Confirmed with Link: Eberle for Strome: Part 2

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Leafs have had JVR for several years prior to Matthews. Same with Kadri.

Only difference is those players have manned up and gotten better than they were 2-3 years ago, meanwhile RNH, Eberle, Lucic all decided it's acceptable to play at half their ability.

If we have rookie RNH, Boston Bruin Lucic, and Eberle of 2-3 years ago, we win the Cup this year and probably are in the Finals last summer, but all three are content to play well below their ability as if they're 37 year olds who are 6 years past their prime.

You are correct, because the Oilers can't assess talent at any level we have a bunch of bare cupboards and the players that we do have that are decent have been jettisoned to fill holes in the roster (or create them in the case of this trade).

You can't simply lose for years then expect the whipping boys of that era to suddenly step up and perform when they've known nothing but losing. RNH, Eberle, and Hall have been badly beaten down by years of ineptitude the likes of which the NHL has never seen before so it's no wonder when the team is suddenly good again they can't raise their games. The Leafs at least have one playoff round admist their decade of darkness, whereas the Oilers never even came close.

This is what happens when you don't maximize value. We sold low on Yakupov, Hall, and now Eberle and I wouldn't be too surprised if we sold low on RNH too. I'm starting to think more and more that Chia should've dangled Maroon in the offseason and see if someone bit on it.

 

[Soundwave]

You are correct, because the Oilers can't assess talent at any level we have a bunch of bare cupboards and the players that we do have that are decent have been jettisoned to fill holes in the roster (or create them in the case of this trade).

You can't simply lose for years then expect the whipping boys of that era to suddenly step up and perform when they've known nothing but losing. RNH, Eberle, and Hall have been badly beaten down by years of ineptitude the likes of which the NHL has never seen before so it's no wonder when the team is suddenly good again they can't raise their games. The Leafs at least have one playoff round admist their decade of darkness, whereas the Oilers never even came close.

This is what happens when you don't maximize value. We sold low on Yakupov, Hall, and now Eberle and I wouldn't be too surprised if we sold low on RNH too. I'm starting to think more and more that Chia should've dangled Maroon in the offseason and see if someone bit on it.

I don't really buy this though because didn't the Leafs also lose for a long time? Kadri has been a whipping boy in Toronto.

How is it that he can step up and man up and work his ass off to be an impact player on many nights, but RNH, Lucic, Eberle, Yakupov just couldn't.

Does Kadri have that much more talent? How does he go from a 39 point player that was the target of much angst from the Toronto fanbase to a 61 point player in 2 years?

How come JVR's point totals didn't collapse but improved once getting moved to line 2? Why can he be a 60+ point player and play at the same level as 2 years ago, but that completely elludes RNH and Eberle?

Why is it only in Edmonton it's acceptable for $6 million dollar players, many of whom are 1st round picks to play like they are tired old man, years past their primes? It's only this fanbase that accepts that and makes excuses for it. We probably had the highest paid 2nd line in hockey last year.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I don't really buy this though because didn't the Leafs also lose for a long time? Kadri has been a whipping boy in Toronto.

How is it that he can step up and man up and work his ass off to be an impact player on many nights, but RNH, Lucic, Eberle, Yakupov just couldn't.

Does Kadri have that much more talent?

The Leafs were never as bad as the Oilers were. Not even close. They often just missed the playoffs. But they still got some post-season experience and very nearly won a playoff round before that collapse.

The Oilers simply took their hands off the wheel and expected those players to drag the team into the playoffs when it became more and more clear that they simply could not do it.

I think back to when the Kane/Toews made their first playoff appearance and bowed out to Detroit in the WCF. Then they went out and got Hossa and the rest is history.

 

[McDNicks17]

Well the Leafs got JVR for Luke Schenn, and instead we traded Eberle for... well, a Luke Schenn-like forward.

But hey we have Strome who never does anything and cap space which hasn't scored a single goal in his entire NHL career.

Remember, this trade was purely "addition by subtraction". Eberle can't step up anymore because he's no longer here. He was traded for a complete invalid and now the team is worse.

