Speculation: Duchene trade looking back

[tucker3434]

This trade was both bad and good for both sides. Ottawa got the player they wanted without giving up a top tier asset albeit some really good ones. Sakic finally moved his player for a haul of pieces, but not one true blue chip stud or premiere draft pick he was holding out for.

We’ll see where that 1st ends up.

 

[Patagonia]

This trade was both bad and good for both sides. Ottawa got the player they wanted without giving up a top tier asset albeit some really good ones. Sakic finally moved his player for a haul of pieces, but not one true blue chip stud or premiere draft pick he was holding out for.

Sakic had a massive haul from the trade.

You failed to recognize Sakic eye for talent. Ignoring PD was lazy and could have made a deal with the Preds directly. Girard has been tremendous for his age. Kamenev is NHL ready after strong seasons in the AHL. The 2nd is a welcome bonus. Bowers was considered a throw-in and outplaying potentially a Top 5 Pick - Tkachuk. Hammond is a dump. A 1st & 3rd have been very nice surprises and likely high picks, don’t believe anyone could have predicted the Sens collapse having these selections.

Duchene returned 6 prospects and reduced team salaries with the trade. This is a Melnyk type trade, build a team and cut costs. You can believe whatever you want, AVs did very well and the Sens misplayed trades on Turris and Duchene.

 

[HawkeyTalkMan]

Sakic had a massive haul from the trade.

You failed to recognize Sakic eye for talent. Ignoring PD was lazy and could have made a deal with the Preds directly. Girard has been tremendous for his age. Kamenev is NHL ready after strong seasons in the AHL. The 2nd is a welcome bonus. Bowers was considered a throw-in and outplaying potentially a Top 5 Pick - Tkachuk. Hammond is a dump. A 1st & 3rd have been very nice surprises and likely high picks, don’t believe anyone could have predicted the Sens collapse having these selections.

Duchene returned 6 prospects and reduced team salaries with the trade. This is a Melnyk type trade, build a team and cut costs. You can believe whatever you want, AVs did very well and the Sens misplayed trades on Turris and Duchene.

Ok the "sakic eye for talent" line is all fluff until those picks and prospects turn out. Not everything he touches turns to gold. He's been the GM how long and made the playoffs how many times?

Again, most thought Duchene just needed a change of scenery and one way ticket out of Colorado. If Ottawa got the blazing speed, 30 goal, 70 pt center they expected to get, Ottawa isn't looking that bad right now considering nothing they gave up was a home run. Hindsight will always be 20/20 but let's not also forget Duchene just jumped on to the most boring hockey system in the league.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Ottawa next canadian team to move south

Technically, Lebreton is more like moving East rather than South.

 

[Halla]

looking back the avs made out like bandits, the preds got better, and the sens got hosed

this will be duchenes 4th straigh season under 60pts. He isnt a #1C

 

[Halla]

He has 8 points in the last 8 games and for the most part has played very well, meanwhile Turris is going through his own slump production wise. There’s peaks and valleys to every season, but still everyone is so quick to rush to judgement. It’s incredible to watch year after year.

37pts, -16 through 55 games now.

82 game pace: 24g,30a,54pts,-24

Turris last year: 27g,28a,55pts,-3 (78 games)

 

[Halla]

Well, Ottawa keeps there top 10 pick this year which gives us a shot at Dahlin Zadina..ect

and keep White Brown Chabot Chlapik Formenton Batherson Gagne Jaros Englund and Hogberg. Literally didnt take a dent into our current prospect pool

Duchene has been great the past 10 games, better than Turris and much better at even strength - but our team as a whole looks horrible which in turn makes the trade look a hell of a lot worse.

It will all depend on how this pans out - either we sign him to a reasonable deal or flip him next deadline for a good return as well.

Its a lot of B & C assets for a really good player, but hell it is still 7 players for one which is amazing for the Avs

Losing Turris killed us from a leadership perspective, but I personally would not have signed him for 6 years so I am okay with it

probably....and now they need to turn it around to avoid losing a lottery pick next year

 

[1865]

One of the worst trades in NHL history. Ottawa is done for possibly a decade +.

Never has the HF hysteria machine been more perfectly framed in two sentences.

 

[avsfan09]

None of them are game breakers. Top tier is a whole different level than very good. Guys like sergachev are top tier prospects in trades. Not Girard

I think your underestimating how good Girard really is. To be fair, A lot of Avs fans were sceptical of him too until we watched him consistently. Guy has top pairing potential and is already a solid top 4 guy and is steady and poised at just 19. His creativity and smarts really shine.

 

[Ivan13]

Ok the "sakic eye for talent" line is all fluff until those picks and prospects turn out. Not everything he touches turns to gold. He's been the GM how long and made the playoffs how many times?

Again, most thought Duchene just needed a change of scenery and one way ticket out of Colorado. If Ottawa got the blazing speed, 30 goal, 70 pt center they expected to get, Ottawa isn't looking that bad right now considering nothing they gave up was a home run. Hindsight will always be 20/20 but let's not also forget Duchene just jumped on to the most boring hockey system in the league.

