why we get guys who have their abilities and/or potential completely overrated, like Ceci and Lazar (the latter's offence translating to the NHL has always been a question mark for scouts). One's a local boy, and the other supposedly has "leadership" in spades. As a result, they get long leashes. Lazar is still pretty young, as is Ceci, but with Ceci his development has completely plateaued, and he tends to give up a ton of scoring chances against. And yet to hear Murray tell it, Ceci has been great. Gee, if only the Sens didn't often scoff at analytics so often. :shakehead Lazar...he's not showing much to indicate he'll ever be more than a solid third liner. Even with young skilled guys, you can say you see flashes through the inconsistency. With Lazar...not as much I'd argue. But I get it: this is about marketing and selling hope to the fans as much of anything. I just wish there was something actually there with them to be really hopeful about.

Melnyk bares some of the blame for this though: he's done nothing to really change management despite these failings. His restrictive budget doesn't help, but that's not what's really knee-capping this team from ever being a legitimate contender. Keeping a GM around for 9 years when he has just 1 playoff series win in that time, and is looking likely to miss the playoffs for the 4th time in those 9 years, all the while his coaches' average shelf-life is not even 2 seasons...a record like that would get a GM elsewhere fired, regardless of how they flaunt their drafting record.

Karlsson's right, there isn't enough talent here. But the internal budget isn't the biggest reason for that.
 

Icelevel

During these difficult times...
Sep 9, 2009
24,974
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Yeah heard it on the radio. Not so bad. I get where he's coming from. And think I know what he's trying to do.
It's the coach's message that they need to play harder and tougher. Be more willing to go in to those dirty areas. Get the skilled guys thinking they can't rely on their skill alone.
It's a fine message to relay.

But the budget thing is dumb. Dallas is doing just fine spending 3M? more than us.
 

Sens

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Jan 7, 2016
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Is there any proof that it comes from Karlsson?

The team plays without MacArthur (top-6 LW), Turris (#1 C), Methot (#2 D) and Michalek (7th best forward)

Sens lost a 1 goal game, 3 goals allowed were weak by Anderson, and a bit lucky for the Sabres. On the other hand, Sens didn't have luck at all with several posts and pucks that miraculously didn't go in, as well as a trying goal 0.01 seconds too late.

Karlsson has plenty of skill to play with. Hoffman, Ryan, Stone, Turris, MacArthur, Zibanejad, Michalek, Pageau, Prince, Puempel, Ceci and even Wiercioch is enough for him to rack up points and be by far the best scoring D-man.

I doubt it's coming from him. Or else he'd be reading too much HF and be a bit stupid. So I don't think it's real.

Guess you're calling EK stupid then lol
 

Uchiha

Registered User
Jun 14, 2014
2,612
289
Honest question: we're about $6million dollars from cap, does anyone honestly think $6million in players would seriously fix this team and make it more than what it's been at the best of times for basically Murray's entire tenure as GM: a bubble team?

Frankly, the blame is with a management group that values perceived character and intangibles to an absurd degree.

It's why we have so much money wrapped up in players like Cowen, Michalek (with the knees of a 40 year old), Greening, Chiasson, Borowiecki, and Neil. Most of these guys spend a lot of time in their own end because they aren't suited to the modern NHL: they suck at puck retrieval and actually limiting opponents' chances. But hey, they have "heart" or size, so that must mean they're "real good." The ones that aren't as often hemmed in their own end? They don't produce actual goals or assists much. Sure, most of them don't make much individually, but it all adds up, they all take up roster spots, which they get the inside track due to veteran status and/or one-way contracts. And despite their glaring inefficiencies, something a budget team really can't afford many of, management is reluctant to admit their poor play. Hell, they often seem to actually think these guys play well consistently. It took 2 and a half seasons of often garbage play for Murray and co. to finally seriously consider trading Cowen. That is just baffling. Though I must admit Neil has been better this year...compared to last. And hey, putting him with Prince, one of those risky guys Cameron doesn't like, has yielded some really positive numbers. So I guess coaching overvaluing certain players is a big part of all this too.

Management is also why we get guys who have their abilities and/or potential completely overrated, like Ceci and Lazar (the latter's offence translating to the NHL has always been a question mark for scouts). One's a local boy, and the other supposedly has "leadership" in spades. As a result, they get long leashes. Lazar is still pretty young, as is Ceci, but with Ceci his development has completely plateaued, and he tends to give up a ton of scoring chances against. And yet to hear Murray tell it, Ceci has been great. Gee, if only the Sens didn't often scoff at analytics so often. :shakehead Lazar...he's not showing much to indicate he'll ever be more than a solid third liner. Even with young skilled guys, you can say you see flashes through the inconsistency. With Lazar...not as much I'd argue. But I get it: this is about marketing and selling hope to the fans as much of anything. I just wish there was something actually there with them to be really hopeful about.

Melnyk bares some of the blame for this though: he's done nothing to really change management despite these failings. His restrictive budget doesn't help, but that's not what's really knee-capping this team from ever being a legitimate contender. Keeping a GM around for 9 years when he has just 1 playoff series win in that time, and is looking likely to miss the playoffs for the 4th time in those 9 years, all the while his coaches' average shelf-life is not even 2 seasons...a record like that would get a GM elsewhere fired, regardless of how they flaunt their drafting record.

Karlsson's right, there isn't enough talent here. But the internal budget isn't the biggest reason for that.

Took the words right out of my mouth.

Agree 100%
 

Do Make Say Think

& Yet & Yet
Jun 26, 2007
51,211
9,966
Yeah heard it on the radio. Not so bad. I get where he's coming from. And think I know what he's trying to do.
It's the coach's message that they need to play harder and tougher. Be more willing to go in to those dirty areas. Get the skilled guys thinking they can't rely on their skill alone.
It's a fine message to relay.

But the budget thing is dumb. Dallas is doing just fine spending 3M? more than us.

Dallas was very aggressive in getting outside help: they went and got Oduya, Sharp, Spezza and Seguin at times when it was clear there was a big hole in the roster.

The problem isn't the budget, the problem is how ownership seemingly refuses to spend a dime over it even when it's very clear how bad this team is.

Granted, making trades isn't easy and not making trades doesn't mean they aren't trying but all we hear about is how much they value Cowen and how they need to get rid of Greening. These two story lines have been going on for long enough that the Senators should have moved on and looked at other avenues, that they haven't likely indicates their hands are tied.
 

aragorn

Do The Right Thing
Aug 8, 2004
28,731
9,206
I think they have enough talent, aren't they in the top 10 or higher in scoring so far this season, so they are getting enough scoring. IMO it's poor execution, it's a lack of working harder defensively, it's mediocre goaltending & numerous mistakes from the defence including Karlsson who makes his fair share of mistakes defensively.

We see it in most games, the forwards want to take off offensively a lot of times before we have complete possession, the forwards don't come down deep enough into the defensive zone & the gap is too great between the forwards & the defencemen. Both our goalies have let in a lot of soft & bizarre goals like Anderson tonight, all three goals were on the weird looking & soft side. And a number of these guys are too fancy always trying for the highlight reel goal, they are careless with the puck & waste a lot of time. I also think they need a faceoff expert, they seem to lose a lot of faceoffs in the offensive zone especially when they are on the PP. For whatever reason they just are not jelling as a team this yr & are not playing consistently, good one game & terrible the next. Is it the players or the coaches or both? Who knows but it doesn't seem like it's their yr.
 

Sens

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Jan 7, 2016
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EK has 54 points and plays 30 minutes a game... He knows he's carrying everyone and propping the teams offense up

He can see the lack of skill better then anyone
 
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