This trade is completely indefensible unless Chiarealli uses that cap space for an actual upgrade and not other team's castoffs.

Like I said earlier, pretending it's a fact that the team would be better this season with Eberle instead of Strome is just disingenuous.

 

[Soundwave]

The Leafs were never as bad as the Oilers were. Not even close. They often just missed the playoffs. But they still got some post-season experience and very nearly won a playoff round before that collapse.

The Oilers simply took their hands off the wheel and expected those players to drag the team into the playoffs when it became more and more clear that they simply could not do it.

I think back to when the Kane/Toews made their first playoff appearance and bowed out to Detroit in the WCF. Then they went out and got Hossa and the rest is history.

But Kadri and JVR are they simply THAT much more talented than Eberle, RNH, and Lucic?

Why do those two flourish in an improved environment whereas the other three are content to allow their play to slide downwards?

Even Colorado ... they had as bad of a season as the Oilers ever did ... yet this year some how Duchene and Landeskog and MacKinnon are all playing back up to their standard.

Why does that never happen for us? Can't expect RNH to be RNH. Alright. Can't expect Eberle to be Eberle. OK. Lucic can't possibly be Lucic of 2 years ago. And don't expect anything in the playoffs either.

Then we wonder how we don't have secondary scoring. Put Kadri and JVR on this team and we do have all the secondary scoring we need. For less money.

Chia was passive yes, but he pulled Maroon and 27 goals out of his butt from nothing, how many moves like that does a GM have to make for a quote unquote "talented" team? How many little shrewd moves like that need to be made to cover for the fact that we really don't have a second line that can ever be relied on?

How is it possible for Mark Letestu to ever outplay all of Hall + Eberle + Yakupov + RNH for the triggerman position on a PP unit with McDavid? How does that even happen? That's like Brad Hunt outplaying Oscar Klefbom.

 

[Joey Moss]

Strome and Jokinen have been completely useless.. almost think we should've just kept Eberle for this year.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Like I said earlier, pretending it's a fact that the team would be better this season with Eberle instead of Strome is just disingenuous.

But the fact remains they're worse off for this trade. Maybe Eberle wouldn't have moved the needle significantly, but Strome is just an abyss of nothing. I'd love nothing more than for Strome to light it up and shut me up but this is the second time Chia has made an ill-advised deal with the Islanders and once again failed to identify any proper talent coming back.

But Kadri and JVR are they simply THAT much more talented than Eberle, RNH, and Lucic?

Why do those two flourish in an improved environment whereas the other three are content to allow their play to slide downwards?

Even Colorado ... they had as bad of a season as the Oilers ever did ... yet this year some how Duchene and Landeskog and MacKinnon are all playing back up to their standard.

Why does that never happen for us? Can't expect RNH to be RNH. Alright. Can't expect Eberle to be Eberle. OK. Lucic can't possibly be Lucic of 2 years ago. And don't expect anything in the playoffs either.

Then we wonder how we don't have secondary scoring. Put Kadri and JVR on this team and we do have all the secondary scoring we need. For less money.

Chia was passive yes, but he pulled Maroon and 27 goals out of his butt from nothing, how many moves like that does a GM have to make for a quote unquote "talented" team? How many little shrewd moves like that need to be made to cover for the fact that we really don't have a second line that can ever be relied on?

How is it possible for Mark Letestu to ever outplay all of Hall + Eberle + Yakupov + RNH for the triggerman position on a PP unit with McDavid? How does that even happen?

I don't think they are, they're just not saddled with as much losing as Eberle/RNH are. Eberle for years has been a whipping boy for this team and RNH tends to share that boat.

Colorado also had some experience with success. Again, something the Oilers have never had. It's not really advisable to compare the Oilers to other teams because no other team has been this bad for this long.

Also you're vastly overrating Letestu's contributions last year. It happens when a player has a career year. Hall was a beast for many years on this team and I can't believe that's already been forgotten.