So a team that gets an NHL player for a prospect is the automatic winner because using hindsight after the said prospect develops is bad? As it stands right now the Avs got:

• Girard - a top 4 D at 19 years old who looks phenomenal for a kid his age
• Bowers - doing great in NCAA, barely older than one of the top-ranked kids going into next draft (Tkachuk), who is his teammate and trails him in scoring, despite defense being Shane's calling card
• Kamenev - just got back from arm fracture, 4 points in 2 AHL games
• top 10 protected 2018 1st rounder, or unprotected 2019 1st rounder
• Hammond - non factor
• 2nd rounder from Nashville
• 3rd rounder from Ottawa

And your description of Duchene is as optimistic as it gets, he reached those number once in his career. Ottawa gave up a tonne to at best marginally improve their 1st line center position, and we don't need hindsight to conclude that.

 

[Gabe the Babe]

None of them are game breakers. Top tier is a whole different level than very good. Guys like sergachev are top tier prospects in trades. Not Girard

I wouldn’t trade Girard for Sergachev

 

[branch]

Avs fans are talking like next years pick is guaranteed to be top 5. Avs had literally the worst season in recent memory last year and now look competitive. Just think about it people.

 

[Freudian]

Duchene has been Ottawa's second best forward (after Stone) from what I have seen. Even when not scoring at the start there, he was creating a lot of chances. He's a bit streaky but a good player. I don't think you can put Sentators season on him, other than if the trade in itself messed up the confidence the players have in management.

 

[Ivan13]

Avs fans are talking like next years pick is guaranteed to be top 5. Avs had literally the worst season in recent memory last year and now look competitive. Just think about it people.

It's not guaranteed, far from it. But if Sens trade EK and Hoffman, what is more likely, that a team with Ceci as their #1 ends up close to playoff contention, or in the basement? Plus, wherever the pick ends up the Avs did great in the trade.

 

[Silencio]

This is true. However they'll likely only get "Matt Duchene" level value for him. Not the Erik Lindros level value they gave up for him.

First it was Tyler Seguin, and now Shane Bowers is the second coming of Peter Forsberg. And my post was accused of hyperbole...

 

[Ivan13]

First it was Tyler Seguin, and now Shane Bowers is the second coming of Peter Forsberg. And my post was accused of hyperbole...

Yes, Kento's post was alluding Bowers is Peter Forsberg. Nice strawman, you're building here.

 

[Silencio]

Yes, Kento's post was alluding Bowers is Peter Forsberg. Nice strawman, you're building here.

He's making a direct comparison between the Lindros trade and the Duchene trade. Peter Forsberg was the first round prospect given up by Philadelphia in the former trade, Bowers was the first round prospect given up by Ottawa in the latter. Not sure what other conclusion I'm supposed to draw.

 

[Ivan13]

He's making a direct comparison between the Lindros trade and the Duchene trade. Peter Forsberg was a first round prospect given up by Philadelphia, Bowers was a first round prospect given up by Ottawa. Not sure what other conclusion I'm supposed to draw.

So I guess Duchene is Lindros? Or is common sense an alien concept in this scenario?

 

[Silencio]

So I guess Duchene is Lindros? Or is common sense an alien concept in this scenario?

The original post referred to what Ottawa gave up as "Lindros level", so....yes?

 

[Ivan13]

The original post referred to what Ottawa gave up as "Lindros level", so....yes?

So common sense is an alien concept. Lindros-like means a haul that will help the franchise immensely and have impact years down the road, not that any piece of the trade is analogous to a piece from the actual Lindros trade.

 

[Silencio]

So common sense is an alien concept. Lindros-like means a haul that will help the franchise immensely and have impact years down the road, not that any piece of the trade is analogous to a piece from the actual Lindros trade.

If that's the case, Nashville made a Yashin-level trade for Kyle Turris.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

looking back the avs made out like bandits, the preds got better, and the sens got hosed

this will be duchenes 4th straigh season under 60pts. He isnt a #1C

Or, you could say he hit 59 points or greater in 3 of his 8 NHL seasons. Stats are fun. If MD is paired with Hoffman for an entire season, its certainly possible that he'll get another 59+ season, no?

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I dunno.... giving up a 40 point second liner, a middling prospect and a protected 1st round pick seems like a fair price for a true #1 centre just reaching his prime. But time will tell.

Oh man, talk about sipping the kool-aid.


Kyle Turris is a 40 point second liner now despite having put up 58, 64, and 55 point seasons in the last 3 healthy years he's had in the NHL?


And Matt Duchene is a true #1C just entering his prime? Despite having a PPG season 5 seasons ago and never coming close to that kind of production again since?


Duchene barely has 50 points in his last 82 games.

 

[Korpse]

37pts, -16 through 55 games now.

82 game pace: 24g,30a,54pts,-24

Turris last year: 27g,28a,55pts,-3 (78 games)

Excuse me for asking, but hoe exactly does my post relate?

 

[le_sean]

This one sided trade will be even more hilarious when the Avs draft Jack Hughes.