The Oilers are where they are because of years of mismanagement that still haven't been completely swept away. And even the new regime has shown shades of the old regime, especially if they re-sign Maroon to anything more than a 2 year deal.

I also think your expectations of second line players are too high. 50 points each is more than enough. If your top players are your top players you don't need RNH scoring 30 goals.

 

[Soundwave]

But the fact remains they're worse off for this trade. Maybe Eberle wouldn't have moved the needle significantly, but Strome is just an abyss of nothing. I'd love nothing more than for Strome to light it up and shut me up but this is the second time Chia has made an ill-advised deal with the Islanders and once again failed to identify any proper talent coming back.


I don't think they are, they're just not saddled with as much losing as Eberle/RNH are. Eberle for years has been a whipping boy for this team and RNH tends to share that boat.

Colorado also had some experience with success. Again, something the Oilers have never had. It's not really advisable to compare the Oilers to other teams because no other team has been this bad for this long.

Also you're vastly overrating Letestu's contributions last year. It happens when a player has a career year. Hall was a beast for many years on this team and I can't believe that's already been forgotten.

The Oilers are where they are because of years of mismanagement that still haven't been completely swept away. And even the new regime has shown shades of the old regime, especially if they re-sign Maroon to anything more than a 2 year deal.

I also think your expectations of second line players are too high. 50 points each is more than enough. If your top players are your top players you don't need RNH scoring 30 goals.

We don't need specifically RNH to be a 30 goal scorer perhaps. But we DID need at least ONE of Hall-Lucic-Eberle-RNH-Schultz-Yakupov to at least be a player that improves and plays at a star level.

Just.

One.

Of. You. Dumb. f***s.

Pan. Out. PLEASE.

So far all them failed, granted Hall gave us a good half season before inexplicably deciding not to play hockey the moment Connor McDavid came back.

And if this was the mistake then the situation that we are in now was always inevitable. We should have just gutted that entire core 2 years ago. Eberle out for Kessel when the Leafs were dumping, RNH out for a d-man, maybe keep Hall, get rid of Yakupov. Don't sign Lucic. You'll get the same player in Maroon basically for 1/3 the salary.

If the going theory now is we can't expect high standards from Eberle/RNH/Lucic/Hall etc. because of damage done during a rebuild, fine, but that was always also going to come back to haunt us if that's the excuse (not even sure why that explains Lucic playing like 1/2 the player he used to be).

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

We don't need specifically RNH to be a 30 goal scorer perhaps. But we DID need at least ONE of Hall-Lucic-Eberle-RNH-Schultz-Yakupov to at least be a player that improves and plays at a star level.

Just.

One.

Of. You. Dumb. ****s.

Pan. Out. PLEASE.

So far all them failed, granted Hall gave us a good half season before inexplicably deciding not to play hockey the moment Connor McDavid came back.

And if this was the mistake then the situation that we are in now was always inevitable. We should have just gutted that entire core 2 years ago. Eberle out for Kessel, RNH out for a d-man, maybe keep Hall, get rid of Yakupov.

Hall was probably the closest the Oilers ever had to a superstar but because the defense sucked we had to deal him. This management has been too slow to react on any players. I really think they should've dealt Maroon coming off his career year.

It's very unfair to constantly blame the players when management drowned them before they learned how to swim.

 

[Soundwave]

Hall was probably the closest the Oilers ever had to a superstar but because the defense sucked we had to deal him. This management has been too slow to react on any players. I really think they should've dealt Maroon coming off his career year.

It's very unfair to constantly blame the players when management drowned them before they learned how to swim.

Yet other players on bad teams have bad years, yes, but then they come back with a good year.

Matt Duchene was soooo bad and even requested a trade. He's better than anyone on our team though aside from McDavid/Draisaitl.

Not sure how Lucic can look like the 1/2 the player either. This dude used to leave his stamp all over the game, now I don't even notice him played 1/2 the time at all.

In hindsight we should have accepted Eberle/RNH/Hall/Yak as a rotten core and gutted that group earlier, but we had to give them chances with McDavid. All of them failed in those chances.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Yet other players on bad teams have bad years, yes, but then they come back with a good year.

Matt Duchene was soooo bad and even requested a trade. He's better than anyone on our team though aside from McDavid/Draisaitl.

Not sure how Lucic can look like the 1/2 the player either. This dude used to leave his stamp all over the game, now I don't even notice him played 1/2 the time at all.

In hindsight we should have accepted Eberle/RNH/Hall/Yak as a rotten core and gutted that group earlier, but we had to give them chances with McDavid. All of them failed in those chances.

Again, you're comparing apples to oranges here. No team in NHL history has ever been as bad as the Oilers have been. Colorado had a tremendous year that gave their guys a lot of experience even if the bottom fell out for the next few years. Same with Calgary a couple years ago. The Oilers could've benefited a lot from at least one playoff year but that never materialized.

The Lucic contract is an example of Chia filling a hole that he created, albeit somewhat poorly. He dealt Hall with a Lucic contract likely in his back pocket and while it'll certainly be a questionable deal somewhere down the line, it at least plugged a hole left by our best offensive winger and at least for one season the tradeoff was decent.

RNH. Eberle, and Hall were left to fend for themselves for many, many years. They never had a Lucic to mentor them. Or a Hossa, or anyone of that ilk. The Leafs at least had Kessel. Colorado had a few veteran guys as well as a year where basically everything went right for them (sound familiar?).

Chia this year is making the same mistakes that Tambellini before him made. A suspicious "wait and see" approach that has never worked out for this team. Ideally you're playing McDavid on the top line with Maroon and a top 6 RWer, Draisatl on the second line with Lucic/Eberle, RNH on the third line with Kassian/Jokinen, and a fourth line of Letestu/Khaira/maybe Pakarinen.

But Chia created a hole that he didn't fill. Fine, it happens... But then he left the biggest hole in the Oilers lineup complete unplugged and much like Justin Schultz before him, Matt Benning was thrust into a role that he wasn't ready for and was pulled from the lineup because of it (which incidentally made the team worse).

If I had my way the Oilers would look something like this:

Maroon/McDavid/Athanasiou
Lucic/Draisatl/Eberle
Jokinen/RNH/Kassian
Khaira/Letestu/Pakarinen (or someone like that)

Defense:

Klefbom/Larsson
Sekera (Yes I know he's hurt)/Russell for 1 year/$5m
Benning/Nurse

Talbot
Brossoit

The lineup isn't perfect but it has less holes than the one we're seeing now. You have a very good crop of centers, some decent wings, and at least a competent defense. And you allow KY/JP to develop properly in the minors then bring them up when the AHL is simply too easy for the latter.

The Oilers right now are relying on far too many unknowns to carry their team and all it's doing is making them worse.

 

[Soundwave]

Put Matt Benning on the bottom pairing. He played there all last year, now he can't even handle a 5/6 spot? Nurse + Russell were fine, if Klefbom ever decides to play hockey this year we should be able to insulate Benning even without Sekera.

Justin Schultz was forced to play top pairing here.

 

[harpoon]

Eberle for years has been a whipping boy for this team and RNH tends to share that boat.

He's not even here anymore and some people can't stop whipping. You should just save your breath and stop responding because you are just giving him an excuse to keep going.
Seriously, what kind of unhealthy fixation causes a poster to make dozens and dozens of posts in the last week alone all saying exactly the same thing about a guy who doesn't even play on the team anymore.
Pity RNH if this season does not go well.

 

[YakDavid]

Strome and Jokinen have been completely useless.. almost think we should've just kept Eberle for this year.

good thing after four games we can decide this. Some posters need to relax and let new players settle in

 

[McFlash97]

good thing after four games we can decide this. Some posters need to relax and let new players settle in

There's no settling In with these 2 forwards. One has been utter garbage, the other is aging faster then Swiss cheese on a hot day.

 

[Soundwave]

Right now Eberle is on pace for a career low 41 points and an equal -41 rating for the Islanders with zero goals scored in his last 19 NHL games (almost a full quarter of an NHL season).

I guess one thing Eberle apologists never ever fathom is this guy could very well have a worse season than last year. It was equally or probably just as likely as the "bounce back" year they were so sure of.

In NYI he may still get it going because they have to keep spoon-feeding him top line minutes with Tavares, but if he was here, I think there's a very, very real possibility he'd have been low 40 point player and we would have been significantly handcuffed with his salary next summer.

Adding in his salary + McDavid's bonuses even for this year also mean that we would not have much cap room left to add players during the season/deadline *this year*. This guy is not the solution here. We need to find someone like a James Neal that we can add at the deadline.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Right now Eberle is on pace for a career low 41 points and an equal -41 rating for the Islanders with zero goals scored in his last 19 NHL games (almost a full quarter of an NHL season).

I guess one thing Eberle apologists never ever fathom is this guy could very well have a worse season than last year. It was equally or probably just as likely as the "bounce back" year they were so sure of.

In NYI he may still get it going because they have to keep spoon-feeding him top line minutes with Tavares, but if he was here, I think there's a very, very real possibility he'd have been low 40 point player and we would have been significantly handcuffed with his salary next summer.

Adding in his salary + McDavid's bonuses even for this year also mean that we would not have much cap room left to add players during the season/deadline *this year*. This guy is not the solution here. We need to find someone like a James Neal that we can add at the deadline.

Zero points, -41 is currently the pace for Ryan Strome.

That's why pace is such a garbage way of determining anything. If "pace" meant anything a healthy Pitlick would've been our top goal scorer.

I'm worried more about the player we traded for, not the player we traded away because at this point Strome might (and probably should) find himself on waivers, meaning we wasted an asset for nothing.

 

[Ninety7]

Right now Eberle is on pace for a career low 41 points and an equal -41 rating for the Islanders with zero goals scored in his last 19 NHL games (almost a full quarter of an NHL season).

I guess one thing Eberle apologists never ever fathom is this guy could very well have a worse season than last year. It was equally or probably just as likely as the "bounce back" year they were so sure of.

In NYI he may still get it going because they have to keep spoon-feeding him top line minutes with Tavares, but if he was here, I think there's a very, very real possibility he'd have been low 40 point player and we would have been significantly handcuffed with his salary next summer.

Adding in his salary + McDavid's bonuses even for this year also mean that we would not have much cap room left to add players during the season/deadline *this year*. This guy is not the solution here. We need to find someone like a James Neal that we can add at the deadline.

Haven’t you heard? Eberles the difference between us being contenders and a lottery team. We should just stop our unhealthy fixation on him though, because it’s not worth replying to apparently.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Haven’t you heard? Eberles the difference between us being contenders and a lottery team. We should just stop our unhealthy fixation on him though, because it’s not worth replying to apparently.

Yeah and who said that? Anyone?

But hey at least we got a complete nothing for something and saved some cap space. Quality asset management.

 

[Ninety7]

Yeah and who said that? Anyone?

But hey at least we got a complete nothing for something and saved some cap space. Quality asset management.

And for all you know Eberle could score 30 points this year. Based on his play last year and in the playoffs, hell even the year before that, he’s certainly trending that way. At 6m that’s a huge negative, considering he is absolutely useless in every other facet of the game. Also when you factor in McDavid and Drai’s contract next year... do you really wanna be paying a guy on the decline 6m? We already have one of those guys and his name is lucic. Only difference is he isn’t as soft as baby shit.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

And for all you know Eberle could score 30 points this year. Based on his play last year and in the playoffs, hell even the year before that, he’s certainly trending that way. At 6m that’s a huge negative, considering he is absolutely useless in every other facet of the game. Also when you factor in McDavid and Drai’s contract next year... do you really wanna be paying a guy on the decline 6m? We already have one of those guys and his name is lucic. Only difference is he isn’t as soft as baby ****.

So trade him after this year then. What was the rush? McDavid's extension doesn't kick in this year. For all his faults Eberle was at least a known commodity. What did we get in return? Another Islanders castoff that they failed to develop properly. You go to the shit well too many times and people are going to wonder what's wrong with you. The best thing we got in this trade was cap space and that's only if they allocate it properly. The right side is a complete mess right now and this trade didn't address either of the team's two biggest needs. It was a completely useless trade that brought in a completely useless player.

 

[VainGretzky]

Right now Eberle is on pace for a career low 41 points and an equal -41 rating for the Islanders with zero goals scored in his last 19 NHL games (almost a full quarter of an NHL season).
I guess one thing Eberle apologists never ever fathom is this guy could very well have a worse season than last year. It was equally or probably just as likely as the "bounce back" year they were so sure of.
In NYI he may still get it going because they have to keep spoon-feeding him top line minutes with Tavares, but if he was here, I think there's a very, very real possibility he'd have been low 40 point player and we would have been significantly handcuffed with his salary next summer.
Adding in his salary + McDavid's bonuses even for this year also mean that we would not have much cap room left to add players during the season/deadline *this year*. This guy is not the solution here. We need to find someone like a James Neal that we can add at the deadline.

How much do you want to bet Eberle will put up 50 + pts this season ? You obviously have not watched any Islander games this season Eberle is playing better than last season creating chances but not clicking with new linemates yet , and if you're not willing to bet you're just flapping your gums and hating on him because you can

 

[Soundwave]

So trade him after this year then. What was the rush? McDavid's extension doesn't kick in this year. For all his faults Eberle was at least a known commodity. What did we get in return? Another Islanders castoff that they failed to develop properly. You go to the **** well too many times and people are going to wonder what's wrong with you. The best thing we got in this trade was cap space and that's only if they allocate it properly. The right side is a complete mess right now and this trade didn't address either of the team's two biggest needs. It was a completely useless trade that brought in a completely useless player.

Trade him to who? How many teams do you think are clamouring to take on a 6 million cap hit who's coming off a potential 30-40 point season?

I would say there would be a very high chance the Oilers would be handcuffed and would have to give up a pick and/or retain salary (which would count against our tight cap next season) or have to take back a crappy $3-$4 million dollar player to get rid of him if he had a poor season, which I think is highly probable.

 

[Soundwave]

How much do you want to bet Eberle will put up 50 + pts this season ? You obviously have not watched any Islander games this season Eberle is playing better than last season creating chances but not clicking with new linemates yet , and if you're not willing to bet you're just flapping your gums and hating on him because you can

I'm saying he very likely would be a 40 point player had he stayed here. He may or may not get to 50 for NYI, mostly because he will be stapled to Tavares all year long but the McDavid-Eberle experiment here was basically over. He does need read/react fast enough off McDavid to be effective playing alongside him.

At 40 points here, we likely would get bent over trying to move him in the summer, a team would likely want us to take one of their crap $2-4 million dollar players back, no one is just taking $6 million of salary hit like that anymore.

50 points with Tavares in the East is basically like 35-40 points with RNH on the 2nd line here too, lets be real.

 

[Ninety7]

So trade him after this year then. What was the rush? McDavid's extension doesn't kick in this year. For all his faults Eberle was at least a known commodity. What did we get in return? Another Islanders castoff that they failed to develop properly. You go to the **** well too many times and people are going to wonder what's wrong with you. The best thing we got in this trade was cap space and that's only if they allocate it properly. The right side is a complete mess right now and this trade didn't address either of the team's two biggest needs. It was a completely useless trade that brought in a completely useless player.

If you’re complaining about what we got in return for last years eberle, then I have a feeling you would be complaining even more for what we maybe would have gotten for him after this season, had we kept him. You think this player had any sort of value to any team?

Like I said eberle isn’t the difference between us being a good team and a bad team.

Useless trade I disagree with. Honestly, the only 2 reasons I can see chia doing this trade was either 1. He needed cap space for the future or 2. He wanted a culture change and to cut the crap from our organization

Or both. Your choice I guess.